Do eat-in kitchen outlets need to be on GFCI?

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  #1  
Old 08-07-11, 10:13 AM
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Do eat-in kitchen outlets need to be on GFCI?

I have an eat-in kitchen where there is a dining area and a kitchen area, but no actual physical separation (like a wall) between the two areas. Correct me if I'm wrong in any of these statements, but it's my understanding that eat-in kitchen outlets need to be on a 20 Amp circuit and this circuit can either be dedicated or shared with a countertop 20 Amp appliance circuit. What I'm not sure of is do these outlets need to be GFCI protected?

Right now I'm planning to put two outlets in the eat-in kitchen area on a countertop applience circuit, but am not sure if putting it behind the GFCI is ok or if I should move the GFCI outlet to the beginning of the circuit.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 12:00 PM
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I think the eating areas require AFCI protection. I also wouldn't put the eating area receptacles on the SABC's.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 12:38 PM
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Yes, they need to be GFCI protected (not sure which code you are under, but not likely AFCI). I probably wouldn't put them on the small appliance circuit, because you may be pretty maxed out with appliances already, and the toaster oven you use on the countertop may be a little much.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 05:17 PM
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Assuming you are under the 2008 NEC, I would say the AFCI protection is not required. Dining rooms would require AFCI protection, but you said this is in the kitchen.

(B) Dwelling Unit Circuits. All 15A or 20A, 120V branch
circuits in dwelling units supplying outlets in family rooms,
dining rooms, living rooms, parlors, libraries, dens, bedrooms,
sunrooms, recreation rooms, closets, hallways, or
similar rooms or areas must be protected by a listed AFCI
device of the combination type.
http://www.premierpowerinc.com/docs/...ionProduct.pdf

As far as GFI protection, I don't think it is required since it is no where near the countertops, but that is just my opinion.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 05:23 PM
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CJ, our inspector classifies it as part of the kitchen and since it normally has matching "countertop" surface, he says it is part of the kitchen countertop array, and requires GFCI. Sometimes they are right in front of the kitchen sink, too. No big deal, but he's happy.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 05:31 PM
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All receptacles in kitchens, pantries and eating spaces are required to be part of a small appliance branch circuit and also must have GFCI protection. Check NEC section 210.11 (C) and 210.52 (B)
 
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Old 08-07-11, 05:50 PM
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CJ, our inspector classifies it as part of the kitchen and since it normally has matching "countertop" surface, he says it is part of the kitchen countertop array, and requires GFCI. Sometimes they are right in front of the kitchen sink, too. No big deal, but he's happy.
All receptacles in kitchens, pantries and eating spaces are required to be part of a small appliance branch circuit and also must have GFCI protection. Check NEC section 210.11 (C) and 210.52 (B)
Both points noted. I'll try to remember them both. Thanks guys.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 06:48 PM
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Per 2008 NEC, in residential kitchens, only the receptacles that serve the countertops need GFCI protection. The others donít. Kitchen, dining rms, pantrys, breakfast nooks, and the like are to be served by the 2 or more SABCís. Donít know if it changed in 2011 NEC, but donít think it did.
 
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Old 08-07-11, 08:52 PM
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2011 NEC calls for all residential circuits to be either AFCI or GFCI. There MAY be a very few exceptions but the SABCs are not one of them.
 
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Old 08-08-11, 03:46 AM
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Talk about an industry led regulatory body!! Instead of selling 4 per house (bedrooms), they are selling 40 per house. Nice profit margin. Wonder if there's a "donation" made to the NFPA
 
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Old 08-08-11, 08:51 AM
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Talk about an industry led regulatory body!! Instead of selling 4 per house (bedrooms), they are selling 40 per house. Nice profit margin. Wonder if there's a "donation" made to the NFPA
Then if they even do what they're supposed to. $50X40 = $2,000.
 
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Old 08-08-11, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by chandler View Post
Talk about an industry led regulatory body!! Instead of selling 4 per house (bedrooms), they are selling 40 per house. Nice profit margin. Wonder if there's a "donation" made to the NFPA
Exactly! That's also why some municipalities have amended the NEC as they have adopted newer versions and have been excluding additional requirements such as the extra AFCIs, tamperproof receptacles and weather resistant GFIs. I think these are some good things to have in a new home, but the additional requirements are adding substantial cost to a new home while the market is down.
 
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Old 08-09-11, 09:24 AM
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Your estimate is a little high Justin, but it is a valid point about increased cost. Dedicated circuits, garages, outdoor, kitchen, bath and 240V circuits do not require AFCI breakers so it it less than 40 AFCI breakers to buy -- some where more like 12. But still it works out to about $500 just in AFCI breakers. My figure is that NEC2008 adds about $500-$1000 to the total bid price for an average new home (...not that any are being built anyway...) once you figure in the AFCI and all the requirements too.

Now the real question is how much less likely these homes are to burn down and shock people. That won't be known for decades, so it might be a good deal, might not.

To get back to the original question, yes an eat-in kitchen needs all receptacles GFCI protected* and powered by one of the SABCs.

* in my area they have been enforcing this in some of the cities. I did review NEC 210.8(A)(6) and based on the national code with no amendments, only the countertops need GFCI protection. Other kitchen receptacles do not need GFCI protection, but they do need to be powered from a 20A small-appliance branch circuit [see art. referenced by Furd].
 

Last edited by ibpooks; 08-09-11 at 01:17 PM. Reason: added information
  #14  
Old 08-10-11, 03:02 AM
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Originally Posted by CasualJoe View Post
Exactly! That's also why some municipalities have amended the NEC as they have adopted newer versions and have been excluding additional requirements such as the extra AFCIs, tamperproof receptacles and weather resistant GFIs. I think these are some good things to have in a new home, but the additional requirements are adding substantial cost to a new home while the market is down.
We're still on 2002 Code in most counties here!
 
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