Pulling Wire for New Panel Installation?


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Old 03-01-14, 05:15 PM
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Pulling Wire for New Panel Installation?

I have a new panel being put in next week.

We also needed a dedicated circuit for laundry and remove an old beatup NM cable for the dryer and run it in conduit.... both which are not part of the new panel installation.

My husband ran the conduit for both circuits and brought the pipe to within 2 ft' of our current panel. He's hoping the eletricians instlling the new panel will finish the drops down into the new panel and make the appropriate connections.

He is unclear what to do about pulling wire. If the wire is not in place when the installers come I doubt there will be any chance getting both those circuits hooked up then and they certainly wont be pulling new circuits or using their material to do so.

He was thinking of fishing the wire for both circuits and leave a coil zip tied to conduits in proximity to the panel.

What would be the best way to do this?
 
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Old 03-01-14, 07:10 PM
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I'd leave it for the electrician to do it on a T&M basis and charge it as an extra.
 
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Old 03-01-14, 09:23 PM
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The code requires the conduit to be complete before the conductors are pulled in.
 
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Old 03-02-14, 05:49 AM
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So your thinking they wont even touch it if I pull wires to 3' of the panel, wire tie them, and expect them to make the drops?

So when they install a new panel, its expected the conduits that are currently entering the old panel will have have to be remade to fit the new?

My other option is try to make the drops to the old panel (perhaps with AC?), wire up the two circuits and then I would assume the drops will have to be remade anyway? But this time with wire in them?
 
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Old 03-02-14, 06:17 AM
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Either install the conduit yourself , after the loadcenter is installed ? If you are uncertain about being able to fit , finish the last part in flexible metal conduit . Then pull the wires .

Piece of cake .

God bless
Wyr
 
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Old 03-02-14, 07:54 AM
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So your thinking they wont even touch it if I pull wires to 3' of the panel, wire tie them, and expect them to make the drops?
It all depends on the contract or proposal given you by the contractor. If this was not included, they may not touch it. Or, it's possible they could pull the wire out, complete the conduit and repull the wire and make the connection as an extra like I mentioned in post #2. I think your best option would be to install a 1900 box as a junction and leave the wire there and ask them to complete the circuit as an extra.

Did you tell them you were planning on running this new conduit/circuit?

So when they install a new panel, its expected the conduits that are currently entering the old panel will have have to be remade to fit the new?
Most residential installations aren't with conduits, but with cables. When there are multiple conduits, something has to be done to get those conduits into the new loadcenter. The problem is, there is no standardized layout of knockouts for various manufacturers of loadcenters so odds are very high the existing conduits will not match up to the new panel's KOs. A common method is to shorten the conduits about 4 inches and fit a 4" trough over the top of the panel and punch the trough to match the conduits. Regardless, conduits complicate a panel change when using a loadcenter. In commercial work most panelboard cans do not have KOs and the KOs are punched to match the conduits. Sometimes the existing loadcenter panels become a junction box with the new panel mounted adjacent to it and sometimes a new panel interior is retrofitted into the existing panel box. There are various ways to do this.
 
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Old 03-02-14, 08:39 AM
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I think your best option would be to install a 1900 box as a junction and leave the wire there and ask them to complete the circuit as an extra.
I have a 4x4 box as a junction about 50' from the panel. The conduit from there drops down to the outlet. At the panel there is an open conduit above the enclosure about 2' away.... I hoped they could put a coupling and make the appropriate bend into the panel.

Would it be against code to leave the slack in the 4x4 box and then only leave 6 inches coming out of the pipe at the panel... they would then be able to make the drops/bends into the panel and pull the rest of the slack thru and into the panel? ?

It would be a waste of time and effort to try to finish the conduit runs into the current panel and then it will likely all have to be changed with the new panel. I am also hesitant to use flexible metal conduit and using the fitting that connects it to EMT.... as that would be kind of a hack job, no?




Did you tell them you were planning on running this new conduit/circuit?
No, the Dryer circuit was existing.... swapping out a romex cable (not allowed here in basement) and running THHN in conduit instead. There would also have been an issue with not having a dedicated laundry circuit at the time of inspections so now the pipe has been run for that too.


I

And PS- This installation is indeed all conduit, im in ILLinois (my handle says CA for some reason?) and romex is outlawed in my town.
 
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Old 03-02-14, 02:58 PM
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I hoped they could put a coupling and make the appropriate bend into the panel.
That can be done, but the contyractor may pull the wire back to the 1900 box though and then repull it to the panel after the conduit is completed. That will be between you and your contractor.

No, the Dryer circuit was existing.... swapping out a romex cable (not allowed here in basement) and running THHN in conduit instead. There would also have been an issue with not having a dedicated laundry circuit at the time of inspections
Did the contractor point this out to you as a problem that had to be fixed before the inspection? What did he include in his quote for this?

This installation is indeed all conduit, im in ILLinois (my handle says CA for some reason?) and romex is outlawed in my town.
Generally, most of Illinois allows NM-B cables and all conduit is not required. I suspect you are in northern Illinois.
 
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Old 03-02-14, 05:19 PM
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I put a 1900 box for the dryer circuit about 2 ft. from the panel. So I hope they will remove the NM cable that's currently in my panel for the dryer and then make the drop from the box and make the splice.

For the laundry circuit I was going to do the same thing but if I do there will be two junction boxes between the panel and the laundry outlet. Is that sloppy?


There was also a NM cable supplying my AC unit. I ran the conduit for it and there is a junction box installed, Im hesitant adding a second splicing point for this high draw item though. Since pulling wire thru open conduit is against code, I might have to make the drop and connection for this...

Is using a EMT to AC fitting and making the drop with flex shoddy work?



None of this stuff is in the proposal for the new panel. Money is tight too so I would assume to do this stuff would have added at least a 1000 bucks to job....
 
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Old 03-02-14, 07:11 PM
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I ran the conduit for it and there is a junction box installed, Im hesitant adding a second splicing point for this high draw item though
It's no big deal.

ardmi

I put a 1900 box for the dryer circuit about 2 ft. from the panel. So I hope they will remove the NM cable that's currently in my panel for the dryer and then make the drop from the box and make the splice.
You better tell them what you want them to do then. They do not have to splice in that box. The wire can be continuous through it, but a splice will not hurt anything either.
 
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Old 03-03-14, 03:53 AM
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How much slack should I allow if I loop thru the box instead of splicing? In other words, how much wire should I allow for inside the panel?
 
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Old 03-03-14, 04:48 AM
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Leave enough wire to reach the breaker panel bottom.
 
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Old 03-03-14, 04:31 PM
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I had a boss who liked to overkill everything, but he taught me to come into the panel, to the bottom, and to the opposite end of where I came in from. Oodles of slack.
Or since you're doing a new install, you could put a 12x12 box beside/above the panel and run your cables into the box. Then have EMT to the panel with individual conductors. This would make life easier if you ever replaced the panel again.
 
 

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