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Existing 3 prong oven outlet converted to hardwire for wall oven?

Existing 3 prong oven outlet converted to hardwire for wall oven?

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  #1  
Old 05-02-12, 01:16 PM
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Existing 3 prong oven outlet converted to hardwire for wall oven?

We are installing an under counter wall oven in the place where the range was previously. The wall oven needs to be hardwired, and there is an existing 50 amp 3 prong 220/240 range outlet in place. Is there any reason why this wouldn't be a simple matter of using the existing wiring to hardwire?
 
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  #2  
Old 05-02-12, 01:22 PM
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Short answer is yes, but: What size breaker? What size wire? What are the wire colors? What is the oven's amp rating? Is it 240v or is it 120/240v?
 
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Old 05-02-12, 01:37 PM
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The existing range outlet is on a 50 amp breaker - The oven we are installing takes a minimum of 20 amps and 208/240.
Kenmore -30" Electric Self-Clean Single Wall Oven 4883
 
  #4  
Old 05-02-12, 02:31 PM
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Does the old circuit have a ground? What wire colors? Cable or conduit?

The existing range outlet is on a 50 amp breaker - The oven we are installing takes a minimum of 20 amps and 208/240
Then you would need to reduce the size of the breaker to 20a. From product site:
Total Connected Load: 3.4 kW @ 240V / 2.6 kW @ 208V
The current wires would probably have to be reduced in size to fit a 20a breaker.
 
  #5  
Old 05-08-12, 03:04 PM
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Well - fast forward. I contacted an electrician to do the work. They came very highly recommended on Angie's list, but I am sincerely wondering if they sent someone who didn't quite know what he was doing. Reason being, he took the old plug out, wrapped tape around the wires, (red, black and white so we know which is which when we install the oven - it was 2 black 1 white when opened) and he installed a 30 amp breaker. I asked about the "grounded junction box" requirements in the installation instructions, he said something about the existing one being plastic and it's not needed - that I can connect white and green from the appliance to the neutral. I guess I assumed he was going to replace the whole works. He also didn't change out any wiring, and the wires in there are quite large. I asked about that as well, and he said it is fine. I attached a picture, but I'm not sure it tells you much. The box is the size of a standard recepticle.

We also had a problem with our dishwasher hardwire... our very first step in demolishing our kitchen was to uninstall our old dishwasher. We turned off all of the breakers for the kitchen (poorly labeled and werent sure) - and when we finished uninstalling it, we capped the wires, and turned all breakers back on. The one that is the dedicated one for the dishwasher alone immediately popped at that point. The electrician confirmed there was a short, checked the end and at the breaker - but did not have the time to troubleshoot it further. He claims we must have ran a screw into it. I tried to explain that the problem happened immediately upon uninstalling the old dishwasher, he didn't seem to believe me. He wants my husband to cut a hole in the wall where we screwed the rail for our cabinets anyway - sure, we can, but the problem was occuring before any installation of anything.

I seem to have zero luck when I hire people to do work, which is part of the reason we were trying to do it ourselves.
 
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Old 05-08-12, 03:28 PM
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You are going to need a connector like a Polaris or a split bolt connector to splice the aluminum wiring to the new wiring.

Your box only appears to be the same size as a regular box. That is a single gang plaster ring on a 4" square box.

You do not need to ground a plastic box.
 
  #7  
Old 05-08-12, 03:35 PM
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Hmm - I'm not sure what that is. He claimed we just needed aluminum to copper wirenuts.
 
  #8  
Old 05-08-12, 03:50 PM
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They do not carry an alum to copper wire nut that big. As Pcboss said, the connection will need to be made with polaris type wire connector (or the like). Note: Your box may be too small to accept the type of conductor connector required, but if you have room, the electrician may be able to install a listed box extension, or mud ring to make room for the new connectors. My question, what is in their scope of work? Example: Are they coming back to hook-up the oven? I also wonder if the electrical box is in the correct location to accept the ovenóseems to be fineódepending on the installation instructions. If itís going in a cabinet, is the box high enough off the floor?
 
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Old 05-08-12, 03:57 PM
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They are not - he was made aware that my husband would be making the connection and this is the information he gave me. He looked at the oven to be installed and the installation instructions. Maybe he did mean the polaris connector but he certainly didn't clarify. He was Russian so I had a hard time understanding a lot of what he was saying. I guess I'll have whoever I have fix the dishwasher problem install the oven as well.
 
  #10  
Old 05-08-12, 04:00 PM
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The oven is being installed under counter (in the same way it would be if there was a separate cooktop installed above it). There are instructions for this in the manual and it does not say the box needs to be a particular height off the floor.
 
  #11  
Old 05-08-12, 04:21 PM
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I mention the box height off the floor, as the cabinet itself may bury a portion of the electrical box--if itís not high enough, or installed per cabinet specs.. Note: Some manufactures will specify a specific location an electrical box should be installed. "This information must not be ignored". Reason (this is an example): The electrical box could end-up behind the appliance (this will limit the space) preventing the appliance from being installed.
 
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Old 05-08-12, 04:29 PM
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Your oven does have a box placement requirement:
http://www.managemylife.com/mmh/lis_...L/L0909507.pdf
 
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Old 05-08-12, 04:34 PM
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Aye - well, the instructions do say to make it underneath and 3 inches to the left of the left side of the cabinet, which I'm not entirely sure why, seeing that the cable coming out of the oven is about 8-10 inches from the left side of the oven (towards center)- I thought maybe the reason was because of the length of cord maybe to prevent too much extra but even with the 3 inches it is still maybe 1-2 feet longer than that so I assumed having the box directly under the cabinet should be fine. I mean, I'll move it if need be, just don't see a reason for it.
 
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Old 05-08-12, 04:42 PM
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I guess all I can say at this point is thank you for all your help. Will likely have to have someone install it - hopefully correctly. Too many things we're not sure of to do ourselves apparently. Looking forward to having my kitchen back someday - especially the dishwasher. I can do with my countertop convection, but man, I forgot how much it sucks doing dishes in the sink! LOL
 
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Old 05-08-12, 04:43 PM
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If you have the appliance onsite, you may not have to move it. Just take a measurement of your appliance, and compare it against your electrical box location inside the cabinet. Also, make sure your box will be inside the cabinet and not partially buried behind the cabinet. Take in consideration any faceplates required to cover the electrical box.
 
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Old 05-08-12, 04:46 PM
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I guess all I can say at this point is thank you for all your help. Will likely have to have someone install it - hopefully correctly. Too many things we're not sure of to do ourselves apparently. Looking forward to having my kitchen back someday - especially the dishwasher. I can do with my countertop convection, but man, I forgot how much it sucks doing dishes in the sink! LOL
I hear ya! There is much to know when it comes to electrical, and remodeling than some will know!! Hopefully you will get it corrected, so you can move forward.
 
  #17  
Old 05-08-12, 04:47 PM
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As it stands, the connection to the box (the hole in the faceplate) will be below the cabinet, so we will likely be cutting that 9 X 9 hole recommended in the instructions.
 
  #18  
Old 05-08-12, 05:42 PM
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Here is a link to the Polaris connectors. Look for the IT1/O.

Manufacturer of Aluminum and Copper set screw connectors for the Utility, OEM, and Contractor and Industrial Markets

They are probably only available at an electrical supply house.
 
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