Which Breaker to get for this Breaker Panel Slot??

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  #1  
Old 09-16-13, 07:20 PM
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Which Breaker to get for this Breaker Panel Slot??

I am removing a 30 amp double pole breaker that is taking up two full slots in my breaker panel (the last 2 slots on bottom right 2nd column of panel), and I want to put in single pole 20 amp mini breakers, which would allow me to now add 4 runs. I went to home depot and bought 4 of these but I think they may be too big. I tried to find the model of my breaker, but I just found the model of the insulated casing which is a General Electric TP24F.

I attached pictures, but does anyone have any idea of what I can buy at home depot which would work (I have a lot of home depot store credit to use)

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  #2  
Old 09-16-13, 07:34 PM
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You've certainly got a lot of tandem breakers in that panel.

You are looking for GE tandem breakers. I don't recognize that style and the depot may not have anything to fit that older panel.

Is there a model number tag inside the panel ?
 
  #3  
Old 09-16-13, 07:54 PM
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Looks like a TR2020 is what you need. TR2020 Twin 20-20 Amp Plug-in Breaker, Now Obsolete

Nothing at home depot would work except to install a sub-panel.
 
  #4  
Old 09-16-13, 08:07 PM
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Wow I think you found the breaker on that website..it looks like even though its out of production they still have some in stock for $60 each? The slot I wanted to take out on the bottom right corner of the 2nd column is actually the breaker for my sub panel outside. I'm trying to add 20amp breakers to my main panel so I can get my kitchen up to code by adding 2 homeruns for the countertop outlets and use the other 2 for whatever else I need in the kitchen. However, is it code to use a sub panel breaker that is located outside to power my kitchen?
 
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Old 09-16-13, 08:17 PM
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As long as same structure you can feed from whatever panel you wish.

Looking closer I think the breaker for the sub is technically wrong (but works) for that panel. Is the sheet still there? Those old GE panels usually say only type TR or TQL to be used and that looks like a newer style THQL
 
  #6  
Old 09-16-13, 08:24 PM
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You may be right, as the subpanel right now has no breakers in it, so it is possible that the breaker being used in the main panel to power the subpanel is wrong. What's interesting though is that on the left hand column most of those breakers are Siemens Type QP breakers.
 
  #7  
Old 09-16-13, 08:29 PM
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The GE THQL 30amp breaker that powers my subpanel definitely works, because the same breaker is being used for my dryer. With this revelaton is there anything else besides those $60 each TR2020's that would work? I would prefer to not run my kitchen off the subpanel, because I have a feeling the outside subpanel is for running electric to my dock, landscape lighting, any outdoor buildouts etc in the future
 
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Old 09-16-13, 08:45 PM
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Physically there are a lot of breakers that fit but they should not be there. More from insurance and liability standpoint if there is ever a fire.

I'm thinking if you had wiring done without regard to the right breaker, you probably have other wiring issues. How bad does the inside of the panel look?
 
  #9  
Old 09-16-13, 08:54 PM
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The situation that I moved into the home was in an "as is" foreclosure type of situation, so I am sure there is a strong possibility that the wiring is not great. Especially since there is a mix of new GE breakers, Siemens breakers, and then the older TR2020 that you point outed to. I haven't really had any electrical problems, except for 2 rooms it seems like some of the incandescent bulbs burned out too early, and also lights dimming for a second when the A/C powers on.

Here is a pictures of the inside from when I moved in.
 
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  #10  
Old 09-16-13, 10:43 PM
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Here is a pictures of the inside from when I moved in.
Interesting. How did you protect the cables that were laid into notches in the framing? Have you cleaned up the wiring inside the panel?

Your picture is to small, too low resolution or too dark for me to tell much from looking at it - or it's my monitor and eyeglasses. That said, the make and model of your panel, and a list of the breakers that are rates and approved for installation in it, should be on the label mounted on the inside of the door for the panel.
 
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Old 09-17-13, 08:10 AM
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I was afraid that it would be rusted as the cover is and need replaced. Doesn't look too bad from a distance. Assume you did some cleanup capping those wires sticking out and added plates to protect the others as Nashkat1 pointed out. Also check as you should have your main disconnect outside at the meter so grounds and neutrals should be separate at this panel. What is the brown behind the lower left breakers?

Yes, it would be good to spend $1000 and replace an old panel but if it is physically solid then just get the best breakers you can for now.

Search eBay for "ge tr breaker" for your kitchen project.
 
  #12  
Old 09-17-13, 08:31 AM
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Here are some better pictures. I did not touch anything from the time of these pictures as I am not an electrician, but I am trying to get a better understanding of everything.

The panel seems to be solid, but I'm not sure how good/well the wiring is. I probably would just spend the money and have a new panel installed, but I'm concerned regarding permitting issues as I took the house over "as is" and I believe the two kitchen walls were built by the previous homeowner unpermitted, and from its construction it seems obvious. I'm nervous an electrical inspector would notice this and have me pay expensive fines or knock down the walls, which I do not have the money for at this point. Instead, when I sell the home and can pocket some cash, I can have the fixes done at that time or sell it "as is" and deduct some money.

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  #13  
Old 09-18-13, 06:03 AM
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I think I'm just going to take out that 30amp breaker for the subpanel and use 2 of the TR2020 tandems to run homeruns to power my kitchen remodel to be code compliant. I dont have the liquidity to spend on getting everything up to date with the panel etc...so I will deal with it when I sell the house in 5-10 yrs and some money will be coming in
 
  #14  
Old 09-18-13, 10:47 AM
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Looks like the label is behind the wires. Shouldn't be any surprises but worth taking a look at.

My eyes aren't good enough or there isn't a grounding bus in the panel. Since this is not the main disconnect the neutrals and grounds are to be separate. Unless you run metal pipe or AC (BX) cable you will need to add a bus for your grounding (green) wires. I assume this was installed using conduit for the grounding circuit back to your disconnect so the box itself should be grounded.

Good luck in your renovation.
 
  #15  
Old 09-18-13, 11:48 AM
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Thanks for your input, crossing my fingers that everything turns out well.
 
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