Vista 15-P Expansion/Upgrade recommendations


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Old 05-19-10, 08:57 AM
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Vista 15-P Expansion/Upgrade recommendations

Greetings:

I believe I have the Ademco Vista-15P and this system was installed new in March 2004. I have 10 windows, 3 doors, one motion detector and one smoke detector monitored by the unit. I have two keypads as well.

We will be building an addition on to our house on the ground floor which will have 6 windows and 1 door. What would be the best way to upgrade my current system to add the windows and doors for the new addition? Running new wires to the main unit location is going to be a pain as the Vista unit is located inside a closet in the middle of the house. I was hoping to add wireless capability and install either wireless sensors for the new doors & windows or maybe just add a wireless motion sensor in the new room?

I am looking for recommendations/suggestions upgrading my system to accommodate this new room.

Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks,

LOU
 
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Old 05-19-10, 09:23 AM
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Do you have any wireless now? If not I would just add an RF receiver and then add the appopriate RF sensors.
 
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Old 05-19-10, 11:54 PM
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The thing about protecting a room with just a motion sensor is that it isn't protected when you're home and the system is armed "Stay". The room is then a breach in your perimeter.

I recommend having perimeter protection on all openings, and motion for backup. Occasionally intruders find they can throw bricks through windows and step through without opening them. There was a rash of such burglaries lately that had a customer calling for an upgrade. It's really best to protect windows with contacts (to detect opening) and acoustic glass break sensors (to detecting breakage).

Do you already have the installer's manual, and do you have a 6160 keypad to program the additional zones?
 
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Old 05-31-10, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by ChosunOne
The thing about protecting a room with just a motion sensor is that it isn't protected when you're home and the system is armed "Stay". The room is then a breach in your perimeter.

I recommend having perimeter protection on all openings, and motion for backup. Occasionally intruders find they can throw bricks through windows and step through without opening them. There was a rash of such burglaries lately that had a customer calling for an upgrade. It's really best to protect windows with contacts (to detect opening) and acoustic glass break sensors (to detecting breakage).

Do you already have the installer's manual, and do you have a 6160 keypad to program the additional zones?
Chosunone:

Thanks for the insight - I hear what you are saying as to adding contacts to windows and such. As our new room is going to be a 'sun room', we are looking at about 10 new windows and a door. I do have the install manual and two 6160 keypads.

I may have mentioned that getting additional wires to the current controller will be a pain as I would have to fish cables through a couple load bearing walls and do not really want to score the drywall and have to patch & paint. That is why I was thinking wireless - although I am not crazy about having to replace a bunch a batteries all the time either.

We use Hirsh controllers at my office and we tie different campus buildings together over our data network. Could I do the same thing with ademco products? I am able to extend cat 5 to the new addition due to the location of existing data jacks. I am wondering if I can put a second controller in the new addition and link the old and new controllers over my home network or via wireless somehow?

They begin pouring footers tomorrow, so I have a little time. But If I need to hardwire the new windows and door, I better get it done during framing.

I welcome all suggestions.

Thanks... LOU
 
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Old 05-31-10, 04:33 PM
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I am not a Security Professional, but I have a Vista 20P with 20 zones, and 17 are wireless. My 3 year old system has not had batteries replaced, yet. Nor has the battery at the panel failed. I am curious as to why you would not want to hard wire your new keypad back to the panel? I don't know if wireless keypads are available, but anything wireless is subject to interference. If you link the old & new pads together, then you have the potential for another horrific problem if you encounter trouble. You'd have to figure out which keypad is causing the problem and what is causing the problem to the key pad in trouble. I wouldn't want to have to shoot that trouble. Phone jacks are often looped together, by contractors. When the line goes in trouble, it's extremely time consuming to fix and it's always the last RJ or wiring you examine. I would think that running cat5 or 22 gauge back to the panel would be the best option. I am just trying to learn more about my own system, and how others install them etc. The Pros advice is extremely valuable in this forum. Hope you don't mind my thoughts and questions.
 
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Old 05-31-10, 04:56 PM
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If you can get a single 4 conductor either back to the main control, or even to one of the existing keypads, you can remotely locate a hardwired zone expander, and run your new opening wiring to it, without needing to get the whole mess back to the main control box.

A 15p will take up to 16 more zones using the hardwire expanders.
 
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Old 05-31-10, 07:43 PM
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I strongly prefer hardwire keypads, but Ademco does have wireless keypads that seem to work okay. They are all addressed, so if one has trouble, you know which it is.

Whenever practical I prefer to go hardwired, but this definitely sounds like an application that calls for wireless.

10 windows done with wireless can get expensive, but if the windows are as close together as most sunrooms, you might be able to wire several windows on each transmitter.

The 5816 sensor/transmitter has a built in mag switch and also a loop for wiring an external magnetic switch. The on-board switch and external switch transmit as separate zones. If the windows are close enough, you can use a series loop on the loop input.
Ademco also has a 5817 3-zone transmitter, no onboard switch but 3 loop inputs. If you can make some short wire runs among the windows, you might be able to install all 10 contacts with just a few transmitters.

As vwgal indicated, you won't need to change batteries all the time. In most applications you're good for at _least_ five years on the door/window contacts; probably less time on the RF keypad but I don't have experience on those. I haven't been forced into using one yet.

Of course, I can't say if this is practical for you since I don't know what kind of windows you have or their layout, or how easy it is to make wire inconspicuous. I'm just putting options out there.


Sun rooms have a special problem with PIR motion sensors. The lenses/mirrors should _never_ be exposed to direct sunlight, or even where they will catch a strong reflection, like from a window in sunlight. Mirrors and even glass picture glazing and glass coffee table tops can cause problems.

PIR's react to spots in their coverage area that change temperature suddenly, which happens a lot in sunrooms on cloudy days--the sun comes out from behind a cloud and metal objects suddenly heat up in a dozen places in the coverage area. It can even fool the pulse-count algorithms the better PIRs have.

Ademco has some good wireless glassbreak sensors that I recommend instead of PIR's.
 
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Old 06-03-10, 02:06 PM
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Thanks everyone for the info.

At this point I think I will need to figure out a way to pull cable from the existing panel to the new location. I assume if I can get a cable to the new location, I can add an expansion module there. All the new windows and doors can be hardwired to the expansion module. Gettng a cable from the main panel to the new room is going to be a pain, but looks like the way to go. Can I use CAT5e to connect the main panel to the expansion module? I already have a box of bulk CAT5 cable gathering dust in my garage.

LOU
 
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Old 06-03-10, 04:40 PM
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Cat-5 is actually a little small (the connectors on this hardware assumes 22 gauge as the minimum; cat-5 is 24 gauge). If you use all 8 conductors, and double up each connection, you will be fine.
 
 

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