Can I replace a ground/neutral bar with a larger bar?

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  #41  
Old 04-10-15, 07:32 AM
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Thanks both.

Agree. I've concluded that from the conflicting info between websites. So far on this website there seems to be a very high degree of competence/knowledge/experience across the different areas from the moderators, etc.
 
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  #42  
Old 04-10-15, 07:38 AM
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One more again.

If the NM wires 's moved to the sub-panel are short and I need to lengthen them, do the connections/wire nuts need to be secured in a junction box?

If the NM's do reach the sub panel, but any of the NM wire between ceiling and subpanel has had the sheath removed when they were part of the main panel, does this have to be rectified?
 
  #43  
Old 04-10-15, 07:59 AM
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If the NM wires 's moved to the sub-panel are short and I need to lengthen them, do the connections/wire nuts need to be secured in a junction box?
Yes, if the NM cables are too short to reach the new subpanel they'll have to be spliced in a junction box and the box covered.

If the NM's do reach the sub panel, but any of the NM wire between ceiling and subpanel has had the sheath removed when they were part of the main panel, does this have to be rectified?
Yes, this would also require a splice in a junction box. The stripped cable with exposed wires cannot be outside of either a junction box or a panel.
 
  #44  
Old 04-10-15, 08:34 AM
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Splices can be made in the panel.
 
  #45  
Old 04-10-15, 09:17 AM
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Ok thanks

The stripped cable with exposed wires cannot be outside of either a junction box or a panel.
So here I'm not talking of only like bare ground wires. So if any red, black or green insulated wire are exposed outside of the panel or junction boxes because the main outer NM sheathing was removed, then I would cut those away, make the appropriate splices and utilize the junction boxes. At least that's how I interpret CJ.
 
  #46  
Old 04-10-15, 10:11 AM
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For those circuits I plan to move from the main to subpanel, all of the NM wire for those circuits coming down from the ceiling need to come out of the main panel
No. As PCBoss wrote:
Splices can be made in the panel.
If the two panels are side by side connected by a nipple you can just extend the wire to the new panel using THHN of the same size and color.
 
  #47  
Old 04-10-15, 10:13 AM
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That is correct. 1/4 inch of sheathing inside the junction box. Be sure to use the proper cable clamps on the junction box and remember that the splice must be permanently accessible.
 
  #48  
Old 04-10-15, 12:02 PM
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If the two panels are side by side connected by a nipple you can just extend the wire to the new panel using THHN of the same size and color.
So let's say for example, I had room on the ground and neutral bar's of the main panel. I could splice the two hots in the main panel and route them to the breaker in the sub panel via the nipple. I can land the grounds and neutrals to their respective bars in the main panel or else route them as well to the sub panel bars if no room in the main?
 
  #49  
Old 04-10-15, 12:07 PM
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That is correct. 1/4 inch of sheathing inside the junction box. Be sure to use the proper cable clamps on the junction box and remember that the splice must be permanently accessible.
Do you size the junction box so that you have a knockout for each wire that feeds it or can you do two wires per clamp and yet not get overcrowded?
 
  #50  
Old 04-10-15, 12:29 PM
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I could splice the two hots in the main panel and route them to the breaker in the sub panel via the nipple
Yes, or hot and neutral if 120 volts.
I can land the grounds and neutrals to their respective bars in the main panel or else route them as well to the sub panel bars if no room in the main?
Yes. If the boxes are connected by a metal nipple that serves as your ground. If concentric/eccentric knockout or reducer washer is used a bonding bushing jumpered to the ground bar must be used.
 

Last edited by ray2047; 04-10-15 at 01:01 PM.
  #51  
Old 04-10-15, 09:03 PM
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If the boxes are connected by a metal nipple that serves as your ground.
So if the nipple is sufficiently grounded, does that mean that the green wire (in Ray's diagram below) from the sub panel ground bar to the main panel neutral bar is not necessary?
 
  #52  
Old 04-10-15, 09:45 PM
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So if the nipple is sufficiently grounded, does that mean that the green wire (in Ray's diagram below) from the sub panel ground bar to the main panel neutral bar is not necessary?
That is correct. .
 
  #53  
Old 04-11-15, 05:48 AM
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If the boxes are connected by a metal nipple that serves as your ground. If concentric knockout or reducer washer is used a bonding bushing jumpered to the ground bar must be used.
...........................................
 
  #54  
Old 04-11-15, 06:29 AM
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If the boxes are connected by a metal nipple that serves as your ground. If concentric knockout or reducer washer is used a bonding bushing jumpered to the ground bar must be used.
Which ground bars? Subpanel, main panel or both need a bushing to ensure contact? Course my main panel looks like it has solid knockouts, not concentric/eccentric.
 
  #55  
Old 04-11-15, 06:53 AM
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One bushing in each box jumpered to that boxes ground bar (or ground/neutral bar).
Course my main panel looks like it has solid knockouts
If there are more then one size knock out one in side the other to allow you to open the knockout to multiple sizes that is a concentric or eccentric knock out.

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  #56  
Old 04-11-15, 07:38 AM
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yeah I understand the knockouts....and now each box is jumpered thanks
 
  #57  
Old 04-11-15, 08:09 AM
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I could splice the two hots in the main panel and route them to the breaker in the sub panel via the nipple. I can land the grounds and neutrals to their respective bars in the main panel or else route them as well to the sub panel bars if no room in the main?
Be careful here. The hot and neutral of a circuit need to originate in the same panel. You can not pick up a neutral in one and extend the hot from another.
 
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