Service Upgrade - Q's about install and NEC Codes

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  #1  
Old 02-23-12, 05:36 PM
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Question Service Upgrade - Q's about install and NEC Codes

Hello everyone, me and Fiance just purchased a house here in PA and it needs some work Would greatly appreciate some guidance as i post questions int his thread as i go. I do know PA has adopted the 2008 NEC and has voted NO to adopt latest revisions for at least 3 years(2015) possibly 6 years(2018).
So all work done by me must at least meet 2008 NEC.

Going to start by replacing the aged 60 amp fused service with:

200 amp QO panel.

2/0 Copper service wire cut to length.

New 200 amp meter box.

gfci receptacle on first branch in kitchen.

required breakers.(*1)

2" service weather head & conduit.(*2)

grounding rods(*3)



Want to do this as quick and painless as possible and writing down a list of stuff to purchase, most stuff will be purchased at HomeDepot or lowes or ace etc.

Current Questions:
(*1) Do i need afci breakers for wall receptacles in my new panel or not since it is just a panel upgrade and no new circuitry was done at time of panel upgrade?

(*2a) Conduit. Galvanized metal or PVC schedule 80? none on home right now.

(*2b) Do i need to run conduit through wall? / through wall attached to panel? weather-head height?
Thoughts/examples/pics here would be sweet!

(*3) Ground rods. use two? what is it again 6' apart min? or is it within 6' of meter box/disconnect(can't remember). #4 bare copper?

(*3a) Do i need to ground my gas pipe and water pipe to my panel?


Thinks that all the questions i have for now(forgetful lol). I'll take pics friday (24th) of what im replacing.
Thanks.
 
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  #2  
Old 02-23-12, 06:26 PM
Justin Smith's Avatar
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Location: Cressona, Pa, USA
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(*1) Do i need afci breakers for wall receptacles in my new panel or not since it is just a panel upgrade and no new circuitry was done at time of panel upgrade?

Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/ne...#ixzz1nG4ACTwj
No.
(*2a) Conduit. Galvanized metal or PVC schedule 80? none on home right now.

Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/ne...#ixzz1nG4Imw4I
You can use any of those listed, or type SE cable.

(*2b) Do i need to run conduit through wall? / through wall attached to panel? weather-head height?
Thoughts/examples/pics here would be sweet!

Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/ne...#ixzz1nG4VWs2w
If you use conduit, yes.
(*3) Ground rods. use two? what is it again 6' apart min? or is it within 6' of meter box/disconnect(can't remember). #4 bare copper?

Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/ne...#ixzz1nG4eQCHX
2, 6' apart 8' deep, with #4 CU conductors.
(*3a) Do i need to ground my gas pipe and water pipe to my panel?

Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/ne...#ixzz1nG4yFahw
Yes for the water, I'm unsure of the gas. (we don't have gas here in the skook)
 
  #3  
Old 02-23-12, 07:41 PM
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Want to do this as quick and painless as possible and writing down a list of stuff to purchase, most stuff will be purchased at HomeDepot or lowes or ace etc.

Current Questions:
(*1) Do i need afci breakers for wall receptacles in my new panel or not since it is just a panel upgrade and no new circuitry was done at time of panel upgrade?

(*2a) Conduit. Galvanized metal or PVC schedule 80? none on home right now.

(*2b) Do i need to run conduit through wall? / through wall attached to panel? weather-head height?
Thoughts/examples/pics here would be sweet!

(*3) Ground rods. use two? what is it again 6' apart min? or is it within 6' of meter box/disconnect(can't remember). #4 bare copper?

(*3a) Do i need to ground my gas pipe and water pipe to my panel?


Thinks that all the questions i have for now(forgetful lol). I'll take pics friday (24th) of what im replacing.
Thanks.
#1=I agree with Justin. Yet, it is always smart to check with the authority having jurisdiction (AHJ), or an electrical inspector.
#2a: Depends on the install, and the AHJ. Example: If the overhead mast needs to go through the roof, then you may be required to install RMC.
#2b: Again it depends on the install, and AHJ. Some areas require a main to be attached on the outside of the structure. If this is so, you may be able to install SER. In our state, PVC, or Metal conduit is required, if a main isnít installed ahead of the panel. Height will depend on the AHJ (Serving utility company). My opinion: This job is typically not a DIYer job.
#3 Installing two is best, but not required. In a nut shall, use two ground rods. Distance apart will depend on the AHJ. If you are strictly NEC, then 6 ft apart will due. A #6 copper to the rods is required for your specific install. Note: Iím not hitting on all topics of grounding, but just note that the easiest supplemental electrode in your case is the two rods. These rods will supplement a metal underground water pipe. If the water pipe is your choseówhich most choose-then the pipe must be in direct contact with earth for 10ft or more. You shall attach to this pipe on a section that is no more than 5ft from the point of entrance into the structure (Meaning: Attach a #4 copper conductoróusing a grounding clamp-- to the metal cold water pipe at the point of entrance inside the house. The attached grounding electrode conductor must not be attached no more than 5 feet from where the cold water pipe enters the house). Note: This information will depend on the type of plumbing you haveórather metal, or PVC. Note: This is only touching on a couple things related to grounding, and bonding.
#3a: Yes and No. We normally do. We also bond waste water pipes. But it depends on your AHJ.
In a nut shell, you need to address your questions to an electrical inspector and the AHJ.
Maybe someone will chime-in to pickup anything I left out. Justin also gave good info.
 
  #4  
Old 02-23-12, 08:03 PM
Tolyn Ironhand's Avatar
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2b: In our state you can either use IMC (or RMC but that is overkill) if it extends above the roof line or IMC/PVC if it doesn't. Cable strapped to the side of the house is not allowed.

Your height will depend on a few things of your service drop. The lowest point of the drip loop can only be is 10'. The closet it may be to a platforms or windows is 3' unless the service cables from the pole is above the window.

We have never had to install 2 ground rods except when there is no water service in the building. As mentioned, your water pipe is your main ground. The ground rod is supplemental. You may install two if you want.

Around here gas pipe is never directly bonded to the grounding system. However, is it likely indirectly grounded through the equipment it serves.

Since you still have a 60 amp service you may have to have the power company change your service drop.
 
  #5  
Old 02-23-12, 08:52 PM
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(*3) Ground rods. use two? what is it again 6' apart min? or is it within 6' of meter box/disconnect(can't remember). #4 bare copper?

2, 6' apart 8' deep, with #4 CU conductors.
You never need CU ground wire any larger than #6 to a ground rod.
 
  #6  
Old 02-25-12, 08:07 AM
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A few pics of the outside of the house and the panel would help.

The height of the service varies based on what the overhead cables from the pole need to cross. Above a road or driveway is higher than a back yard.
 
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