Replaced Motion - Now Won't Arm


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Old 06-28-18, 02:28 PM
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Replaced Motion - Now Won't Arm

I have an Ademco 6128 and Vista 20 system. Had to temporarily remove a wired motion detector while doing remodeling... after I reinstalled it, the motion detector would correctly pick up motion, but now the keypad shows "Not Ready". If I try to arm the system it won't let me and shows a Zone 3 fault, which is the zone for all 4 motion detectors. I found a small hairline crack in the shield on the detector so I replaced it with a new Honeywell IS215T detector... still getting the Zone 3 fault. I removed the backup battery and disconnected the power, then rehooked it all back up hoping it would clear, but no luck. Do I need to reprogram anything to get this to work?
 
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Old 06-28-18, 03:28 PM
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Welcome to the forums.

Putting all four motion detectors on one zone is a lesson in futility. It can be almost impossible to determine which one faulted when the zone gets tripped.

Since you have four motions.... they are probably, or should be, set up in a closed circuit so that if any one trips it opens the zone.

Can you post a picture of how you wired the new one ?
How-to-insert-pictures
 
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Old 06-28-18, 03:37 PM
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Connected Red to +
Black to -
Yellow to NC
Green to C
 
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Old 06-29-18, 03:42 PM
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What's normal ???

Probably an issue understanding normal. Back when they were Ademco, Honeywell adopted the National Electrical Manufacturers Association definition of Normal: with no external forces acting on the switch.

For a relay used in a motion detector, that means the contacts are normal when the relay is unpowered. Underwriters Labs requires a detector to go into alarm when it loses power, so the normal operating condition of a relay not in alarm is powered. So the Normally Closed contact is Open when the detector is not in alarm;
the Normally Open contact is Closed when the detector is not in alarm.

Move the wire from the NC terminal to the NO terminal and see if it doesn't cure the problem.

Relays aren't the only thing where this applys. On a magnetic contact, normal means with no magnetic field present, so it appears the markings are backward.

Remember:
  • Use Normally Open on a Closed loop
  • Use Normally Closed on a Open loop

 
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Old 06-29-18, 04:51 PM
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I swapped the green to the NC and yellow to C. I entered the password to clear the system but still have the problem. If I try to arm the system I still get an Zone 3 open circuit error.
 
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Old 06-30-18, 12:07 AM
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Yamboro, your new PIR only has two terminals to connect to your Zone 3 wire loop, so as long as green & yellow are the zone loop wires, and you connect either one to C and the other to NC, you can't get them wrong.

I'm going to assume that red and black are the power wires, otherwise your PIR wouldn't work at all.

Unless programmed otherwise, Zone 3 needs a 2000 Ohm (2K-Ohm) Resistor in the loop, called an EOLR, End-Of-Line Resistor. Sometimes it's installed on the last device in the zone loop, other times it's installed on one of the zone terminals of the Control Panel. It will have color bands on it, Red-Black-Red-Gold. The EOLR is usually so small that it can be completely covered by electrical tape on a splice, and go unnoticed. Is there any chance you removed the EOLR when you changed out the PIRs? Hopefully you didn't get rid of the old stuff before you got the new one to work.

If you don't know what an electronic resistor looks like, Google it. You need to know what you're looking for. Look at pictures so you know what a 2000 Ohm resistor with the red-black-red bands look like (the 4th band, gold, is for the tolerance, which is usually 5%).

Try this test. Take the green and yellow wire ends and twist the together (or better yet, clamp them together with a binder clip or clothespin or something, as long as the bare ends are pressed together) and see if that makes Zone 3 set up. If Z3 _still_ shows open, the problem is not in the PIR or PIR connections. You need to locate where that resistor is and make sure it's in the loop.
 
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Old 06-30-18, 03:47 AM
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Simple test: Short the two zone wires at the detector (NOT the power wires) together.

Does the zone close? If yes, then there is something wrong with the new detector or how it's installed, if no, then the problem may be at one of the other detectors. In that case you do the same test at each one of them until the zone closes.

If you hard short all of the zone wires at each detector and the zone still shows open, then you likely have a problem with the field wiring in the location.
 
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Old 06-30-18, 12:34 PM
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Thanks to everyone for the assistance! I shorted the C/NC pair on each PIR one at a time, but the open circuit issue remained, so I went under the floor and found the wire for the motion I had originally removed and reinstalled. I cut the C/NC pair in that cable under the floor and shorted it there. Problem solved, so I now know that during the remodel a screw or nail severed one of the wires near the PIR. Now I just have to get creative and figure out how to route a new cable to the PIR without tearing the house apart. Thanks again.
 
 

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