120/240 volt circuit

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  #1  
Old 09-15-15, 06:44 PM
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120/240 volt circuit

I have a problem with my pool equipment. I moved in to this house 2 years ago it has an inground pool with a 1 1/2 HP single speed pool pump which is costing me a bundle, I figure it is adding roughly 150-200 dollars a month on my electric bill. I wanted to purchase a variable speed motor, but they require 230 volt 20 amp circuit I looked at my box and here is the set up there is a 20 amp 120/240 volt circuit breaker the wiring appears to be 14G and there are 2 hot (red/Black), 1 neutral (white) and ground (bare) they just disconnected the red wire from the breaker and capped it in the box so I pretty much have everything in place I just need to wire the new pump in and connect the red to the breaker. here is the problem... from the box the line runs out about 60 feet from the house and there is a 15 amp GFCI plug mounted on a post then about thirty feet from that there is a second plug closer to the pool that the pump plugs in to and then from there to the pool heater all on the same circuit. is it possible to connect the red wire making the 20 amp 240 volt circuit but still be able to keep the 110 plugs without running new wiring or adding another circuit? can I just use 1 of the hot wires at the plug and continue the two hot wires out to the pool? use the 2 hot wires for the 230 volt pool pump and 1 hot wire for the 2nd plug and pool heater?( pool heater is gas electricity only powers the panel and igniter) any assistance would be appreciated.
 
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  #2  
Old 09-15-15, 07:06 PM
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Welcome to the forums.

Your new pump requires 240v 20A but #14 wire can only be used for 15A circuits.
Have you actually seen the pump and read it's plate. 20A at 240v sounds like it could be a little high.

You can't tap 120v receptacles off a 120v/240v circuit. You could run 120v/240v to a small sub panel but at 15A you may be lacking to run the pump and heater.

The wiring at your panel is type NM-B (romex) cable. That can be replaced with #12.
If your underground wiring is in conduit you may be able to replace it with #12 also.

You don't run your pump 24 hours a day.... do you ?
I have a 22,000 gallon inground pool with a 1HP Marlow superpump. I only run it 12 hours a day. Sometimes a little more sometimes a little less depending on the weather.
 
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Old 09-15-15, 07:06 PM
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If the wiring is #14 it should not be on a 20 amp circuit.

A gfi is going to see the imbalance of current if the 120 is used at the same time as the 240.
 
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Old 09-15-15, 07:52 PM
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Based on PJ's pump info, I would save the cost of a new pump and install a timer to turn the existing pump on and off automatically. You could then run the pump for less time, rather then only reducing the flow.
 
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Old 09-15-15, 08:26 PM
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Hi guys thanks for the quick responses. The wire gauge was just a guess I can't find the marking on the sheath to confirm. It could be 12G the wiring appears to be good its just been "messed with".As far as the pump goes that's a whole other issue. It is a 110 or 220 pump it is currently wired for 110 my guess is the previous owner did not want to run 2 circuits out there be cause there is another breaker in the sub panel that is currently unused 240 30 amp. The new pump that i wish to purchase requires 230 volt 20 amp circuit, but I need 110 for the heater and I need the plugs for other equipment etc. I run the pump quite a bit because when he re plumbed the pool he only did one side, I assume he did not want to tear up the patio. So the circulation is poor. He also used flex pvc so I'm just going to tear it all out and use 2" sch. 40 rigid pipe.
 
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Old 09-15-15, 08:30 PM
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Sorry I didn't mean to be rude. I'm Randy and new to the forums. Thank you all for your replies
 
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Old 09-15-15, 08:51 PM
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@tolyn & pj
I generally turn the pump on early evening when I leave for work and off when I return in the morning. An auto timer could shave a few hours of run time off each month but as I mentioned earlier the plumbing needs some work so water turnover is slow. The variable speed pump can circulate water just for purpose of turnover through the filter running at 80 watts which would be a huge savings. But power can also be increased to run water features etc which I plan to add in the future. I didn't mention it because I didn't want to bother you guys with all my pool nightmares so I was trying to stick to facts of the electrical issue.
 
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Old 09-16-15, 05:07 AM
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The proper type of 240 volt GFCI unit allows 120 volt usage off of the legs separately. The unit has terminals for the neutral and both hots of the 120/240 volt circuit and there is a white wire coming out to connect with the panel neutral bus.
 
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Old 09-16-15, 08:02 AM
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There are ways that this could be made to work, but to be code-compliant the pump needs its own circuit which is GFCI protected (new requirement since your pool was built). You'll also need to verify the wiring is at least #12, also a code requirement for pools.

If they did the original install right, there should be conduit from the main panel to the pump? Have you seen any?
 
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Old 09-16-15, 12:34 PM
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There is one conduit running out there whether or not I can pull wire for a 2nd circuit through it is another story
 
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Old 09-16-15, 01:06 PM
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My thought is more along the line of replacing the existing wiring with a new feeder for a small subpanel at the pool. If you pull in (4) #10 THHN you can power a 30A four slot panel. This should allow you to install a double pole circuit for the pool pump w/GFCI breaker, a single pole circuit for the heater, and a single pole circuit for the general purpose GFCI receptacle.
 
  #12  
Old 09-16-15, 06:15 PM
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If the pump and pool heater are in a separate building or shed away from the house, then you must run a single feed as described above heavy enough to cover all of the electrical loads, and split up into branch circuits for pump, heater, etc. using a subpanel "out there."
 
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