Outlet Wiring Outside with a GFI

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  #1  
Old 05-19-14, 11:22 AM
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Outlet Wiring Outside with a GFI

Hi, I am installing a small water fountain with a small water pump. I recently bought my house that was built in 1989. Against the wall there is a electric box with no receptacle (empty) with only wires. The wires inside the box are the following: One white, one Black, two Reds and a green ground. When I opened it up, there was one white and one red connected to each other, and one black and one red connected to each other. The green was alone. So I connected the GFI using the white and the black and the green and the GFI works fine. Problem is that down that same line, is an outlet that controls my Sprinkler pump. That is now not working, yet the GFI is working. Im guessing one of those red or both have to be connected to the GFI? Any help will be greatly appreciated. I can attach a picture if needed. Thanks.
 
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Old 05-19-14, 11:40 AM
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there was one white and one red connected to each other,
Except possibly a switch loop a red should never be connected to a white and from what you wrote it was not a switch loop. Before we go further do you have conduit or cable. The presence of a green wire indicates conduit. Second question is what is the wiring at the receptacle box the sprinkler control is plugged into?
 
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Old 05-19-14, 12:10 PM
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No conduit

Hi, thanks for the quick reply. It's not conduit in there. there is a copper wire coming from the top center of the box from inside the wall and from that, it appears to be a pigtail with a green wire. The box down stream of this one leading to the sprinkler houses a toggle switch to turn power off or on to the sprinkler. The sprinkler itself is turned on manually with a toggle switch in the timer box. I can take a picture of the outlet with the two red wires, I can put it back together how I found it if that would help? I can also loosen the toggle switch to and take a picture of those wires in there?
 
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Old 05-19-14, 01:20 PM
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the box down stream of this one leading to the sprinkler houses a toggle switch
If there is only one white wire and it is part of a switch loop then there is no neutral in the box and it can not be used to power a receptacle.
I can put it back together how I found it if that would help?
You probably need to anyway since it may not be usable for your purpose.http://www.doityourself.com/forum/li...-pictures.html
 
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Old 05-19-14, 05:58 PM
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Here are the two pics.

Hi..these pics have my situation just how I found it. The wall box is back to the wiring as I found it and the toggle switch is just opened up to show the wiring. Notice the two red wires going into the toggle switch. The wall box was connected like this. Like I said, I was able to connect a receptacle to the box and it worked fine, having the two red wires capped. This setup however doesn't allow me to run the sprinkler pump since those two red wires are not connected to anything. Can I not just pigtail a black wire and a white wire from this current configuration in wall box? Adding a white wire to the white and red, and adding a black wire to the black and red, then just connecting the black and red to the receptacle?

Thanks for your time and attention, much appreciated.[ATTACH=CONFIG]indexOf[/ATTACH]Name:  Wall box.jpg
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Size:  35.3 KBName:  Pump toggle.jpg
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Old 05-19-14, 06:20 PM
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Two observations, the first is that upper picture has some definite wiring problems and I would be ashamed to post that picture. The second picture shows what appears to be a four-way switch and this box also has some wiring problems.

Can you manipulate the wiring somewhat and take a few more pictures from the other side of the switch as well as the first box?
 
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Old 05-19-14, 07:11 PM
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Yes, I will take additional pictures and shoot them over in the AM.. sorry for the shameful pics! This is what I found!
 
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Old 05-19-14, 07:39 PM
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Is there a chance that the equipment is 240 volt?

The red should not be on the green ground screw.
 
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Old 05-20-14, 08:40 AM
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Additional Pics

I don't know about 240 Volts.. doesn't look like the pump needs to 240 volts. These are the same pics, different angle, maybe better lighting. There is no red wire connected to a ground screw, it was the angle of the pic that made it look that way...
 
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Old 05-20-14, 08:58 AM
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I would put everything back the way it was and look for a new source of power for your fountain. We don't need to understand the circuit to know it can not be used for your purpose.
 
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Old 05-20-14, 09:57 AM
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Got it.. what about the toggle switch... can I switch out that toggle switch for one that has the top as a toggle and the bottom as an outlet?
 
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Old 05-20-14, 10:13 AM
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can I switch out that toggle switch for one that has the top as a toggle and the bottom as an outlet
No, there is no neutral in the box. Nothing on that circuit is likely to provide a connection for a new receptacle. If the wall outside where you want to plug in the pump is not a bathroom, kitchen, or dining room on the inside of the house you may be able to wire a new receptacle outside to a receptacle inside.
 
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Old 05-20-14, 01:28 PM
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Alrighty then.. Got it.. Thanks so much for your time and attention.
 
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Old 05-22-14, 11:27 PM
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I'd clean up the wiring before you throw it all back together...no copper should be visible for wires (other than a ground) terminating under a marret. Ground wires should be better secured to box ground (they look like they are hanging on by a thread)...think the rule is the wire should go at least 2/3 way around a screw.
 
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