GE Concord 4

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Old 10-22-13, 06:36 PM
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GE Concord 4

I just installed a "new-old-stock" GE Concord 4. I installed 6 of the GE 2-wire smokes (400 series) as instructed on to zone 8. The problem is that if I activate any one of the smoke detectors, it does not initiate an alarm at the panel. However, if I simply remove one of the wires from any detector, the alarm will sound. I cannot figure out what is going on.

I understand that zone 8 is always on, and appears to be. I have combed the manuals for info but have come up empty on this. Any suggestions on how to get the system to go into "fire alarm activation" when a smoke detector is activated?? Thanks.
 
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Old 10-22-13, 08:24 PM
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What zone type did you program them into? How are you "activating" them? Are you using actual smoke (like canned smoke)??
 
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Old 10-23-13, 02:22 AM
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Judging by the described behavior (alarm on breaking the circuit) could you possibly have the EOL resistor in series instead of in parallel to the end of line? Conversely, could you have learned in the loop incorrectly so that it's looking for a NC instead of NO?
 
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Old 10-23-13, 05:58 AM
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GE Concord 4

The resistor is in parallel at the end of the line. I did not have the system "learn" as it is supposed to be default programmed for zone 8 out of the box. So, maybe I need to teach the system that the devices are NO.

I did use a punk to try the smoke detectors.....

What would be the best path from here? The manual is not written as a step by step proceedure for anything. Very confusing. Open to your suggestions.......
 
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Old 10-24-13, 04:41 AM
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Zone 8 is a type 13 out of the box....Change it to type 26
Turn ON the 2-wire smoke feature under ONBOARD OPTIONS as well..
 
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Old 10-25-13, 09:19 AM
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GE Concord 4

OK GE Guy, not to sound like an idiot.....well, OK, I'm an idiot! Please instruct how to do the zone change with the "user keypad" (alpha numeric) and not the "installer programming keypad", which I don't have. If this manual was written with us idiots in mind, I would not be having any of these issues. Thanks GE GUY. I was feeling for a while that this was going to be a futile exercise. Hope springs eternal.
 
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Old 10-25-13, 09:23 AM
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GE Concord 4 - 2 wire smokes

One more question: if I use the "learn sensors" feature, wouldn't this fix the 2 wire smoke N.O. issue??
 
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Old 10-25-13, 07:23 PM
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If you have an alpha keypad, that is what is used for installer programming...do you know the installer code?
 
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Old 10-27-13, 05:20 AM
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GE Concord 4

Since the panel was "new", I am assuming the default installer code is 4321. Maybe I am assuming too much with this panel. What I find confusing, is that the instructions are not clear on how to select the function you wish to control. For example, when I finally get to the function I wish to control on the display, I cannot figure out how to "select" that function. Then, I would need to know how to get out of that function when finished. It's always a "best guess" on how to do that the way the manual is written. That is why I am asking for a detailed "consumer style" instruction stream on how to make the changes to the zone 8 assignments.......as if I was the end user.........which I AM! Thanks.
 
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Old 10-27-13, 05:44 AM
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GE Concord 4

The manual is clearly written for use with the "installer keypad" that gets connected to the header inside the panel. The nomenclature on the user keypad is different. If the manual had been written for use with the wall mounted alpha-numeric keypad, I would probably not be asking all of the these questions...It almost seems that GE is excluding the DIY person from having a successful install by design.......the manual!!
 
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Old 10-27-13, 04:44 PM
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Actually, yes, they are excluding DIYs. Security system installation manuals are written with the assumption that the installer has basic electrical/electronic skills, understands standard electrical/electronic nomenclature and schematic symbols, and has access to factory training and/or dealer technical support. In no guise does the alarm industry take the DIY market into account.

Quite bluntly, the liability potential scares the industry, collectively, witless, so they just don't do it.

That said:
If you have one of the following keypads (from page 9 of the installer manual):
You may use the following touchpads for installer/user programming and system operation.
• SuperBus 2000 2x16 LCD touchpad
• SuperBus 2000 2x20 LCD touchpad
• SuperBus 2000 2x20 VFD touchpad
• SuperBus 2000 ATP 1000 touchpad
• SuperBus 2000 ATP 2100 touchpad
• SuperBus 2000 ATP 2600 touchpad
• SuperBus 2000 GTS 50 touchpad

If you are unable to get into installer programming with any one of these keypads, then the code you are trying to use is most likely _not_ the installer code.
 
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Old 10-28-13, 02:01 PM
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Ge concord 4

Thanks to you MrRon and GE GUY for your responses. I will be going down to my son's location next week where the system is installed and try to make sense of the new info. So, just to be certain, please confirm this: the DEFAULT factory installer code is 4321.....along with the default user code.......correct? I did not change anything in the system programming other than time and date (even that was not straight forward)

Also, assuming that I DO have one the superbus 2000 keypads you list, can you give me the general command structure for those keypads? I know that 8+code+0+0 gets me into the program mode.....BUT, what is the "enter" command to choose the item on the screen for changes? What is the "confirm" command once the selected item is changed to the desired value? Then, what is the PROGRAMMING EXIT command so that all is stored and to get back to regular operation?

I don't know the model number of the keypad BUT I did go on-line and found a picture of what looks to be the exact same one. The picture is a: "60-983 GE Security ATP1000 Alphanumeric Touchpad". Maybe there are other GE pads with the same look with different models, I don't know. Do you think this will work for programming zone 8???

Thanks again for your patience with me on this.....
 
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Old 11-07-13, 09:27 AM
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Unhappy GE Concord 4

OK, so if I boil it all down, I cannot get into the program mode, which has been causing me all my confusion all along. I use 8+4321+00 and get a beep. The keypad returns to time and date. I tried 8+1234+00 and get the same thing. This supposedly being a "NEW" panel, shouldn't the default installer and user codes be 4321? (sure looked new when I got it....wrapped and all)

So, does this mean I am SOL? I simply wish to get 2-wire smoke detectors to work on zone 8. The other thing I am thinking is to replace the 2 wire detectors with 4 wire detectors and use them as NC (instead of the NO for the two wire) as it looks like zone 8 responds to openning the circuit as it stands.

You comments and help to finish this project is greatly appreciated. I have lost the rest of my hair..............
 
  #14  
Old 11-07-13, 01:22 PM
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Very often, installers will pre-prep new alarm systems with their own installer and dealer codes (and often, standard zone configurations) to speed up the install process. Sometimes they even order them from the factory that way. If the default installer and dealer codes from the manual don't work, with Concords, you are pretty much done, short of a lucky guess.
 
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Old 11-08-13, 08:15 AM
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hit "94321"

what does the keypad say?
 
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Old 11-08-13, 12:21 PM
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Red face Ge concord 4

94321 takes me into the "user program" area. The keypad certainly responds to that code. Its the 84321 that gets me no-where. IF I am SOL with this system, do you know where I can get a NEW panel circuit board cheap? Thanks.
 
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Old 11-10-13, 06:46 PM
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If that is the case, my guess is that the installer code has not been changed since 4321 gets you into user programming...I also suspect that your keypad is actually a 600-1020 FTP 1000 Keypad (looks almost identical to the ATP 1000). Bottom line, the FTP version doesn't like the 8432100 command...Try 8432103...
Do you see SYSTEM PROGRAMMING??
 
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Old 11-11-13, 06:33 AM
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Lightbulb Ge concord 4

GE GUY, I will try that code when I am down to see my son this coming weekend. Sure hope it works! I will report back a week from today. Thanks.
 
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Old 11-17-13, 10:51 AM
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Question Ge concord 4

OK, when I use "8-4321-03", I get a very brief "PROGRAMMING" on the display and then it immediatley goes to "ACCT". Scrolling through the options (using A,B buttons) give me the following selections: "Learn Sensors, CS Phone, ACCT, End Program". I did not start hitting other buttons because I don't know what will happen.

I don't seem to have access to the "System Program" section. Don't know where to go from here...........Maybe I should pull the keypad from the wall and look at the model number??????????????? Thanks.
 
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Old 11-17-13, 07:55 PM
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As I suspected, you have the fixed english keypad...You ARE able to get into programming (you were in it), but that keypad only allows access to the Account Numbers, Sensors, and the Phone Numbers.

Easy fix here is to get your hands on one of the keypads MrRon mentioned earlier in the thread...then you can program whatever you want...the good news is that nobody changed the codes on you
 
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Old 11-18-13, 12:55 PM
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Red face Ge concord 4

AAAHHH, the source of my frustration (at least with the alarm system!!). Thanks GE GUY. I will look for one. IF you happen across a cheap used keypad, please let me know. It would even be wonderful to borrow one for programming, if anyone reading this has one kicking around. Thanks so much for all of your responses and time. You too Mr. RON! Best Regards......Art.
 
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Old 11-20-13, 03:26 PM
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Question Ge concord $

Just ordered a clean, used ATP1000 Keyboard for $25. Sure hope this works!
 
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Old 01-30-14, 06:31 PM
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Red face GE Concord 4 system

OK, it's taken me a while to get to it BUT you were right GE GUY. The keypad was a non-alpha-numeric look-alike! Got the right pad and VIOLA!! Program City!! Now all is working. Still boggles my mind why GE even made the non alpha-numeric pad in the first place. It really wasted time, energy and money. Corporate stupidness and greed. Anyway, I am all set. Thanks again for the help. OVER and OUT!! Art.
 
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Old 01-30-14, 08:12 PM
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Mass market installers have preference for selling customers the much cheaper keypad model for their "bargain" install packages. Either the installing tech has a programming keypad that they use for setup, or they use the downloading software.
 
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Old 02-04-14, 05:41 AM
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Exclamation Ge concord 4

Mr. Ron, I agree with the concept BUT I looked inside each of the two keypads: the non-alpha numeric and the replacement alpha numeric. There is virtually no difference in the two by construction and components. The cost difference at manufacture could not be more than pennies if anything at all. There is no reason, other than CONTROL over the CUSTOMER, that one would choose to manufacture, market or install a NON alpha numeric pad into a system. I am convinced it is a calculated effort by the alarm manufacturers and sellers to ring every dollar out of the market place. Although I am not an alarm expert, I am tech savey and it took me a long time to figure out what was going on. Even the keypad that was with the system LOOKED and ACTED just like the alpha numeric model but wouldn't allow access to the program area. Not even a model number on the back of the keypad..........OK, enough venting. I have seen this scenario in other industries as well. Control the dollars............

Thanks for your help during the ordeal. I am glad to have this resource so the "secrets" can be unlocked! All the best to you and GE Guy! Over and Out!Art.
 
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Old 02-04-14, 06:02 AM
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For the manufacturer, there is not really a big cost difference, but for the installer, there is a pretty big difference in price, even at the wholesale level. Especially when they are doing those super cheap install specials.

That said, there is a bit of control issue involved, too.

I am not fond of the systems that require specific "programming keypads".
 
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Old 02-04-14, 05:45 PM
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These systems were not manufactured nor marketed to be installed by DIYers....Ford, GM, Honda etc, do not sell directly to the public. They go through a network of dealers. Much the same in the alarm world...In this ultra competitive business, price is often the bottom line to may dealers. They want a cheaper keypad option that does not have all the bells and whistles in order to save a few bucks. When you order 5,000 keypads a month, a $4-5 difference in price is huge. There are actually quite a few differences between the ATP and the FTP versions of the keypad...yes they look similiar...functionally, they are very different.

Another common use for the FTP version of this keypad are for those homes and/or businesses that have multiple keypads installed. Do you really need 2 ATP keypads for programming? No, you don't. The FTP is a solid secondary keypad for arming, disarming etc...
 
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Old 02-11-14, 09:55 AM
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All understood. Thanks again for your help. In the end, all is working as it should without going through a dealer/installer. I am sure i will have more questions in the future as I sxpand the system down the road. Art.
 
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