switch loop and undercabinet light question

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Old 03-28-10, 11:56 AM
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switch loop and undercabinet light question

I ran some wires before for my undercabinet lights. I ran a cable with power and left it in crawlspace. I also ran a cable from the switch location and left it in crawlspace. I had planned on using these two cables at the undercabinet light location and make a switch loop. but I am thinking that I am going to use either xenon or LED low voltage. When I checked with the manufacturer (seagull lighting) they said that the transformer can't be used with a switch loop? I can't see where it would matter. As far as appliance is concerned, isn't it the same?

I did see a potential problem though. I don't think the junction box in transfomer would be big enough for two cables. I think it is just designed for one. maybe that is what the problem is with switch loop and the reason the manufacturer said you can't do it? anyway, I was thinking just running another cable from crawlspace up to transformer and make the splices in junction box in crawlspace. see diagram. what do you think?

 
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Old 03-28-10, 12:24 PM
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You mention installing a "power' Cable --- "I ran a cable with power and left it in the crawl space".

One end is in the crawl space; what would this end connect to? ; where is the location of the other end , and what would this end connect to?.

Is the transfomer part of the fixture assembly ?

Where on the Internet can we find info on this product?.
 
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Old 03-28-10, 03:13 PM
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We need more details like what model number luminaire due the reason why with low voltage you will may run into voltage drop issue and with transfomer in basement I have see that pretty often but a nice gotcha you can not use the plain jane lowvoltage wire in the wall you have ot use the NM cable for it unless the LV wire is classifed to use in the wall.

as far for the switch loop I don't really see a major issue with it unless the manufacter stated for some reason but I doubt it.

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 03-28-10, 06:03 PM
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The Seagull Ambiance cannot use a switch loop. You need to have the LV leads going to the fixtures.
 
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Old 03-28-10, 08:24 PM
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I honestly dont see why you cant do this the way you described. The transformer is getting a neutral, ground, and switched hot. Thats all you need. On the secondary side of the trans you will feed your lights.
 
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Old 03-28-10, 08:33 PM
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I took an unswitched cable from a switch junction box in the pantry (which is the room where the undercabinet lights are located) and ran it to crawlspace. so one end is essentially attached to the main panel, via junction box splices. the second cable has one end in a different switch box (the location where I want to switch these lights from) and the other end in crawlspace.

I was planning on having transformer on top of cabinet and running 14/2 from the junction box in crawlspace to the top of cabinet. this is what is shown in diagram. from transformer, you run low voltage lines inside cabinet and out bottom and then run it across the underside. you then push on the xenon bulb assemblies onto the LV wire-they pierce it as you push them on. although after looking at the size of the xenon transformers, maybe french's plan of fransformer in crawlspace would be better. it would be located directly underneath the wall that the LV wires would travel up to reach the bottom of the wall cabinet.

so pcboss, will my drawing not work? I don't understand why-it seems the the transformer would "see" electricity the exact same way in this setup. the hot goes to the crawlspace junction box and then to the switch on black and back on re-identified white to crawlspace. from there it would take black to the transformer and white back to crawlspace junction box and then splice to the original feeder cable's white and back to panel. so no voltage would be seen till the switch was flipped.

here is link to available transformers for xenon. for LED, you have two choices-one for regular LED and one for dimmable LED.

what kinda sucks is that the pantry only has 27" of undercabinet space for the lighting. on each side of this are tall cabinets. but I want the undercabinet lights here switched separately from the main kitchen undercabinet lights. so have to get a second transformer just for this little area-unless someone has another idea?
 
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Old 03-28-10, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
The Seagull Ambiance cannot use a switch loop. You need to have the LV leads going to the fixtures.
PC.,

I do understand the situation however the OP may mention a switch loop on primary side not on secondary side if I am reading this situation correct.

let me know what you think ?

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 03-29-10, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by french277V View Post
PC.,

I do understand the situation however the OP may mention a switch loop on primary side not on secondary side if I am reading this situation correct.

let me know what you think ?

Merci,Marc
Thats the way i understood the drawing. The switch loop is the feed for the transformer. It will work the way the OP has it described.
 
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Old 03-30-10, 09:01 AM
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I thought the OP was bypassing the tranny neutral on the LV side.

To the OP, your switch loop should have the white as the supply to the switch. NEC 200.7.
 
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Old 03-30-10, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
I thought the OP was bypassing the tranny neutral on the LV side.

To the OP, your switch loop should have the white as the supply to the switch. NEC 200.7.
Correct Sir.. ill do my favorite AC DC quote. Back on Black Beer 4U2
 
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Old 03-30-10, 02:06 PM
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OK, so I am OK with what I drew but to be code compliant I have to switch the black and white relabeled black so that the true black is bringing current away from switch. essentially I want the true black to be HOT at the fixture so that someone couldn't reverse white and black at fixture-like if the tape relabeling the white wire were to come off. no big deal. but is it truely needed in my case since the wire isn't going to a fixture (the transformer) but is going to a junction box in crawlspace. Like I said, not a problem to wire as PCBOSS said but for learning I just wondered if necessary in this case. I don't have nec book to see exactly how it is worded. I understand the logic (after finding it in "Wiring Simplified") of doing it the way PCBOSS said.

thanks guys. PCBOSS-have you used the seagull lighting ambiance lighting? used the LED ones at all?
 
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Old 03-30-10, 03:55 PM
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I normally use the Ambiance series of LV undercabinet lights. I am just starting to look into the LED UC lights.

Other LED lights seem to be very blue to me. I want something with a crisp white light and reliable operation.
 
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Old 03-30-10, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
I normally use the Ambiance series of LV undercabinet lights. I am just starting to look into the LED UC lights.

Other LED lights seem to be very blue to me. I want something with a crisp white light and reliable operation.
PC, have you tried the Kichler UC LED lights, they seem to have a very nice white light. Not blue like others.

The innovative leader in decorative light fixtures, lamps, and home accessories
 
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