Wiring electrical to new shed

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  #1  
Old 01-18-12, 05:06 PM
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Wiring electrical to new shed

I have a new 12 x 20 shed that I am wanting to run power to. I'm looking to keep it as low cost as possible. I really do not know much about electrical work other than wiring lights, fans, outlets, etc. I have a mobile home running off a power pole. There is an central air unit, inground pool pump, and pool cleaner also powered from the pole. The shed is approximately 150' from the pole as well. I'm wondering what wiring would be sufficient to run from pole to shed. I would like to install a few outlets and a light in the shed, along with 2 flood lights outside of it. I would like to have the ability to run a air compressor, power tools, and possibly a small welder as well. Any advice is welcome. My thoughts were to run a service wire from pole to shed using a sub panel in shed. i just have no ides what size wire, breakers, etc. Thanks in advance.
 
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  #2  
Old 01-18-12, 05:31 PM
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My thoughts were to run a service wire from pole to shed using a sub panel in shed. i just have no ides what size wire, breakers, etc. Thanks in advance.
A 60amp feed from the pole to a 100 amp subpanel in the shed would probably be enough. You could use PVC conduit buried 18" with three #6 THWN wires for hot (black), hot (black), neutral (white) and a #10 bare or green for ground.

Without knowing compressor size or welder size and if they would be used at the same time that is just a guess.
 
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Old 01-18-12, 06:18 PM
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What size is your current service?
 
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Old 01-18-12, 06:32 PM
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There is a 200a main on the pole. IT has a 60a coming in the house, 40a running central air, 30a running pool pump, and 30a running pool cleaner. As far as air compressor size, it would be approximately 20 - 30 gallon compressor, and just a small 120 volt welder for small welding tasks. Hope this helps. If any further info is needed just let me know. thanks
 
  #5  
Old 01-18-12, 07:22 PM
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This is the wire I was considering after some research. Its 2-2-2 aluminum service wire. http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&productId=202316485&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&ci_sku=202316485&ci_src=14110944&cm_mmc=shopping-_-googlebase-_-D27X-_-202316485&locStoreNum=6349"] 200 ft. Gray 2/2/2 SEU Cable-13088002 at The Home Depot
I know alot of people do not like to use aluminum but I have used it on 2 prior homes with success. There is no metal anywhere and am planning on using pvc conduit. Does the conduit actually matter if it is normal pvc or does it have to be the gray pvc for some reason. I am planning on running pvc water when we run the electric. Would that wire be acceptable or is it not the right type?
 

Last edited by ray2047; 01-18-12 at 07:41 PM. Reason: Fix link but not successful
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Old 01-18-12, 07:36 PM
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Its 2-2-2 aluminum service wire.... Would that wire be acceptable or is it not the right type?
You need 4 wires by modern code even with no metallic pathways. Aluminum would be fine. It is often used for this purpose.
 

Last edited by ray2047; 01-18-12 at 07:54 PM.
  #7  
Old 01-18-12, 07:41 PM
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You need 4 wires by modern code even with no metallic pathways. Aluminum would be fine. It is often used for this purpose.
Would a separate ground wire from a ground rod be considered the 4th wire or would it be something different?
 
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Old 01-18-12, 07:53 PM
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Would a separate ground wire from a ground rod be considered the 4th wire or would it be something different?
Ground wire must originate at the source panel. it provides a reliable low resistance path to clear shorts. Ground rods are primarily to bleed off atmospheric electrical charges.
 
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Old 01-18-12, 10:10 PM
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Would be nice to no more about the compressor (Actual HP, and voltage selection 240 or 120).
That #2 copper would be a waste of money—unless you can afford it. A #2 Al is idea—as mentioned, but it is only good for 90 amps (Not including VD).
 
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Old 01-19-12, 06:08 AM
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I don't actually have the compressor yet. I have 2 small ones but wanted to have the power done before I bought a descent one to put in there. It would be 120 volt, and most that I have looked at are between 1.3 and 1.8 HP. Around 13.5 amps.
 
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Old 01-19-12, 09:17 AM
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The SE-U cannot be used underground.
 
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Old 01-19-12, 09:20 AM
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You need to take all 4 wires out to the outbuilding.

You will also run a conductor to the ground rod or rods from the outbuilding panel.
 
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Old 01-19-12, 01:32 PM
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If your plans aren’t to go over what you expect to use electrically, then at least using a #2 Alum will give you room to upgrade to 90A if you have to. I didn’t even see that you posted SEU. You will need URD (Or correctly known as USE) conductors for your run. Since the conductors are larger than #6, you can use a quadruplex and re-identify the the smallest conductor green using electrical tape (If the quadruplex manufacture hasn’t already identified the equipment grounding conductor). Note: Re-identification must be done at each termination or splice point. You should iD this conductor immediately before burial. This way you want hook-up the wrong conductors. Or just use triplex and a single #8 bare copper conductor. Note: All conductors must stay together in the ground, or in conduit. If you plan to go with triplex, and the single bare copper conductor, I would put an outdoor rated tie-rap on the conductor every 20 feet, to make sure they stay together (Some may disagree with this).
 
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Old 01-19-12, 05:31 PM
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Please read article 250.32 of the national electrical code (nfpa 70)
this will explain the proper way for feeding detached buildings.
You do not want paralleled paths for neutral current !!
 
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Old 01-19-12, 07:19 PM
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Would a separate ground wire from a ground rod be considered the 4th wire or would it be something different?
In your case, this is what I would use.

Mobile Home Feeder
 
  #16  
Old 01-19-12, 08:15 PM
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Please read article 250.32 of the national electrical code (nfpa 70)
this will explain the proper way for feeding detached buildings.
You do not want paralleled paths for neutral current !!
@Fatbuoy, who are you asking to read the NEC 250.32. If me, why, or explain why? I’m here to learn too
 
  #17  
Old 01-20-12, 05:32 AM
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I appreciate all of the help. I found mobile home supply line at lowes for a descent price. I do have one more question though. The wire is 2-2-2-4. They have it with just the 4 wires and they have the same wires in a gray jacket. Would either work? I didnt know if the gray jacket type could be used underground without conduit. It is about. 30 cent a foot cheaper than the same wire without a jacket.
 
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Old 01-20-12, 06:01 AM
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That would depend on how the cable is labeled. If you tell us what the label says more info can be given.
 
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Old 01-20-12, 06:27 PM
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The wire is 2-2-2-4. They have it with just the 4 wires and they have the same wires in a gray jacket. Would either work? I didnt know if the gray jacket type could be used underground without conduit.
That sounds like SER cable which is not approved for direct burial. I wouldn't try to pull it into an underground conduit either. Like pcboss says, tell us what label on the cable says.
 
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Old 01-20-12, 06:50 PM
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The NEC has eliminated the option to run a 3 wire feeder to a subpanel in a detached structure.
 
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Old 01-21-12, 05:24 PM
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Sorry for not posting in a couple days. Had a different electrical issue when I woke up today. Smoke detector shorted out and melted part of the wire and cap and lost all electricity in a bedroom. Took a little while but tracked the issue down and got it fixed. However I forgot to look at the wire to see what kind it was while at lowes today. I'm pretty sure it is SER but not 100% positive. Is there a reason why it was suggested to not pull it through conduit?
 
  #22  
Old 01-21-12, 05:40 PM
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I'd use 2-2-2-4 USE.

:morecharacters:
 
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Old 01-21-12, 05:44 PM
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Is it dual rated SER/SEU? If not as Joe told you SER is not rated for underground use.
 
  #24  
Old 01-21-12, 05:58 PM
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Individual conductors are much easier to pull into a conduit. A cable does not flex as easily.
 
  #25  
Old 01-22-12, 07:59 AM
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The mobile home feeder is rated for direct burial, but could be pulled into conduit, however, the natural twisting of the mobile home feeder makes it a bit more difficult to pull into conduit then separate conductors. The twisting is done at the factory intentionally to make it easier to handle in direct burial applications. If you are concerned about price and definitely using conduit, you might try looking for individual pieces of aluminum Type XHHW to pull into conduit to make up your 2-2-2-4. You'll probably have to go to a supply house to find it.
 
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