Moving a main panel

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  #1  
Old 09-21-11, 07:33 PM
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Moving a main panel

I am putting a bathroom in my house however the only place i can put it happens to be right where the main electrical panel is in the house. I want to move my main panel about 6' farther down the wall which will leave in in the bedroom. My problem is that I have 2 sub panels in the house....1 for my pool that is 75' away and one in my garage.
The sub in the garage is not an issue because i am moving the main panel in the direction toward the garage. All i have to do is cut the wire going to the garage and make is shorter. The feed to the sub for the pool is going in the oposite direction of the panel. In other words the wires will not be long enough to reach the main in its new location. The pool sub is fed with three #8 copper wires and a ground for a total of 4 conductors. They are all run through 1" plastic conduit under ground to the back of my shed where the sub is. I can not replace these wires as I will not be able to pull new wires through the conduit. (at least im not willing to try it) My question is can I make a splice box for the feeds to the sub or are they required to be a home run? I can make the splice box accessable in its permanant location so that is not an issue.
Also, when i move the main panel, I am going to run a new 4/0 wire back to the meter pan and run it along the outside of the house. It will be approximately 6' along the outside of the house before it comes through the wall and immediately in to the main panel.
So my second question is can i run the 4/0 seu through the block foundation with a plastic sleave or does it have to go through the house above the sill plate?
I did all of the electric on the house when it was built 20 years ago with no problem. I had no problem with the inspections however my county does not allow this any longer for main service.
Third question is: I have about 10 curcuits that will also need to be extended. They are all 110v with the exception of one that feeds my A/C unit. I want to splice them as well with a splice box that will also remain accessable. Can these be done all in one large splice box or do they need to be in seperate boxes?
To recap, my three questions are:
1. Can I splice the 4 wires that feed my pool sub panel with a splice box that will be inside the house and remain accessable?

2. Can i run the service entrance through the block foundation with a plastic sleave?

3. Can I splice the remaining curcuits (lighting, dishwasher, A/C) all in one box if it is properly sized?

Thanks in advance
 
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Old 09-21-11, 08:11 PM
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If it is on an exterior wall couldn't you just switch it to outside instead of moving it?

Welcome to the forums. Everybody is glad to help but could you help us by using proper formatting when writing posts. I gave up trying to read your entire post because of the lack of paragraphs.
 
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Old 09-22-11, 05:22 AM
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I agree with Ray. I have seen exterior breaker panels in use in cities like Denver. I guess it is not too uncommon. Consider one thing, if you move the breaker panel, all the wiring will need to be redone from its origin, especially the feeder lines. In addition, if you move the panel away from the meter base, you will probably need to install a disconnect anyway, so why not just turn the panel to the outside wall and make it weather proof.
 
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Old 09-22-11, 07:56 AM
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Here exterior breaker panels are the norm.
 
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Old 09-22-11, 08:04 AM
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Is it possible to rearrange the room configuration? It may save a considerable amount of work.
 
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Old 09-22-11, 09:04 AM
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Exterior main is not legal where i am

there is no disconnect required between the meter and and the main as long as as the main panel is located immediately after the feed enters the buildings. I can run as far as i need to between the meter and main panel without a disconnect as long as the feed wire remains on the outside of the house.

The work in not an issue for me, im just wondering about the splice in the feed to the sub. That is my biggest issue.
 
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Old 09-22-11, 10:38 AM
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A splice is legal in the subpanel feed as long as it in is in a reasonable sized, accessible junction box and you use wire connections that are rated for the size of wire you're splicing. With #8s you can use the biggest size wirenut, but I would prefer to use a mechanical connection like a split bolt to get a much more secure splice. After splicing, wrap the bolt in friction tape and insulating tape to seal it up good.

By the way, the project you're proposing is a lot of work and expense. If you're up to it, then go ahead, but I'd look at every other alternative before completely redoing the service. Are you certain that exterior panels are banned in your location? That seems absurd from a code point of view. You will also probably have a lot of extra expense when you move the main because it will be considered a completely new or upgraded service by the permitting authority. That means new grounding system, AFCI breakers, demand load calc (perhaps larger panel), etc.
 
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Old 09-22-11, 12:03 PM
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It is already a 200 amp service. so thats not an issue. I cant put the outdoor panel, that i am sure of. They dont allow it as per the building inspector. At least not for a main panel. The only expense involved is two splice boxes a few feet of 14/3, a few feet of 12/3 , some #4 copper to redo the ground and 8' of 4/0 service entrance wire. When i put my pool in a few years back, i put a new panel and meter pan in.
There really is no other alternative as if i want to put the bathroom someplace else i will have to break up the concrete floor. I cant leave the panel in the bathroom that is a complete no-no.
Its a days work and 150.00. Believe it or not, it is the best alternative.
My only other question is can i run the service entrance through a block wall with a plastic sleave?
 
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Old 09-22-11, 12:28 PM
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Yes you can, but I would do 2" PVC conduit between the meter and the panel and pull individual #4/0 XHHW aluminum conductors since you need to buy new wire anyway. No matter how well you sleeve it, seal it up, etc SE cable will eventually wick water and leak through the block wall.

Check with your local authority to see if you will need to comply with code for AFCI breakers in the new panel and which NEC version. If your area requires the latest code, that adds about $35 for each light and receptacle circuits to living spaces.

To address your final question, all the splices can be in one big box; or you can break them up into separate boxes if you choose. The only stipulation is that all of the grounds entering and exiting the box must be splices together and to the box if it is metal. If using one large box the best way to do this would be to buy a ground bar and drill/tap holes in the box to mount it so you can easily land all the grounds. Make sure to keep neutrals from different circuits separate and matched up with the appropriate hot. That can get confusing in a busy box, I would use wire markers marking both the hot and neutral with the corresponding breaker number in the panel.
 
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