How bad is this?

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  #1  
Old 03-24-14, 05:38 PM
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How bad is this?




New 200 amp main lug panel in a church hall remodel. 200 amp service. 200 amp disconnect outside feeding 3 wire 4/0 Al to a 200 amp panel which feeds everything. Kitchen has two double ovens, one freestanding stove/oven and one stovetop plus two microwaves. Electric hot water and two 4ton-ish air conditioners.

Im pretty sure those lugs are going to burn off the first Sunday the kitchen gets used, but I what do I know.
 
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  #2  
Old 03-24-14, 05:42 PM
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The issue is that we no longer know the ampacity of the conductors. They may now be too small for the expected load.
 
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Old 03-24-14, 05:47 PM
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Almost forgot the commercial dish washer.
 
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Old 03-24-14, 05:51 PM
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What is 4/0 AL rated at with 13-15 strands trimmed off in order to fit in 2/0 lugs?
 
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Old 03-24-14, 05:59 PM
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The is no way to know the remaining ampacity. It needs to be fixed.
 
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Old 03-24-14, 07:32 PM
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I find it odd that a 200 amp panel would not have lugs big enough for 4/0 wire. Especially a newer one like the Square D Homeline you have. Most panels rated for 200 amps will have lugs rated for 250 MCM or larger as a 200 amp residential service will require 4/0 aluminum. Are you sure that panel is rated for 200 amps?
 
  #7  
Old 03-24-14, 07:38 PM
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Im not sure what the rating is. I think it was converted from a main breaker panel. Where would I find the label?
 
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Old 03-24-14, 07:45 PM
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The label should be inside the panel on the side.

That panel has an awful lot of dirt in it to be a new panel.
 
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Old 03-24-14, 08:02 PM
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If it is truly a 200 amp panel, the wrong lugs were installed. The fix would be to just install the proper sized lugs. The panel rating needs to be confirmed first.
 
  #10  
Old 03-24-14, 08:20 PM
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I bought the right lugs for the EC. He is not taking the hint. I just wanted to make sure I had my ducks in a row before I call him out on his hackery.

I guess I won't even mention since the ouside service disconnect was replaced as was the inside panel, this should now be a four wire feeder, correct?
 
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Old 03-24-14, 08:24 PM
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I think you have an issue to address with your contractor and with the inspector too, a serious issue. Was this inspected? I don't know an inspector who would have passed an installation like that.
 
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Old 03-24-14, 08:35 PM
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I guess I won't even mention since the ouside service disconnect was replaced as was the inside panel, this should now be a four wire feeder, correct?
Yes and there should be a separate grounding bar. The grounds and neutrals can no longer be in the same bar as this is considered a sub panel.

How about a larger (wider) picture.
 
  #13  
Old 03-24-14, 08:48 PM
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Permit is in the window, it passed rought in and yes I am still scratching my head how it passed.
 
  #14  
Old 03-24-14, 09:12 PM
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I didn't see the trimmed strands when I first posted*, maybe the inspector didn't either.

*Deleted that post.
 
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Old 03-25-14, 06:50 PM
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Many inspectors that I have come across do not really look that closely when an electrical contractor is doing the work. If a home owner is they will tend to take a closer look see. This is just my experience in the field.
 
  #16  
Old 03-26-14, 02:31 AM
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When I installed the new service in my previous house the inspector never even got out of his car. It wasn't until I demanded he sign the permit that he looked at anything and then he was a nit-picking fool. It took two more inspections before I got him off my back and he never did sign the silly permit.
 
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Old 03-26-14, 05:16 PM
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I would have brought the permit to him in his car.
 
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Old 03-26-14, 05:31 PM
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I would have brought the permit to him in his car.
With a cup of coffee. .
 
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Old 03-26-14, 06:19 PM
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I would have brought the permit to him in his car.
With a cup of coffee.
Or donuts. I took a dozen donuts to the inspector's office one morning along with a permit card to be signed. Two inspectors were standing outside as I walked up. One of them said, uh oh, what did you do wrong?
 
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Old 03-26-14, 06:25 PM
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Yep, works every time. One of the least-hassle jobs I remember doing was a string of KFC remodels.

BTW, what HAD you done wrong?
 
  #21  
Old 03-26-14, 06:38 PM
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One of the least-hassle jobs I remember doing was a string of KFC remodels.
Those can be hassle free if you remember your ice skates to cross the kitchen floor!

BTW, what HAD you done wrong?
Me? Nothing, nothing at all. It was the inspector who forgot to sign the card. I just took advantage of the trip to the office to take care of and chat with about 6 inspectors, besides, it all went on the expense account. Keeping a good relationship with all the inspectors is rule #1 in the contracting business.
 
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