Best practice for plumbing & electrical?

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  #1  
Old 11-18-12, 11:37 PM
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Best practice for plumbing & electrical?

Hoping for some experience to weigh in on my next steps. I'm working through a kitchen reno and just took out the old cabinetry and the lower walls. I know that I'll have to update the range wiring but I wanted to ask about the plumbing.

Originally the copper plumbing was run through the back of all of the cabinets (and was actually located about two inches above the range outlet) on the inside of the walls. I cut out all the plumbing when I tore out the cabinets and was planning on running new 1/2 " PEX to service the sink through the 2X4 studs. In a few places there are electrical runs that go up the center of the studs to service the outlets for the counter and fridge. Can I run the new PEX through the studs as planned or what is the best thing to do here? (Just to be clear this would mean the PEX would cross over the vertical electrical runs. ). This seems like a fairly simple question but I'd rather ask first than redo later! I don't want to have to rewire the outlets but I will if its necessary to put the plumbing where it belongs. I read that you need a certain distance for electrical and "damp" locations in the code but I'm not sure how this falls into that because I don't think this would be a damp location. I'm in Alberta, Canada and any help you can provide would be great - thanks.
 

Last edited by Sinoed; 11-19-12 at 12:16 AM.
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Old 11-19-12, 04:04 AM
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Hopefully you will do a good job on the PEX and you won't have a "damp" location. Plumbing and electrical cross all the time. If you have the choice, the next bay over would be ideal for the electrical. Just secure the electrical to the middle of the studs and/or use "no Nail" plates across the face of the studs where the water and electrical are located. You don't want to run a screw or nail through them.

Whoa, I just re-read your location and post. Check with your local authorities on this, as your codes are different in some instances. Some of our Canadian guys will chime in here with more information.
 
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Old 11-19-12, 06:02 AM
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This would not be an issue under the NEC.

Typically the water line are brought through the floor into the cabinets to keep the water lines out of the cold exterior walls.
 
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Old 11-19-12, 07:37 AM
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yep.....you will have the freeze risk issue……and perhaps a code issue.

You would need to notch the front of the studs.....and install metal protector plates.

This is to maximize the insulation behind the pipes.....but they could still freeze.

And may still not be to code as the pipes would be on the wrong side of the vapor barrier.

Unless of course you spray the wall cavities with closed cell foam.

Is there access from below?.....the simplest would be that route.

Or you could do the horizontal run between the kitchen floor and the floor of the cabinets.

You could pre-run and fasten the pex to the floor and then notch the bottom of each gable.

Even easier if the new cabinets happen to have adjustable legs instead.




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Old 11-19-12, 03:38 PM
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I Re Read the OP and didn't see any issue with exterior walls. Good points regarding it however.
 
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Old 11-19-12, 07:20 PM
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I Re Read the OP and didn't see any issue with exterior walls. Good points regarding it however.
Same here chandler. From what I have seen, when the sink base is on an interior wall the water lines generally enter the cabinet from the back just like the OP described that he took out.
 
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Old 11-19-12, 07:41 PM
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Ok, some excellent thoughts - I think a few pictures here would be helpful. In the first picture you can see the original layout of the kitchen and where the plumbing comes in and how it was run. I have to run a new circuit here for the microwave and the updated wiring for the range as well which you can see in the second picture. About 3/4 of the kitchen is actually over a garage so I don't want to run it underneath since its not heated. I was thinking of bringing the PEX in through the new corner cabinet and inside the exterior wall to prevent freezing. I was more concerned with leaving exposed pipes behind the range and fridge (also on this wall) as it was before.

I like the idea of pre-running piping under the cabinets (rather than through) just because then I don't have to notch every single joist along the length of the kitchen (possibly not a good idea?). So could I just run the piping behind the walls where the stove and fridge are going to sit then?

Thanks for all of the help so far!

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Old 11-21-12, 11:31 AM
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I like the idea of pre-running piping under the cabinets (rather than through) just because then I don't have to notch every single joist along the length of the kitchen (possibly not a good idea?). So could I just run the piping behind the walls where the stove and fridge are going to sit then?
Yes, and then bring the water up through the bottom shelf or the sink base without entering the exterior wall. Just seal the holes where the pipes come through with caulk or foam in addition to an escutcheon.
 
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Old 11-21-12, 12:16 PM
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Unfortunately......this is a bit of a pickle and the solution is not so straight forward.

So.....the water feed comes from the left.....but has to get past the fridge and stove.

The original pipes were run inside the cabinets.....along the surface of the exterior wall.

They simply continued in the open when they spanned the gaps behind the appliances.

This looks likely to be a retro-fit kitchen location.

Either they didn't bother putting the pipes in the wall.....or there was the freeze issue.

I would not run exposed pex behind the fridge or stove.

It could get punctured or even be affected by the heat.

Sadly.....you may end up at square one and have to run copper the same way it was.



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Old 11-21-12, 01:28 PM
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I would not run exposed pex behind the fridge or stove. It could get punctured or even be affected by the heat.
Originally Posted by Sinoed
could I just run the piping behind the walls where the stove and fridge are going to sit then?
Yes .
 
  #11  
Old 11-25-12, 09:56 PM
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Awesome thanks for the help. I ran the PEX today and ended up drilling holes and notching the front of the studs. Upon closer inspection the "t" for the plumbing was already 5" off the floor so I didn't want to have it on the ground and leave a low spot where water could lie. I'm going to put in the protector plates for the "just in case" scenario.
 
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