2 way branch from receptacle?

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  #1  
Old 09-30-14, 12:05 PM
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2 way branch from receptacle?

If a recptacle already has a connection to another receptacle in the circuit, is it possible to create another branch from it going in a different direction?
You'd end up with multiple wires on the load connectors or should it be re-wired to use wire nuts/pigtails and branch the circuit?
 
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  #2  
Old 09-30-14, 12:09 PM
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Pigtails are the way to go.

You also need to ensure that the box is large enough to add additional conductors.
 

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  #3  
Old 09-30-14, 12:10 PM
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Basically one wire per screw. Use pigtails and wire nuts for your extended circuits.
 
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Old 10-02-14, 08:57 AM
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So, I'd end up wire nutting 3 wires together?
It would look something like the attached.
Actually, it's more complicated than that as the source is 14/2 but I see that 14/3 is now required if any switches are used?
The first receptacle in the image is actually controlled by a switch right now and I want the switch to control a ceiling light only so I would have to add in a ceiling light there somewhere either to the wire nuts or coming off the load of the last receptacle?

[ATTACH=CONFIG]39242[/ATTACH]
 
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Old 10-02-14, 10:03 AM
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No, best practice all three wires go to the pigtail and only the two pigtails to the screws.
 
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Old 10-02-14, 10:05 AM
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If I add the branch like that then it's going to mean having maybe 8-10 conductors in the receptacle junction box, more if 14/3 is used or switch wiring.
So, a standard junction box won't be enough?
 
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Old 10-02-14, 10:23 AM
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No, best practice all three wires go to the pigtail and only the two pigtails to the screws.
But I can still use the load of the first receptacle to connect to the second one or do you mean that the 2nd receptacle should be nutted in the first junction area?
 
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Old 10-02-14, 10:32 AM
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Old 10-02-14, 10:42 AM
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Doesn't that require extra wire unecessarily though?
For example, if I add another recpetacle to the right of the one in your picture, I would have to add another 6ft of wire back to the wire cap instead of just from the spare terminals on the receptacle?

Same if I have 2 lights at the top...I can't use the load side of any outlet?
 
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Old 10-02-14, 11:04 AM
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Doesn't that require extra wire unecessarily though?
No. I'm sorry but I don't understand why you don't understand. Where is there any extra wire/cable in this diagram.

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  #11  
Old 10-02-14, 11:31 AM
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So, what I'm thinking of doing is adding 2 lights behind a bed but built into the wall.
The 1st light is 3ft away from the junction entry (the first receptacle in the picture).
The 2nd light is another 3 ft away from the 1st light but the wire from this has to go all the way back to the junction and not just the few feet to the 1st light?

Not this:


but this?
 
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Old 10-02-14, 11:37 AM
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You added an additional light and another receptacle ????
You've also mis-drawn the circuit and baffled me in the process.

Both connection methods use the same amount of wire whether you connect the additional wires to the splice or if you connect them to the second set of receptacle screws. Don't forget you still have a ground wire that needs to be connected to the ground splice connection.

You can go from power to light one to light two. Both lights don't have to come back to the junction box.
 
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Old 10-02-14, 11:43 AM
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I was thinking I could just ground the 2nd light to a ground splice on the 1st light?
It's going to end up being around a 30 cu. in junction box for the starting outlet?
 
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Old 10-02-14, 11:53 AM
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You show a single gang box..........

1) Where will you put the second receptacle ? If in another box then it will require a piece of NM cable. That cable should be connected into the splice.

2) Connect the second light off of the first one. You are getting too many wires in the box. How do you plan to switch the bed wall lights ?

3) you added "ceiling light and switch" to the cable on the left. That means you are only taking an always live feed from the receptacle to feed that. That switch has no effect in turning the receptacle on and off.
 
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Old 10-02-14, 01:01 PM
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Something like this:
The bed wall lights will either have a built in switch directly on them or I'll have to add a switch to each of them. If adding a switch to each they would have to run independently.

 
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Old 10-02-14, 01:39 PM
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You are going to need quite a large box to fit that many conductors in it. There has to be an easier way to configure the wiring instead of branching from one box. Put the wiring to the lights out of the switch box instead of a switch loop.
 
  #17  
Old 11-11-14, 07:15 AM
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You are going to need quite a large box to fit that many conductors in it. There has to be an easier way to configure the wiring instead of branching from one box. Put the wiring to the lights out of the switch box instead of a switch loop.

Read more: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/el...#ixzz3Im0MINEc
Only other option I could see is instead of going from the junction/1st receptacle and splitting it that I instead continue a wire from the light switch and then back to the bed wall lights but how would I bypass the switch to keep the circuit working in that case?
 
  #18  
Old 11-11-14, 01:36 PM
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are all these pigtails correct especially the ones from switch to switch?
 
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Old 11-11-14, 03:07 PM
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I'm not following your diagram well enough to judge and am by now confused about what you are trying to do. Ignoring everything that has been written can you please explain exactly what you want to do.
 
  #20  
Old 11-11-14, 06:26 PM
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1 circuit, existing source powers 2 receptacles. I want to have another branch to power 3 lights each with their own switch
 
  #21  
Old 11-11-14, 07:21 PM
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Run power from source to light 1, from light 1, to light 2, from light 2 to light 3. Run a switch loop from each light.
 
  #22  
Old 11-12-14, 07:30 AM
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If I do that then how does the neutral return from light 3 back to source?
Wouldn't all 3 switches have to be on for the return path?
 
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Old 11-12-14, 09:28 AM
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The neutral does not have to return. It never leaves, it just branches off.
Wouldn't all 3 switches have to be on for the return path?
There is no return path except for each individual switch loop.
 
  #24  
Old 11-12-14, 09:49 AM
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doesn't the circuit have to join up at some stage though for current to flow?
If I do a switch loop at each light it will look like this I think:
 
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Old 11-12-14, 10:18 AM
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Switches are not connected to the neutral. The neutral passes unbroken to each light. (Your diagram shows the neutral connected to the switch. It isn't.)

The "white" wire of the switch loop cable is NOT a neutral. In fact the code requires it be recolored black or any color but gray or green to indicate it is not neutral. Notice in the diagram below it marked black to show it isn't neutral.

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Last edited by ray2047; 11-12-14 at 10:56 AM.
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