How to install new electrical panel and new 220 line?

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Old 04-25-10, 02:50 PM
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How to install new electrical panel and new 220 line?

Hello, I need to add a 220 line to my home for a welder and compressor. My 125v panel is fully used. I presume I have to install a new electrical panel with a new breaker for the 220 line. Do I just run two more lines from the power lines to the new panel? How do I turn of the power into the building so I can work safely?

Thanks.
Jim
 
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Old 04-25-10, 03:42 PM
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A few questions:

Do you mean 125 amp?

Where is the welder and compressor going to be? In the house? Attached garage? Detached garage?

What is the rating of the main breaker or fuse that is feeding the main panel of your house? Do not read the label on the panel look at the breaker or fuse. This would also be the thing to use to kill the power to your house. (Although it concerns me that you are going to wire these circuits but do not know how to disconnect power to your home)
 
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Old 04-25-10, 03:48 PM
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I'm sorry to write this but from your questions and statements I gather that you are fairly new to electrical work. I strongly suggest that you purchase the book Wiring Simplified and read it cover-to-cover BEFORE you get yourself into some serious trouble. The book is usually found in the electrical aisles of the home improvement mega-marts but it is rarely found where all the other books and magazines are kept. It is also available on-line from Amazon and probably several other sources.

I'll tell you this much, generally you cannot disconnect all the power in your panel, even by tripping the main circuit breaker there are still "hot" connections. You definitely do NOT want to connect your new wiring to the incoming power conductors. There are "sticky notes" at the top of this category that detail how a "sub-panel" is installed.

Please be careful.
 
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Old 04-25-10, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Tolyn Ironhand View Post
A few questions:

Do you mean 125 amp?

Where is the welder and compressor going to be? In the house? Attached garage? Detached garage?

What is the rating of the main breaker or fuse that is feeding the main panel of your house? Do not read the label on the panel look at the breaker or fuse. This would also be the thing to use to kill the power to your house. (Although it concerns me that you are going to wire these circuits but do not know how to disconnect power to your home)
Well, I'm not going to do anything until I'm sure I understand everything. If I can't get to that point I have an electrician who can do it for me, but this is a rental and I hope to learn to do these things myself. Not worth risking my life for though.

Welder and compressor will be used in the back yard or on the patio. The 220 outlet will be on the back wall (or just inside the patio door would work).

The panel main circuit breaker is a 125 amp breaker.

Thanks
Jim
 
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Old 04-25-10, 04:54 PM
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but this is a rental and I hope to learn to do these things myself
For reasons of both civil and criminal liability you can NOT do this work on property you do not own. Call your landlord and offer to pay the cost of an electrician.
 
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Old 04-25-10, 07:28 PM
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Yup, Ray has it right. You can not do any wiring on a rental. In most cases even the owner can't do any wiring if it is not his residence.
 
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Old 04-25-10, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by furd View Post
I'm sorry to write this but from your questions and statements I gather that you are fairly new to electrical work. I strongly suggest that you purchase the book Wiring Simplified and read it cover-to-cover BEFORE you get yourself into some serious trouble. The book is usually found in the electrical aisles of the home improvement mega-marts but it is rarely found where all the other books and magazines are kept. It is also available on-line from Amazon and probably several other sources.

I'll tell you this much, generally you cannot disconnect all the power in your panel, even by tripping the main circuit breaker there are still "hot" connections. You definitely do NOT want to connect your new wiring to the incoming power conductors. There are "sticky notes" at the top of this category that detail how a "sub-panel" is installed.

Please be careful.
Thanks for the advice. I just ordered it and will look at the sticky. I know I have a lot to learn before I can try this. That's why I'm here.
 
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Old 04-25-10, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Tolyn Ironhand View Post
Yup, Ray has it right. You can not do any wiring on a rental. In most cases even the owner can't do any wiring if it is not his residence.
Sorry for being unclear. I'm the owner of the duplex and I live in the side that I'm putting the 220 outlet in. I'm not sure I'm not supposed to let a licensed electrician do it, but I think by law I can do it on my own residence. I will have my electrician come give it the OK for my peace of mind anyway. But I want to do it myself.

Thanks for the help and trying to keep me legal.

Jim
 
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Old 04-26-10, 08:21 AM
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In many states the owner of a duplex may do electrical work on the property as long as he also lives there. It sounds like you're okay to pull the permit without an electrician.

One other option you should check out is to see if your panel can support tandem breakers (half-size, skinny, mini, quad, etc). You may be able to install the circuit without a new panel if the existing panel can take tandems. What is the make, model and approximate age of the existing panel? How many slots does it have?
 
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Old 04-26-10, 06:13 PM
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In many states the owner of a duplex may do electrical work on the property as long as he also lives there. It sounds like you're okay to pull the permit without an electrician.
There are also some areas that a homeowner can't even pull an electrical permit, it has to be pulled by a license holder. It never hurts to check on the local requirements before you start anything. In some of these areas, the homeowner can, however, take a test and after passing it, can pull his own permit and do his own work.
 
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Old 04-27-10, 07:11 AM
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What are the amperage ratings of the compressor and welder? Check the nameplate to see what size circuits you will need to run.

What is the current load of the main wires? To test this, turn most everything in the house on, especially the A/C, range and dryer if you have electric appliances. Then use a clamp around ammeter on each of the main incoming wires to the panel, careful not to touch. This will give you a reading of how much current flows in your panel at peak usage. If that number + the rating of your compressor and welder is greater than 125 amps, you don't have enough room for those breakers. If new circuits + current full load is around 105A or less, you should be fine to make some room in this panel.

You'll need four breaker spaces. The easiest solution will be to try and find tandem breakers or half breakers for your panel type. If they're available, you can remove existing single breakers and put two in their place, giving extra space for your breakers for the compressor and welder. You'll have to double up 8 circuits if possible. If you don't have that many single pole circuits, you'll probably need to install a subpanel for your welder and compressor.

Most importantly, let your electrician friend hear exactly what you're doing and advise you as to how to do each specific item. Better yet, have him help so you can be sure what you've done doesn't need to be fixed.

Rich
 
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