Receptacle upgrade/product applicability

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Old 12-04-19, 12:00 PM
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Receptacle upgrade/product applicability

I am trying to upgrade a combo switch/receptacle and would like a clarification. The new receptacle has separate spots for 2 each hot/white and the current one has 3 of each going into it, each with its own home. I'm not 100% on how this is managed.







I can take additional photos if required. The switch is single pole and has paired leads.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 12:06 PM
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They are using the back stab connections. They are not recommended. They are a common source poor connections. One wire per screw. Use pigtails.

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Old 12-04-19, 12:14 PM
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Yes, but i can pigtail any of them?

Thank you.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 12:50 PM
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The bottom/left red/blk get pigtailed. Don't forget to break off the hot side shorting jumper. The neutral side is hidden in the view, not sure about that side on the jumper.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 12:56 PM
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Yes, but i can pigtail any of them?
You only need to pigtail the one with the red and black. There are two screws for the whites so they won't need a pigtail.

Just a note the new one can NOT be a GFCI. That is a split wired receptacle and should be fed from a double pole breaker.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 02:22 PM
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Hot side shorting jumper? Not following that one.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 02:24 PM
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Note carefully the area between the two brass screws and the two silver screws on the existing recept. There will be either a jumper or evidence of one ripped out. This separates the bottom and top circuit.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 02:28 PM
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This is what I'm taking out:



I've pigtailed the bottom black and the red. There are 2 whites, one was in the screw and the other in the back sticker, the 2nd white screw was left empty.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 02:46 PM
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Yes, you have a cut jumper on that side (HOT). Let's see the other side.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 02:47 PM
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Old 12-04-19, 03:21 PM
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I see what you are referring to but have nothing like that on the new receptacle. The new one just has a pair of screws that have the backwire clamps.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 03:34 PM
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With back wire clamps you can put two wires under each screw. One on each side and clamp it. You don't need a pigtail.
Show us the new receptacle. If you can't cut the tab you can't use it.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 03:40 PM
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Hssh
 
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Old 12-04-19, 07:00 PM
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I guess I'm pooched, i wired it up and had nothing, replaced it with an updated but plain receptacle in the same configuration as the old one and it lit right up.

 
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Old 12-04-19, 07:08 PM
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What is that device? It has a gold and silver on the same side.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 07:12 PM
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I'm guessing it's a USB receptacle.
 
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Old 12-04-19, 07:55 PM
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Yes, just a dual USB enabled receptacle.

 
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Old 12-04-19, 08:11 PM
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You can't use that device in your application.
From the Leviton site.

Do the Leviton USB In-Wall Chargers have a breakoff tab for split power applications?
No.USB In-Wall Chargers cannot be used for split power applications.
 
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Old 12-05-19, 05:52 AM
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Well poop. I have it all wired back up with nicer updated receptacles but that is just that one spot on the kitchen counter that everyone plugs thier phone or iPad or whatever into. I can still use it elsewhere i guess.

Thanks to all that assisted
 
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Old 12-05-19, 06:36 AM
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Your other option is to get rid of the split power.
It used to be code for kitchen receptacles but that was removed from the code years ago. At least in my neck of the woods.

Of course it depends if you will have room in the box for a wire nut to terminate the wire you will not use,
 
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Old 12-05-19, 06:46 AM
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It's pretty tight in there, these new receptacles have far more body to them and as you can see with the USB one, it's massive. But I'm open to giving it a try if I can understand the requirements properly.
 
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Old 12-05-19, 07:38 AM
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Using the third picture as reference.

Lower white gets terminated with a small wire nut.
Lower red and black get connected together with a wire nut,

Upper black and white should come from the same input wire, check that this is true.

Copper gets connected to the green screw
Upper black to the gold screw

Also I like to do a couple wraps of electrical tape around the receptacle body so that the terminals are covered.
Upper white to the silver screw.
 
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Old 12-05-19, 08:31 AM
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That works; the one downside is that you are now have only one circuit available to that new recept; before, there was two.
I, myself wrestled with USB charging near the kitchen, and decided not to have things charging in a potentially wet area. I found a better place in the breakfast nook, at its own, dry counter. I think the loss of a circuit to the kitchentop counters is not desirable.
Is this job near a sink? What is the canadian rule with GFCI's here?
 
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Old 12-05-19, 08:39 AM
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It's is near a sink, but not dangerously so. People have been using this spot as a changing area for many years, I'm not so worried about that type of risk.
The breakers this split receptacle are on are joined:

pic sharing
 
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Old 12-05-19, 09:39 AM
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In the U.S. those circuits would have to 20 amp, I am surprised that Canada allows 15 amp circuits on a kitchen counter.
 
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Old 12-05-19, 09:49 AM
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Canada allow split wired 15 amp receptacles in kitchens. That's more power than a 20 amp circuit. They also allow 20 amp non split circuits. Non split 15 amps are not allowed. As a compromise to allow GFCI you are permitted to modify an existing circuit and have two 15 amp duplexes instead of one split one.
 
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Old 12-05-19, 10:47 AM
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I certainly have better long term plans for the electrical in the house. It is thankfully a 200a box, the house had a hot tub before i bought it (long gone now), but the circuits are arranged strangely: I'd like to update it all to make more sense but for now I'm just working with what i have.
 
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Old 12-06-19, 11:52 AM
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Final post on this - thanks manden and telecom and everyone that assisted, i got what i wanted.

 
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Old 12-06-19, 12:47 PM
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Very clean install, no visible screws. Also, the first USB-C I've seen with a recept.
 
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Old 12-06-19, 01:28 PM
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Thanks. I like these Levitron switches and receptacles because you can get these screw-free wall plates to fit them and they really do make for a cleaner look. Slowly replacing everything in the house with them.

I liked the idea of USB-C in the receptacle as well, now that all new devices are going that way. Wife wants iPhone 11 for Christmas and I'm sure they are USB-C now so the timing was good. Both USBs are 5v charging, and I far prefer this idea to having some ugly adapter into the outlet, etc.
 
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Old 12-08-19, 07:14 AM
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Wife wants iPhone 11 for Christmas and I'm sure they are USB-C now
iPhones and iPads still use the Apple Lightning connector that they've been using for a while now. No plans (as far as we all know) for Apple to move to USB-C.

Still a nice receptacle though!
 
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Old 12-08-19, 07:16 AM
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... USB-C to lightning
 
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Old 12-08-19, 11:18 AM
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Well, adding electronics into receptacles that touch telecom/cellular/laptops will guarantee they get replaced before their 10 year birthday. 👍 Due to obsolescence at least. The life of standards is rapidly approaching 5 years. Right around the corner are smarter USB with more agile/higher current capability.
 
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Old 12-08-19, 11:36 AM
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No argument there, or resistance (no pun intended). Our devices are now the leading edge of consumer technology. We replace and update them willingly on a very regular basis; plugging them into receptacles that are decades old is not ideal. In my work I've had this conversation a number of times and it's not always well received. "Electricity hasn't changed", stuff like that. They way we consume it has changed incredibly.
 
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