A few code questions

Reply

  #1  
Old 09-26-17, 10:58 PM
H
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 100
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
A few code questions

I have a couple of code questions.

1. Is a dedicated circuit required for a home boiler? Am I allowed to put an extra receptacle on that circuit?

2. Is a dedicated circuit required for a porch receptacle? Am I allowed to put an extra receptacle on that circuit?

3. In an unfinished basement, is there anything wrong with putting a receptacle inside a double-gang box (or similar junction box) and mounting the box face-down on a joist?


As you can tell, I'm trying to install a new utility receptacle in my basement (next to the boiler), but I'm trying to figure out what's legal and not legal. It will be far easier for the boiler techs to use.
I'd also like to rewire my porch receptacle to a brand new circuit as the existing circuit is over-loaded.
 
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 09-27-17, 06:42 AM
Geochurchi's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 4,744
Received 66 Votes on 62 Posts
1. Yes as long as the receptacle is a GFCI,make sure the boiler is on the supply side of the receptacle
2.No but also must be on a GFCI and a point of use cover must be installed over the receptacle
3. Yes and it must be on a GFCI circuit,,may not be the best idea to mount the receptacle face down.
Geo
 
  #3  
Old 09-27-17, 07:53 AM
I
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Near Lansing, Michigan
Posts: 10,944
Received 43 Votes on 41 Posts
Hi Hans, with regard to the boiler circuit, you can put a receptacle, but it is only supposed to be used for equipment directly related to the heating system (e.g. condensate pump, circulation pump, humidifier, etc). There are not supposed to be general-purpose outlets on a heating system circuit. It can be used for annual maintenance of the boiler (shop vac, trouble light, etc).

Some jurisdictions require a special disconnect on a boiler circuit based on fire regulations. Usually it's a red switch outside the utility room or at the top of the basement stairs if the boiler is in the basement.
 
  #4  
Old 09-27-17, 09:30 AM
H
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 100
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Geochurchi View Post
1. Yes as long as the receptacle is a GFCI,make sure the boiler is on the supply side of the receptacle
2.No but also must be on a GFCI and a point of use cover must be installed over the receptacle

Do these receptacles themselves have to be GFCI? Or only GFCI protected?

I actually have a brand new INDOOR GFCI-receptacle that I would like to use to protect the porch receptacle. I'm thinking of adding this new indoor GFCI-receptacle to the basement and then branching off to the porch receptacle, which would be GFCI-protected downstream.


Originally Posted by Geochurchi View Post
3. Yes and it must be on a GFCI circuit,,may not be the best idea to mount the receptacle face down.
Geo

Any particular reason why face-down isn't the best idea?
I don't have any aversion to re-orientating it, I just thought face-down would be less strain on an extension cord.
If mounted vertical on a joist, an extension cord would be bent nearly 90 degrees with the weight of the cord going ceiling to ground.
 
  #5  
Old 09-27-17, 09:36 AM
H
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 100
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by ibpooks View Post
Some jurisdictions require a special disconnect on a boiler circuit based on fire regulations. Usually it's a red switch outside the utility room or at the top of the basement stairs if the boiler is in the basement.

Good point. My boiler already has this cut-off switch.
I'll probably just leave the circuit alone and add the new receptacle else-where.
 
  #6  
Old 09-27-17, 11:37 AM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 58,513
Received 1,030 Votes on 956 Posts
I don't know if I 'd call it a special switch. Any hardwired appliance with a motor/fan needs a disconnect method. That switch on the side of the boiler is the service switch. Although it's not required by code.... it's customary to install a second service switch at the top of the stairs entering the basement.

I normally supply a switch/receptacle combo for servicing and maintenance power.
I don't recommend putting a furnace or boiler on a GFI circuit. Use a GFI receptacle at the location for protection.

A receptacle at the ceiling is ok. If it's GFI receptacle then it needs to be able to be reached without a ladder.
 
  #7  
Old 09-27-17, 01:12 PM
Geochurchi's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 4,744
Received 66 Votes on 62 Posts
Just the fact that the cord could fall out easier, you can put the new porch receptacle on the loadside of the new GFCI you plan on installing in the basement.
Geo
 
  #8  
Old 09-27-17, 08:52 PM
H
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 100
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by PJmax View Post
If it's GFI receptacle then it needs to be able to be reached without a ladder.

That sounds incredibly subjective.
A person's height would have to factor into the equation.

Is there any numeric height assigned to this? Or is it more of a "recommendation"?
 
  #9  
Old 09-27-17, 09:13 PM
ray2047's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 33,597
Received 13 Votes on 11 Posts
Is there any numeric height assigned to this?
6'7" is a common maximum height mentioned for various codes in the NEC such as breaker height. (I know sounds odd but it converts to approximately two meters.)
 
  #10  
Old 09-27-17, 09:45 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 58,513
Received 1,030 Votes on 956 Posts
I have receptacles in my basement mounted to the floor joists over some power tools. I can reach them to plug in and reset them,

GFI protected receptacles are required in a garage for a door opener. Since you usually can't reach them without a ladder..... the actual GFI device cannot be at the ceiling.
 
  #11  
Old 09-28-17, 09:56 AM
Z
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 5,259
Received 102 Votes on 95 Posts
Any particular reason why face-down isn't the best idea?
There's no code requirement for orientation, but if it's face down, you're relying on the springs inside the receptacle to hold the connector and weight of the cord.

It could be easily remedied by adding a nail or a small hook in the joist next to the receptacle to loop the cord over. It really comes down to preference though.
 
  #12  
Old 09-28-17, 11:26 AM
H
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 100
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by PJmax View Post
Since you usually can't reach them without a ladder..... the actual GFI device cannot be at the ceiling.

<slinking away quietly>

I installed such a configuration about 4 years ago. Doesn't bother me and I haven't had any problems but sounds like it's not compliant.

The entire garage is protected though.
 
  #13  
Old 09-28-17, 11:35 AM
H
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 100
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Zorfdt View Post
There's no code requirement for orientation, but if it's face down, you're relying on the springs inside the receptacle to hold the connector and weight of the cord.

It could be easily remedied by adding a nail or a small hook in the joist next to the receptacle to loop the cord over. It really comes down to preference though.

If I use a square box downward-facing and mounted with a bracket, it takes up less joist space; effectively allowing me to run cables above the box.

If I mount it vertically, I now have to re-route other cables, or run then above or below the box. Most likely above, but now they will be very close to the sub-floor and accompanying hardwood floor nails.
 
Reply
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
 
Ask a Question
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: