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# Idle Time Question - Kwh

#1
02-22-13, 01:17 PM
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Idle Time Question - Kwh

I pay as much as .28 per kwh. At times it could be double this.
Is a kwh as follows:
Running a 1000W microwave for an hour
Or, running 10 100W light bulbs for an hour?

If so, I'm using 993kwh per month. 993,000 Watts?

Seems like a lot.

Can someone confirm this, or am I thinking wrong.

Thanks

#2
02-22-13, 01:19 PM
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Running a 1000W microwave for an hour
Or, running 10 100W light bulbs for an hour?
Both of these are a kilowatt hour, so is running a 100 W light bulb for 10 hours.

#3
02-22-13, 01:21 PM
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OK, let's look at it this way:

993 kwh/month = 33.1 khw/day = 1.38 kwh/hour = 1.38 kw constantly for the course of the month.

#4
02-22-13, 01:40 PM
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So if I'm using 1300watts per hr, I guess it's not that bad. I could even cut down on that.
Thanks.

#5
02-22-13, 01:55 PM
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I really don't have much reference but some of the things that can make a difference are oven/stove, dryer, water heater and household heat - if all of these things are electric versus all gas, the electric usage in your home each month is going to be significantly different.

#6
02-22-13, 03:59 PM
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My electric consumption averages around 9 to 12 kWh daily over a two-month billing period. That's about 270 to 360 kWh per month. However, I live alone and rarely have a lot of lights on. I do have three compact fluorescent lamps on a photocell. I also have a gas-fired furnace and water heater although my kitchen range is electric. On occasion that average has spiked to as high as 19 kWh per day when we went through an extended heat wave and my window A/C was running pretty much 24/7.

According to what I read I am a very low consumer of electricity but I don't think so. I use a microwave oven and countertop toaster/convection oven for about half of my cooking needs with the electric range for the rest. I only have one television (CRT style) and then my computer equipment along with interior lighting, about half CFL and the other half incandescent. I believe in lots of light when needed but I rarely leave lights on when I am out of the room.

#7
02-22-13, 06:14 PM
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If so, I'm using 993kwh per month. 993,000 Watts?
No, that would be 993,000 watt hours which is = to 993 kilowatt hours.

#8
02-22-13, 06:28 PM
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I'm averaging 736 kwh per month. I have a 1600 sq ft house, a wife, and two little ones that don't consume anything on their own. Energy consumption will depend on where you live. A hot climate with a/c use is going to weigh heavily. Living in a cold climate with all electric heating appliances will as well.

#9
02-22-13, 07:38 PM
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My house is about 1540 square feet on one level. I have three cats that also live here and during the day I often have to open the door every fifteen minutes or so to let one or more in or out. I live in a fairly moderate climate, it is 43 degrees outside as I write this at 7:30 in the evening. Right now I have the computer running (obviously) an Ethernet switch, two routers, a VoIP adapter and the FiOS terminal (all combined a pretty minimal load), two CFL reflector (recessed fixture) bulbs, a 9 watt LED reflector bulb and in the other room two 65 watt incandescent reflector bulbs along with two 13 watt CFLs in my range hood. My furnace is cycling to maintain 68 degrees inside temperature.

I think it got up to about 46, maybe as high as 48 degrees today and those CFLs in the range hood normally are lit from dusk to shortly before I go to bed, usually between 2 and 4 AM.

#10
02-23-13, 04:11 AM
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Our local POCO has a feature on their website to allow customers to log in and view their usage either daily or monthly. There is a 2 day delay, but it is a great tool. We are averaging about 1100 kwh in the big house, about 10 in my shop, and 250 in the weekend rental cabin. Dummy me, I went up to clean the cabin recently before we had a really cold snap, and forgot to turn off the water heater (which I do between guests), and forgot to lower the thermostat to 50. POW, the heat pump ate my cookies. Almost 1000 that month. Lessons learned.

With all that, our big house electric bill runs about \$150, shop \$20 and cabin \$60, unless we are slammed with renters, which is OK.

#11
02-23-13, 11:53 AM
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Our house is roughly 2200 ft.[SUP]2[/SUP] on three levels. Over the last two years our lowest usage was 1178 kWh in late winter/early spring and our highest was 1962 kWh in late summer. Because the fixed costs are what they are, our total cost/kWh ranged from 11.63 cents in the highest usage month to 13.64 cents in the lowest usage month.

Our power is actually billed at something like 10 cents/kWh, IIRC.

#12
02-23-13, 12:12 PM
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So Larry.....you are on a Smart meter system there. Do they offer you peak and off peak rates ?

28c / KWH and sometimes double..... I'm guessing all that extra cash going to cleaning up California's air quality.

I'm using an alternate energy provider. The power is brought in by the electric company and you can opt to shop for actual generation rates. Right now the rate is 9.2c / KWH

#13
02-23-13, 12:56 PM
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I'm using an alternate energy provider. The power is brought in by the electric company and you can opt to shop for actual generation rates. Right now the rate is 9.2c / KWH
That's just for the electric and not delivery, right? I'm paying about \$0.18 per kwh for both delivery and generation.

#14
02-23-13, 01:08 PM
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Correct.....just the actual electric. I think it's about 1.5-.2 lower than GPU/NJ right now.

#15
02-23-13, 01:29 PM
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You guys make me feel real good paying a bit over 8-1/2 cents per kWh plus a 6% city utility tax. My \$25 to \$30 a month looks real good as well.

#16
02-23-13, 03:27 PM
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Mine is running about 12 cents. I failed to mention on each meter there is a \$17 per month "customer charge". Don't ask. So my shop really runs about \$3 actual and the big house \$125 or so.

#17
02-23-13, 03:37 PM
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OK, you guys made me rip open a bill and check the rates.

\$0.084/kWh for the juice and \$0 034/kWh for delivery. \$0.118/kWh total for power in the panel from our co-op. About the same as Larry's 12 cents.

Last edited by Nashkat1; 02-23-13 at 05:38 PM.
#18
02-23-13, 05:48 PM
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\$0.084/kWh for the juice and \$0 034/kWh for delivery. \$0.118/kWh total for power in the panel from our co-op. About the same as Larry's 12 cents.
So, is that the rate year round? We have summer and winter rates here; the summer rates running May 1 through September 30 and being about 2 cents per KWH higher than winter rates. Summer rates are about 12 cents per KHW including all taxes.

#19
02-23-13, 06:50 PM
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Joe, I think that'e the rate year-round, without digging out an old bill to make sure. Plus, I'm pretty sure I'd be aware of it if we had different rates for any different conditions, and so would my customers. We might have been installing separate meters for a single service fao years now, and that's never even been suggested.

One more thing. I notice that my total cost/kWh is lowest in cooling season. See Post #11.

#20
02-24-13, 01:34 AM
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Here in NJ....ours goes up approx 2 cents in the summer.

#21
02-24-13, 02:55 AM
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It's odd to have a "delivery" charge, IMO. What do you think your options are? Driving down to the local substation and picking up a month's supply in the trunk of your car???

I won't get into the "monopoly" thing, either. You get your electricity from the POCO or you make your own, or you do without. They know that and can ask for rate increases or "customer charge" additions at will.

#22
02-24-13, 04:49 AM
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Here in NJ, you can buy your power from someone else. The separate delivery charge allows this to happen because you can't have anyone different delivery the power to you.

Evidently it isn't so easy to raise rates here either. That's why our power infrastructure has been so neglected for the past decade. They decided to deliver the money to investor instead of back into the infrastructure. That's why Sandy's damage was so bad here. But now it will be much easier for them to raise rates to make the repairs.

I can understand the customer charge. They need a minimum amount per month just to keep the lines maintained.

#23
02-24-13, 06:15 AM
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We live less than 10 miles from Niagara Falls with its huge generating station and cheap hydro but our power comes from a coal-fired plant 10 miles in the other direction. The hydro is shipped off to Boston and NYC so the POCO can charge a premium.

As it stands, we pay over 12 cents per kwh. In our 1600 sf house my wife and I try to use as little as possible -- under 600 kwh a month -- and the bills average around \$80 including taxes and fees. I guess we can't complain.

#24
02-24-13, 09:31 AM
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No, that would be 993,000 watt hours which is = to 993 kilowatt hours.
Sorry, I still don't get it. Watts is the only way I know to judge what I'm using, Because I have a general idea of what wattage certain appliances/devices consume.

I don't understand watt hours. So 993Kwh = 993,000 watt hours.
If this is not using 993,000 watts over the month, what is it?
16,550 watts? 993,000/60?
The 993,000 watts sounds right to me. That would come to 1380 watts per hour, 24 hrs per day.
Am I even anywhere close to understanding this?
Thanks (the bad news is I have no electric appliances, gas stove, dryer, heat, water heater)

#25
02-24-13, 09:43 AM
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It would appear you have it right and yes that does seem like a high consumption especially since you have no heavy draw electric items.

How many fridges or freezers ?

#26
02-24-13, 10:04 AM
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I have 2 Fridges. Washer and Dryer get used quite a bit. I use almost all CFL's. Kitchen has "halogena bulbs", I think these are a hybrid halogen (dimmable). I think maybe it's computers and TVs sucking up all this power. Also, do Transformers (a/c adapters) consume electric even though the device it's connected to is not turned on? If so, this could be alot of it.

#27
02-24-13, 10:54 AM
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Two fridges is a pretty good load.
Everything electronic today uses some power whether it's on or off.

If the wall warts are warm then they are consuming power. Some of the newer style use a PWM circuit and only use power when the device it powers is turned on. They run cold with no load.

#28
02-24-13, 11:06 AM
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You don't have an air conditioner?

#29
02-24-13, 11:44 AM
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I do have an air conditioner. That's why at the top I mentioned my charge could be doubled at times, or close to it. In the summer, my bill may jump to over .45/kwh (tiered). San Diego charges on a tier level, they give you a certain amount at a resonable rate. Once you go over that, you pay dearly. Currently the levels are: (in kwh) 276, 361, 556, above 556 look out....that's tier 4. If there's a tier 5, I don't want to see it. We also have smart meters, they say they are a convienience, but I bet you in the future they will charge more for electric during peak periods. Then the price will probably be sky high to discourage use.

#30
02-24-13, 11:57 AM
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Yes.....I'm sure they will charge you more in peak times BUT then they must also give you a discount in off peak times.

We, too, are on a tier schedule.

Smart meters promote night time usage of power when demand is at its lowest. My electric company sends me an info card with the bill. It usually says some baloney about saving on electric costs by washing dishes and clothes at night.

I would love to have a smart meter and shed a lot of load to the night.

#31
02-24-13, 12:04 PM
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Ok. I would say the bulk of your usage is from the a/c. This 993 kwh, is that your average monthly use or was that usage for your latest bill?

#32
02-24-13, 01:18 PM
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I don't understand watt hours. So 993Kwh = 993,000 watt hours.
Your electric meter measures power used and reads in kilowatt hours (KWH). The K designates 1,000. Thus, 993 KWH = 993,000 watt hours. A 1,000 watt bulb turned on for 1 hour = 1,000 watt hours or 1 kilowatt hour. A 100 watt bulb turned on for 10 hours = 1,000 watthours or 1 kilowatt hour.

#33
02-25-13, 06:01 AM
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The unit on the bill is power x time: so many kilowatts multiplied by the duration of time over which they had to be delivered. Gas consumption is more intuitive, so many gallons of gas used by the car. The problem with electricity is you need an additional variable to determine what was delivered, kilowatts on their own do not tell the story, it's kilowatts used along with the time span.

#34
02-25-13, 09:42 PM
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I won't get into the "monopoly" thing, either. You get your electricity from the POCO or you make your own, or you do without. They know that and can ask for rate increases or "customer charge" additions at will.
The hired managers of out cooperative can ask. At the annual meeting, the owners - us - can vote their request up or down.

Droo already explained how breaking out the charge for delivery facilitates - heck, enables - our ability to choose from competing providers. At the moment, we're choosing the lowest-carbon provider. There may be cheaper suppliers available - haven't checked in awhile - but we're comfortable with this choice.

#35
02-25-13, 09:50 PM
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It would be nice to see a bill for 993 kWh. I can't remember the last time we got one for less than 1100 kWh.

#36
02-25-13, 10:24 PM
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I just received my bill a few days ago, 842 kilowatts used in a 63 day billing cycle.
No, I don't live in the dark or cook over a campfire. Electric kitchen, gas space and water heating. Flat rate of \$0.08852 per kilowatt hour (winter rate, summer is a bit less) for a dollar amount of \$74.53 Another \$4.47 in city utility tax which gives a total of \$79.00. One of the highest bills I have had since moving to this house thirteen years ago. Average daily usage 13 kWh.

#37
02-26-13, 03:00 AM
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All I can say is, it must be nice to have more than one provider competing for your business. Never knew that existed, having lived under the rule of the Georgia Power Company all my life, then moved to the mountains where we have an Electric Membership Cooperative. No other providers around, so we are basically stuck with what they throw at us. Yeah, we can vote on things, but I don't really think the EMC cares much, knowing they have a captive audience.

#38
02-26-13, 08:13 AM
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We still have only one power company/provider. They have admin and delivery charges that are set. The only thing we can shop for is the actual generation of power charges.

Most people here (where I live) don't realize you can that. It's not a ton of money but it's something. Up to a few cents a KWH.

#39
02-26-13, 04:20 PM
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I pay the extra 2 cents for all hydro power. Must be that stuff from Niagara.

I'm not sure going to a different provider to save money is all it's cracked up to be. I think you have to keep an eye on the prices and keep switching to stay ahead of them game. It also takes awhile for the switch to go through. Up to two months if I recall correctly.

#40
02-26-13, 06:06 PM
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I'm not sure going to a different provider to save money is all it's cracked up to be. I think you have to keep an eye on the prices and keep switching to stay ahead of them game. It also takes awhile for the switch to go through. Up to two months if I recall correctly.
chandler

All I can say is, it must be nice to have more than one provider competing for your business.
My state has some of the lowest rates in the nation and I like that although we've had 5 rate increases in the last 5 years. After seeing what some of you pay, I am feeling better about our increased rates still being some of the least expensive around. Illinois, however, is a different matter. Right across the river from us, Illinois deregulated the electric utility industry about 10 or so years ago and it's been disastrous for them. Part of the legislation required the investor owned power companies to divest of their generating facilities. What has happened is the new power plant owners have put all of their production on the open market. Now, the Illinois power companies must bid against East and West coast power companies for the power. Needless to say, cheap midwest power is in high demand and there isn't enough to satisfy the demand from across the nation. The end result is the Illinois consumers are paying about twice the amount for their power as they did before the deregulation.

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