sub panel for diy rv wiring ....

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Old 08-23-11, 10:28 AM
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sub panel for diy rv wiring ....

hello n00b here and with 120vac ....

i am installing a panel in my diy rv van ....

GE 125 Amp Outdoor Load Center ThermoPlastic

i will have a 30 amp plug in but sometimes i will be using a 15 amp source ....

i need to run 110 air conditioner and battery bank charger etc. at the same time ....

the panel has a combo neutral ground so i bought a seperate ground kit ....

not sure how to wire it ....





blkjak .... thanks very much in advance for help ....
 
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Old 08-23-11, 04:37 PM
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Neutral bar is isolated. Ground bar is bonded to box and vehicle. You need to install a thirty amp inlet (male) with an in-use cover on the outside of the RV. You can buy ready made 30a to 15a adapters which would allow you to plug a 30a cord into a 15a receptacle.

The arrow in your picture is pointing to one of the hots not the neutral. The neutral is the screw below it. This is a 240v panel but you are going to use 120v correct? The panel will have to be adapted for 120v or you can just energize half the available positions.
 

Last edited by ray2047; 08-24-11 at 11:49 AM. Reason: Bad advice removed.
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Old 08-23-11, 04:43 PM
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thanks for help ....

is my wiring intentions in the panel correct .... see arrows

blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-23-11, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by blkjak View Post
thanks for help ....

is my wiring intentions in the panel correct .... see arrows

blkjak ....
No. See my post above.

.......
 
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Old 08-23-11, 07:05 PM
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whoa .... missed that ....

"you would install a 30a 240v breaker and install a #10 jumper between the two poles"

the 30a 240v breaker would go in the first slot above the 2 power screws?

the #10 jumper would go on the 2 power hot screws?

the neutral feed wire would go on the lower bus bar lug?
the upper bus bar is the abandoned ground bus?

blkjak .... thanks i am no use to dealing with things that are new to me ....
 
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Old 08-23-11, 08:09 PM
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STOP Not sure your panel is usable for what you want to do. Wait for the pros. It is a 240 only panel based on the diagram, not 120/240. Didn't read the diagram before, sorry. I'm not sure I am looking at a neutral bar. Is there another diagram that says "3 wire" instead of "2 wire".

 

Last edited by ray2047; 08-23-11 at 08:25 PM.
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Old 08-23-11, 08:25 PM
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i understand now .... missed that .....

can not find the panel i need for what i want to do ....

can someone recommend the appropriate panel and place to purchase ...

thank you very much for helping me .... blkjak
 
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Old 08-23-11, 09:20 PM
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Please wait for the pros.
 
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Old 08-23-11, 09:37 PM
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That's a strange panel for GE. Where did you get it? How old is it? The diagram is a lot like a 3 phase Grounded "B" diagram, but the diagram is clearly identified as single phase. I didn't even know GE made 240 VAC 2 pole plug-in breakers. Does the label indicate what Type GE breakers to use? Are there any other diagrams on the label that indicate 120/240 VAC 3 wire?
 
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Old 08-23-11, 09:52 PM
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That's a strange panel for GE. Where did you get it? How old is it? The diagram is a lot like a 3 phase Grounded "B" diagram, but the diagram is clearly identified as single phase. I didn't even know GE made 240 VAC 2 pole plug-in breakers. Does the label indicate what Type GE breakers to use? Are there any other diagrams on the label that indicate 120/240 VAC 3 wire?
There are a number of those panels in my area. I have never seen how they're wired inside, though.

Looking at the wiring diagram, the left bar is the neutral and the right bar is ground.

How many circuts do you want to use? Do you already have the breakers?
 
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Old 08-23-11, 11:19 PM
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Justin, the problem is you have to follow manufacturers instructions. The instructions say 240v breakers only. The left bar is not labeled neutral and does not look like it is on insulators. The digram says clearly "2 wire only".
 
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Old 08-23-11, 11:24 PM
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Originally Posted by ray2047 View Post
Justin, the problem is you have to follow manufacturers instructions. The instructions say 240v breakers only. The left bar is not labeled neutral and does not look like it is on insulators. The digram says clearly "2 wire only".
I am really beginning to wonder what this panel was intended for then,
 
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Old 08-24-11, 03:29 AM
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thanks for help .... reply to "casualjoe"

just bought the panel .... lowes and home depot has them ....

wanted 4 - 15 amp breakers source will be sometimes ....
30a rv park .... 110 anywhere .... sometimes generator ....

could not find help anywhere but here ....

will have cut sheet later today and will post the breaker type specifyed .... could not find cut sheet on line .... i could try to take pics of it ....

i can return panel and buy an appropriate one if i new which one to buy all rv panels are combo 120 - 12 volt with inverter which i do not want ....

some pics of panel ....









thanks ....blkjak
 
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Old 08-24-11, 03:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Justin Smith View Post
There are a number of those panels in my area. I have never seen how they're wired inside, though.
Looking at the wiring diagram, the left bar is the neutral and the right bar is ground.
How many circuts do you want to use? Do you already have the breakers?
thanks for help ....

i would like to have four circuits but can go with two ....

i did not buy breakers yet ....

blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 03:56 AM
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about me and my van ....

hello everyone ....

thought i would everyone helping me; a little about me and my new home "my van" ....

i am all of a sudden 70 years old ....

i am living on a small wartime veterans pension .... they deduct ss from it ....

running out of life savings ....

my plans are to camp for the rest of my time ....

will be living in east tennessee mountains summer time ans s.w. florida in the winter time ....

will be open camping during the week and in state park parks on weekends ....

the state parks are around $12 + a day with hot showers and 30a hook up ....

my stealth [so i can sleep without paying in cities] camper van home .... pics











blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 06:53 AM
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I think any small panel from Square D or Cutler-Hammer would suit your needs. You do not need an outdoor rated panel if it is installed inside the van.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 07:19 AM
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Is the bar on the left on plastic stand offs?
 
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Old 08-24-11, 07:37 AM
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Just for reference this is what the inside of a typical main lug panel looks like.



Because of cost I'd go with a 100 amp GE main lug. There would be enough spaces on one of the hot buses you would not have to use the second hot bus at all. That would avoid having to tie the two buses together. Imagine the above picture without the red wire. That would be your hook up.

P.S.
i am living on a small wartime veterans pension .... they deduct ss from it
Went SS at 62. VA kicks in next year but because they think I'm getting rich on SS it will be small. Sure know where your coming from. Wishing you luck on where your going.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 07:46 AM
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I think the label might be wrong. The wiring diagram shows 120 volt tandems. Also look at the pic of the wired panel.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 07:50 AM
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Not that is may be germane to the OPs situation, but it looks like the bond screw is installed in the panel pic posted by Ray. Not that familiar with GE panels.

It also looks like there is no connector on the greenfield flex in the lower left corner.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
Not that is may be germane to the OPs situation, but it looks like the bond screw is installed in the panel pic posted by Ray.
Yes that was only a generalized picture to give the OP an idea of what to look for. Blkjak as PCboss says the neutral bond screw would be removed. The ground bar shown on the right would not be included. It is a separate purchase usually.
Not that familiar with GE panels.
I like them for cost and availability of breakers. I can't really comment on long term reliability but I think they would be fine for intended use.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by CasualJoe View Post
Does the label indicate what Type GE breakers to use? Are there any other diagrams on the label that indicate 120/240 VAC 3 wire?
info on panel cover only ....





blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
I think any small panel from Square D or Cutler-Hammer would suit your needs. You do not need an outdoor rated panel if it is installed inside the van.
thanks for the help .... blkjak
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by ray2047 View Post
Is the bar on the left on plastic stand offs?
metal original ground and neutral bars are connected ....

i purchased a seperate ground bar to be installed ....



blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:42 AM
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Ok. So you want 4 circuts. Here's what I would do:
SquareD (and probably Cutler-Hammer) makes an 8-space panel. You would energize one of the 2 hot lugs, connect the white to the neutral lug and install a ground bar. You would then use every other breaker space. Since you have less than 6 disconnects, you don't need a main breaker.



Nice camper!!!
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by blkjak View Post
info on panel cover only ....




blkjak ....
You can use this panel. The note is an additional condition if only 240 volt loads are used.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ray2047 View Post
Just for reference this is what the inside of a typical main lug panel looks like.

Because of cost I'd go with a 100 amp GE main lug. There would be enough spaces on one of the hot buses you would not have to use the second hot bus at all. That would avoid having to tie the two buses together. Imagine the above picture without the red wire. That would be your hook up.
thanks .... srarting to get the picture .....

so with the panel could i ....



blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:54 AM
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Yes. Be sure the neutral bar isn't bonded.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
I think the label might be wrong. The wiring diagram shows 120 volt tandems. Also look at the pic of the wired panel.
so 2 tandem breakers would work .... ?

blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
Not that is may be germane to the OPs situation, but it looks like the bond screw is installed in the panel pic posted by Ray. Not that familiar with GE panels.

It also looks like there is no connector on the greenfield flex in the lower left corner.
so the bond screw would be removed ro isolate the ground ????

blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by ray2047 View Post
Yes that was only a generalized picture to give the OP an idea of what to look for. Blkjak as PCboss says the neutral bond screw would be removed. The ground bar shown on the right would not be included. It is a separate purchase usually. I like them for cost and availability of breakers. I can't really comment on long term reliability but I think they would be fine for intended use.
thanks .... ray .... blkjak
 
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Old 08-24-11, 10:04 AM
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A tandem breaker would work or you could install 2 single pole breakers and leave one space between them to allow for the dead buss in the panel.

The label should show the location of the bond screw or strap. It should not be installed.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Justin Smith View Post
Ok. So you want 4 circuts. Here's what I would do:
SquareD (and probably Cutler-Hammer) makes an 8-space panel. You would energize one of the 2 hot lugs, connect the white to the neutral lug and install a ground bar. You would then use every other breaker space. Since you have less than 6 disconnects, you don't need a main breaker.
Nice camper!!!
thanks justin .... prolly the way i will go .... glad you like my camper ....

blkjak ....
 
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Old 08-24-11, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by pcboss View Post
A tandem breaker would work or you could install 2 single pole breakers and leave one space between them to allow for the dead buss in the panel.

The label should show the location of the bond screw or strap. It should not be installed.
will do .... thanks .... blkjak
 
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Old 08-24-11, 11:36 AM
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It looks to me (from the pictures) like that enclosure is made from plastic. If that is true there will be no bond between the neutral and the enclosure but there should be instructions to bond the neutral and the equipment grounding bus in the upper right-hand corner. The separately purchased ground bar kit is not needed.

What I would do is connect the two main lugs ("hot" lugs) together with an appropriately sized piece of wire, probably no smaller than #4. Then I would use a 30 ampere single pole circuit breaker with a hold-down as an incoming main breaker. That would allow all spaces to be utilized.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by blkjak View Post
so the bond screw would be removed ro isolate the ground ????
Yes.

Furd's suggestion:
I would ... connect the two main lugs ("hot" lugs) together with an appropriately sized piece of wire, probably no smaller than #4. Then I would use a 30 ampere single pole circuit breaker with a hold-down as an incoming main breaker. That would allow all spaces to be utilized.
Is better, safer then mine at the beginning of the thread and wouldn't cost much.
 
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Old 08-24-11, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Furd View Post
It looks to me (from the pictures) like that enclosure is made from plastic. If that is true there will be no bond between the neutral and the enclosure but there should be instructions to bond the neutral and the equipment grounding bus in the upper right-hand corner. The separately purchased ground bar kit is not needed.

What I would do is connect the two main lugs ("hot" lugs) together with an appropriately sized piece of wire, probably no smaller than #4. Then I would use a 30 ampere single pole circuit breaker with a hold-down as an incoming main breaker. That would allow all spaces to be utilized.
thanks for info .... blkjak
 
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Old 08-24-11, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ray2047 View Post
Yes.

Furd's suggestion: Is better, safer then mine at the beginning of the thread and wouldn't cost much.
thanks ray sounds good.... blkjak

 
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Old 08-24-11, 01:41 PM
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See Furd's answer below and don't forget the hold down. You may have to get it from an electrical supply house.
 

Last edited by ray2047; 08-24-11 at 03:55 PM. Reason: Missed mistake on picture.
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Old 08-24-11, 02:19 PM
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Sorry, Ray, but he has it wrong.

You cannot put two wires under a single screw as you show with the incoming "hot" and jumper to the upper main lug. The incoming hot MUST go to the 30 ampere circuit breaker and the two main lugs will have a jumper between them. That jumper must be of a minimum size and that size should be listed on the panel cover as the minimum size wire for the main lugs. #4 minimum size is typical for a 125 ampere panel
 
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