Adding A Sub Panel For BBQ Island & Ramada
#1
03-07-13, 12:52 PM
Adding A Sub Panel For BBQ Island & Ramada
I am building a remada with a built in BBQ and need some info on the gauge of wire to use running a new sub panel in the island. I will be running conduit from the main panel about 150' to the sub panel location. The ramada & island will have:
3 outlets - 1 for a mini fridge & two for countertop use - rotisserie, radio, etc.
1 ceiling fan w/ lights controlled by a dual slider fan switch
3 can lights on a switch above the grill area - 3" halogen cans
2 coach lights on a switch on the pillars of the ramada
I was panning to have the fridge and the 2 other outlets on 1 breaker & the lighting and fan on the other breaker.
What size breaker do I need at the main panel?
What size wire should I run between the main & sub panel?
What size breakers in the sub panel?
What size wire from the sub panel to the outlets & lighting?
Any other tips would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Joe
3 outlets - 1 for a mini fridge & two for countertop use - rotisserie, radio, etc.
1 ceiling fan w/ lights controlled by a dual slider fan switch
3 can lights on a switch above the grill area - 3" halogen cans
2 coach lights on a switch on the pillars of the ramada
I was panning to have the fridge and the 2 other outlets on 1 breaker & the lighting and fan on the other breaker.
What size breaker do I need at the main panel?
What size wire should I run between the main & sub panel?
What size breakers in the sub panel?
What size wire from the sub panel to the outlets & lighting?
Any other tips would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Joe
#2
03-07-13, 01:01 PM
Welcome to the forums!
You could probably do all of this with a 30A feed. 60A would certainly be enough. The real answer depends on the loads. What is the maximum rated capacity of the recessed lights, the fan, and the wall lights?
I'm thinking one 15A circuit for the mini-fridge, two 20A receptacle circuits and one more 15A circuit for the fan, the cans and the wall lights.
Wire size depends on circuit size, so let's nail that down first.
You could probably do all of this with a 30A feed. 60A would certainly be enough. The real answer depends on the loads. What is the maximum rated capacity of the recessed lights, the fan, and the wall lights?
I'm thinking one 15A circuit for the mini-fridge, two 20A receptacle circuits and one more 15A circuit for the fan, the cans and the wall lights.
Wire size depends on circuit size, so let's nail that down first.
#3
03-07-13, 01:46 PM
Nashkat1,
The lights say 50w maximum bulb wattage, they are from Home Depot SKU 562883.
The fan I don't have yet but will be an outdoor fan similar to Home Depot SKU 168906 with 2 60w bulbs, 5 blades, 3 speed.
The fridge says 1.5 amps
Thanks!
The lights say 50w maximum bulb wattage, they are from Home Depot SKU 562883.
The fan I don't have yet but will be an outdoor fan similar to Home Depot SKU 168906 with 2 60w bulbs, 5 blades, 3 speed.
The fridge says 1.5 amps
Thanks!
#4
03-07-13, 02:59 PM
The branch circuit sizes I listed will all work. To get to the panel size add in the other loads, especially the rotisserie.
I wish we knew the fan motor load. I didn't find that when I searched for it. But it should be OK.
BTW, that's a really nice looking fan from the best company - or one of the two best, anyway - in the business, IMO.
I wish we knew the fan motor load. I didn't find that when I searched for it. But it should be OK.
BTW, that's a really nice looking fan from the best company - or one of the two best, anyway - in the business, IMO.
#5
03-07-13, 03:09 PM
Thanks for your help, the rotisserie will just end up being plugged into the counter outlet. So with everything I have going on here what size wire should I run to feed the sub panel?
#6
03-07-13, 03:33 PM
Thanks for your help, the rotisserie will just end up being plugged into the counter outlet. So with everything I have going on here what size wire should I run to feed the sub panel?
#8
03-07-13, 05:25 PM
I am building a remada with a built in BBQ and need some info on the gauge of wire to use running a new sub panel in the island. I will be running conduit from the main panel about 150' to the sub panel location
Last edited by ray2047; 03-08-13 at 08:13 AM. Reason: Remove comment I added.
#9
03-08-13, 01:35 AM
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I like CasualJoe's setup. With two code issues. Sch 40 is great underground or in walls, but exposed it needs to be sch 80.
If the ramada is a seperate structure from the structure your service is on (ie not attached to the house), it needs a grounding electrode system. If there is a concrete foundation with more than 20 feet of rebar, you must run a wire from the rebar to the ground bar in the panel. Not the neutral bar, grounds and neutrals must stay isolated. Otherwise, two ground rods should do the trick.
If the ramada is a seperate structure from the structure your service is on (ie not attached to the house), it needs a grounding electrode system. If there is a concrete foundation with more than 20 feet of rebar, you must run a wire from the rebar to the ground bar in the panel. Not the neutral bar, grounds and neutrals must stay isolated. Otherwise, two ground rods should do the trick.
#10
03-08-13, 04:42 PM
So for the grounding wire can I clamp it to rebar in a slab on grade and then pour the slab with the ground wire coming out underneath the side where my sub panel will be? This is in Arizona where it might be hard to drive a grounding rod 10' deep with all the rock.
#11
03-08-13, 05:17 PM
I like CasualJoe's setup. With two code issues. Sch 40 is great underground or in walls, but exposed it needs to be sch 80.
If the ramada is a seperate structure from the structure your service is on (ie not attached to the house), it needs a grounding electrode system. If there is a concrete foundation with more than 20 feet of rebar, you must run a wire from the rebar to the ground bar in the panel. Not the neutral bar, grounds and neutrals must stay isolated. Otherwise, two ground rods should do the trick.
If the ramada is a seperate structure from the structure your service is on (ie not attached to the house), it needs a grounding electrode system. If there is a concrete foundation with more than 20 feet of rebar, you must run a wire from the rebar to the ground bar in the panel. Not the neutral bar, grounds and neutrals must stay isolated. Otherwise, two ground rods should do the trick.
#12
03-08-13, 05:58 PM
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For a 150' run at 50A assuming 5% max voltage drop, you'd need a minimum of #6 conductors. If this was my project, I'd use the cheaper 2-2-2-4 USE cable buried 24'', and sleeved in sch. 80 PVC conduit where it exits the ground.
#13
03-08-13, 06:33 PM
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CasualJoe, you rock.
JNNHI, exactly as you said in post 10. The #6 can come out the side or through the top of the slab. Just any place it might be exposed to physical damage it needs to be in pvc pipe. Securely fasten the wire to surfaces. Use a brass or copper clamp with CE (concrete encased) embossed on it.
If you weren't planning to use rebar, you can use #4 bare copper wire. Lay 20 feet of it so that at least 2 inches of concrete will cover it. Then continue the wire up to your ground bar.
Don't forget, cable, telephone, metal water pipes, metal gas pipes all need to be bonded to whichever system's wire, #6 or #4.
JNNHI, exactly as you said in post 10. The #6 can come out the side or through the top of the slab. Just any place it might be exposed to physical damage it needs to be in pvc pipe. Securely fasten the wire to surfaces. Use a brass or copper clamp with CE (concrete encased) embossed on it.
If you weren't planning to use rebar, you can use #4 bare copper wire. Lay 20 feet of it so that at least 2 inches of concrete will cover it. Then continue the wire up to your ground bar.
Don't forget, cable, telephone, metal water pipes, metal gas pipes all need to be bonded to whichever system's wire, #6 or #4.
#14
03-08-13, 09:00 PM
So for the grounding wire can I clamp it to rebar in a slab on grade and then pour the slab with the ground wire coming out underneath the side where my sub panel will be?
This is in Arizona where it might be hard to drive a grounding rod 10' deep with all the rock.
