New construction, SWAG for additional outlets/cans/etc

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Old 05-12-16, 07:08 AM
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New construction, SWAG for additional outlets/cans/etc

I know there is a similar thread below, but didn't want to hijack it....

Getting ready to bid out a new house, 3500sf. I am the architect and owner. I added lots of cans and extra convenience receptacles beyond code requirements to the plan.

As the budget tightens, I am thinking of reducing some of the cans and extra receptacles before I send the plan out for bid. I don't want to waste the electrician's time estimating "maybe/either/or" scenarios, I want to make a decision and finalize the plans.

So I'm asking for guesstimates. If you are bidding a whole new construction project of this size, about how much would you add for each EXTRA receptacle or EXTRA recessed can beyond typical/basic requirements?

I realize this will differ by area and individual estimating methods, but right now I have no clue, so any thing you can tell will help me decide if it is worth it to keep the extras.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 07:52 AM
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They will be more to add later should you decide to add them. I would see if they would bid a code minimum and give you adder prices for each additional.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 08:08 AM
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Unless the walls are not going to be sheetrocked, install all of the receptacles now.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 08:51 AM
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I wouldn't get involved bidding a code minimum.

You've added devices to the original plan..... now you want to remove them for bidding but you may want to re-add them later.

Later when.... during construction ?
 
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Old 05-12-16, 09:09 AM
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The actual dollar amount depends so much on the local area, labor rate, etc that I don't think anything we can give you would be helpful in that regard. However, what are the rest of the plan and finishes like? Is this on the low, middle or high end for your area? My concern in asking is that you don't really want a contactor who specializes in code minimum bids working on a high end house. Likewise, you don't want someone who does a lot of high end custom jobs working on a house where controlling budget is very important.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 09:38 AM
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I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I'm finalizing the plans now. The house was never designed to "code minimum" , if anything, I went overboard with extra convenience outlets and cans, that would be handy to have, but I can live without. I'm thinking of thinning them out to help control the budget, and if I take them out of the plan, I WON't be putting them back in, or installing them later.

"Adder" prices was just what I was looking for, rough idea where you work. I have no clue, whether it is typical to add $10 per can or $100 per can or receptacle. I'd prefer to make a decision now then send the plans out for bid ready to build exactly as drawn.

LOL, finishes are medium/high, but controlling budget is always important. Quality is more important. I've seen a lot of "low end" guys on "high end " jobs and vice versa.
 

Last edited by Levi63; 05-12-16 at 10:00 AM.
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Old 05-12-16, 10:29 AM
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In California most homes are built without ceiling lights in certain rooms.
After living in the homes for awhile, a lot of people want the can lights, ceiling fans, added after the fact. Much more costly to do it later and maybe not as functional.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 11:17 AM
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Not planning to add ANYTHING after the fact. Just trying to determine if it is worth it to have the extras in the first place....depends on the cost differential.

It is 3800 sf, 5 bed, 2.5 bath, w/great room, formal dining and office, wrap around porch). Right now the plan has 100 receptacles, 7 fans, 75 light fixtures (including 38 cans) and 65 switches. I know I can knock that down some, just trying to get a feel for how much it might help my budget.

If I take stuff out, I need to redraw the plans to redistribute the remaining items. I don't want to hand bidding electricians two different sets of plans and waste their time figuring it up both ways. I gotta make a decision.

Rough idea of what it might add to the bill per receptacle or outlet...that's all I am looking for. I know it is more in California and New York and less in Alabama, I get that.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 01:06 PM
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A SWAG for adders beyond code minimum would be around $50 per receptacle and $100-300 per recessed light (depends a lot on size, lamping and trim style), however with this being a pretty good sized job I wouldn't expect anyone who's bidding on this as a whole unit to use a linear price-per-device, but hey that's the WAG.

If you want the extra receptacles also on additional circuits, that would increase the cost. If your lighting plan adds occupancy sensors, dimmers, 3-way or 4-way switching would also add to the cost. Of course things like dimmable LED is substantially more expensive per device than incandescent/halogen.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 01:18 PM
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Thank you very much. That is extremely helpful. I'm sure it varies, so any others who can chime in would be appreciated.

That leads to another question, s'm guessing installing cans is more expensive than flushmounts. Is that because the fixture is usually provided by the electrician, or is it more laborious? I ask that because there are places where I could swap cans out for relatively inexpensive flush mounts (closets, hallways, etc)
 
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Old 05-12-16, 01:59 PM
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Here are a few concepts may help you to make some decisions.

In my sister's house there was only a switch-controlled receptacle for lighting BUT the builder had wired an overhead box to allow for either a surface lamp or a ceiling fan. I added a fan with a lighting kit and used a remote control for both fan speed and lighting control. The bu8ilder had installed a fan-rated box with a blank cover.

In a similar vein there were three switches controlling the lighting on the stairway and the upper hall (two 3-way plus one 4-way switch). She wanted to put a dimmer in the circuit and so I used a multi-station dimmer to allow full control from each switch. The wiring is the same but the simple on-off switches much less expensive than the multi-station dimmers.

One thing that could also be done is to run flexible non-metallic conduit (Smurf tubing) to various locations where you might want to have either a switch, power or perhaps audio/video/ data connections. The Smurf tubing would run to a location where it would be permanently accessible so you can eventually run the wiring. You could either install the terminal boxes with blank covers OR have a detailed map of where the conduit ends to allow for the installation of a box at a future date. The conduit alone is much less expensive than the actual wiring.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 03:03 PM
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The additional cost for cans is that the parts are quite a bit more expensive -- the can itself is anywhere from $10-50 depending on size and style; the baffle and/or trim also runs in the $5-50 range based on style; and the lamps can have quite a range too. There is more labor to install a can.

A standard flush mount fixture box is about $1 or $5 if it's fan-rated and takes 30 seconds to install.
 
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Old 05-12-16, 05:25 PM
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Makes sense. Great ideas to work with. Thanks very much
 
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Old 05-12-16, 06:23 PM
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Just off the cuff here because I'm a good guy and I just did it for the builder. Now is the time to install network, telephone and coaxial cabling.
 
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Old 05-13-16, 04:42 PM
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Thank you, and to add to that, On my folks house, I just noticed they installed the phoe jacks with all of the wires home run to the side of the house, typical in the old days when phone service came in from the street.

.....only thing is they have comcast phone, which means the phone service comes directly from the modem, which will be installed in the office
 
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Old 05-14-16, 12:53 AM
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I just noticed they installed the phoe jacks with all of the wires home run to the side of the house, typical in the old days when phone service came in from the street.
Actually, that is not typical with older homes unless they added the extension jacks after the initial telephone installation. Much more common is "daisy chaining" from one jack to the second to the third, etc. Having home runs is far preferable as it allows you to have different lines (numbers) at different jacks.

...only thing is they have comcast phone, which means the phone service comes directly from the modem, which will be installed in the office
You can disconnect the wiring from the network interface by merely unplugging the test jack and wrapping some electrical tape around the plug. Add a note that telephone service is now being supplied by a VoIP system and then close up the network interface. The note is to alert any telephone company personnel to NOT re-connect the plug. Then simply run a standard telephone base cord from the modem to the nearest installed jack. This will give you service on all the other jacks as well.
 
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Old 05-14-16, 02:09 PM
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Thank you Furd. Will do that.
 
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Old 05-14-16, 02:23 PM
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Receptacles do not add as much as light fixtures do to a job. $40-$50 per receptacle is fairly normal in our area while a can light will be $75 per without trims. Light fixtures and ceiling fans will add more then that. Of course switches will also will add to the job especially if dimmers are required. Dimmers can run from $6 - $80 per dimmer and can be added at any time later so I would recommend not having them installed on the build out.
 
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