Aluminum wrapping/capping wood trim HELP!


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Old 10-12-09, 11:37 AM
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Aluminum wrapping/capping wood trim HELP!

Hi, I am hoping some one can help me out ASAP. I had my door and window trim on my garage wrapped/capped in aluminum. The garage has horizontal wood lap siding on it so the surface the capping would go into is a zig-zag along the sides. What they did is stop at the highest point and caulk the rest (about 3/4") which I think is not the correct way and looks pretty shoddy. Should they have either removed the existing caulk between the siding and trim or run a circular saw with a thin kerf blade around the edge of the trim to make a groove so they could slip the aluminum past the siding? I can't find any info anywhere on the correct way. A friend at work said they did the saw method when they capped his trim, but I just want to be sure before I talk to the contractor. They still have to install windows on my house and so I haven't paid them in full yet, but they'll be here soon. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks!
 
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Old 10-12-09, 02:52 PM
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dale426,

Welcome to the forums.

THAT has to look ugly!! If there wasn't a gap between the lapped siding and the wood trim around the door and window for the aluminum trim coil to slip into, they should have made one. The coil would have then been cut so that it would extend into that gap, almost to the back of the lapped siding. (The coild should be bent into a "U" shape, with one leg going back to the door or window, the face across the wood trim, and the other leg returning back into the lapped siding.) That leg into the lapped siding should go at least 1/4" past the thinnest (top) part of the siding. The joint between the siding and the coil should them be caulked.
 
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Old 10-12-09, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by lefty View Post
dale426,

Welcome to the forums.

THAT has to look ugly!! If there wasn't a gap between the lapped siding and the wood trim around the door and window for the aluminum trim coil to slip into, they should have made one. The coil would have then been cut so that it would extend into that gap, almost to the back of the lapped siding. (The coild should be bent into a "U" shape, with one leg going back to the door or window, the face across the wood trim, and the other leg returning back into the lapped siding.) That leg into the lapped siding should go at least 1/4" past the thinnest (top) part of the siding. The joint between the siding and the coil should them be caulked.
Hello Lefty,
Wow! Thanks for the quick reply!

You're right it IS ugly! The first time my wife saw it she said "OMG". I was thinking "you've got to be kidding me". I told them if that's the best they could do, take it off because it'll look better if I painted it again. They tried to make it look better but it's still bad. That was around the window and side door. Around the two main openings they wanted to just make a straight, boxy looking, about 4" x 4" cap which would have eliminated about 3 or 4 steps in the trim. It would have looked like I had a 4" x 4" for trim. I asked them if they could follow some of the steps to which the reply was "impossible". I told them to forget it then. After they thought about it they said they could put a couple of the steps in, which ended up looking 10 times better. Of course they leave a 1/2" gap, on one of the steps, in the corner where the top piece meets the side piece, so they put a huge bead of caulk in the corner. The guy tried to give me some lame excuse about how his snips cut good from one direction into a corner but not the other so that's why he can't cut it closer. Aaaaagh!

Anyway, thanks for the help and letting me get that off of my chest. I have more confidence now going to the place that contracted these guys and telling them I want it done the RIGHT way, the way you stated. I hope they don't give me a hard time. They still have to install about 20 Marvin windows and I'm worried I'm going to have to keep and eye on them all of the way.
 
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Old 11-09-09, 06:13 PM
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question about making the gap in the siding

Originally Posted by lefty View Post
dale426, Welcome to the forums. THAT has to look ugly!! If there wasn't a gap between the lapped siding and the wood trim around the door and window for the aluminum trim coil to slip into, they should have made one. The coil would have then been cut so that it would extend into that gap, almost to the back of the lapped siding. (The coild should be bent into a "U" shape, with one leg going back to the door or window, the face across the wood trim, and the other leg returning back into the lapped siding.) That leg into the lapped siding should go at least 1/4" past the thinnest (top) part of the siding. The joint between the siding and the coil should them be caulked.
Hi, The windows installers were out and I asked them about doing what you said, making a gap between the siding and the existing wood trim so the aluminum could be slipped in there. He brought up the point that they would have to cut past the corners to get the gap in there at any depth if they used a circular saw, because of the radius of the blade (this crossed my mind too). Would they be cutting the sides AND top of a door way? I assume they would be. It would look like and X at the corners where the two cuts meet. Is there a way to stop right at the corner with a jig saw or something? Or should they just be able to pull away the rest of the caulk between the siding and the trim after they get to the corner? Thanks for any info you can give me!
 
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Old 11-09-09, 07:30 PM
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Hi, Dale. Don't mean to butt in on Lefty, but I do this all the time using either a cordless skilsaw or a reciprocating saw, depending on the situation. In either case, they do not need to cut so deep as to cut beyond the corner. If they use a skilsaw, they can treat the "rounded cut" on the corners a couple different ways. Try to clean the corners out with a reciprocating saw. (A Fein Multimaster actually works best for this.) Or if they own a tin-snips (I'm being sarcastic) they can simply snip the slight curve on the metal which is not that hard. It doesn't have to match "perfectly" because a bead of caulk will cover the cut edge, like Lefty said. Not doubting their ability but it's not brain surgery. Workers tend to make excuses for things they don't want to do / aren't willing to try. I think they just don't want to rewrap your window.

Regarding his snips that only cut good in one direction, you might buy him a left and right tin snips and give it to him as a gift. (green handle/ red handle). Be sure to include the directions. Again, being sarcastic. I would think they would own these if they are in the window business. Personally I like the offset ones.
 
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Old 11-10-09, 06:12 AM
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Excellent advice. Off topic, sort of. I had to do the same thing on a log home (older) a week or so ago. All the interior trim was just 1x4's nailed to the window framing. Behind was ugly, showing the window framing and log ends. Had to remove all the trim, cut back on the logs 3/4" to the depth of the log radius and insert 1x pieces to meet the trim. Couldn't believe it was done so haphazardly. Similarly on your metal trim, don't accept anything less than professional work that looks good and will give long service.
 
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Old 11-10-09, 09:48 AM
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I removed some aluminum trim once that the contractor had cut the edge of the trim to match the peaks and valleys of the horizontal siding. It looked really good and I would never have replaced it if it hadn't gotten damaged in a hail storm. It would have taken a lot of time to do something like that though.
 
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Old 11-10-09, 09:34 PM
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XSleeper, you know damned well that I would NEVER view a post from you (or a whole bunch of others!!) as "butting in"! The more opinions we can get, the merrier!!

I'm pretty sure that if you, me, and Larry (Chandler) were to do 3 identical jobs like this on the same street, we would all have ended up with 3 jobs that looked virtually the same, and there is NO WAY that the Missus would have come home and said "OMG!!"

What dale426 got was a hack job. For an extra hour's labor, it could have been beautiful!

The BS about the 'radius of the saw blade' or the 'way the snips cut' -- HORSE PUCKY!! That's why we have more than one saw on the truck and several different snips in the tool bag! And, since we carry more tools in the arsenal, a quality job is going to cost a few $$ more.

The extra $50 or $100 to do the job is the difference between the Missus coming home and saying "OMG" or "BEAUTIFUL!!"

I know which one I would rather spend the rest of the evening with!!!
 
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Old 11-11-09, 05:21 AM
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That's why most GC's call me when they get in a tight. I pull up with my jobsite trailer and virtually have any tool needed to do a job. Big ones are in the shop, but "making" things from nothing get you repeat jobs every time. And having the right tool for the job is an understatement. BUT, as Mike said, the customer pays for all the tools and knowledge. I ain't cheap, but I'm easy.
 
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Old 11-11-09, 02:28 PM
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Hey guys, THANKS for the input! I'm staying home from work today just so I can keep an eye on what's going on. The guys that put the windows in weren't bad. The one that was in charge seemed to at least want to do a good job. They put a couple of the windows in so there was a big opening at the top in the old siding and not much of one at the bottom. I saw it when I came home and was going to ask why they did that the next day. When I went out there to talk to him, he actually said he could move the two windows up another inch if I wanted before I even mentioned it. The biggest thing was trying to make sure they put in enough foam to cover all of the gaps. When one of the guys was getting ready to put the trim inside on, I had to tell him to fill some areas where I could see light through. I thought the same people were going to be out today to finish putting up the aluminum wrapping outside, but it was the same guy who did the bad job on the garage. I had asked that he not come back to do any more work. We got into it right away because he started putting up wood for the aluminum and I tried to tell him they moved the window so he needed to put more foam in there to seal it up again. Unfortunately, there's a language barrier with him and the other guys.

Long story short, I'm getting pretty much what I wanted. They are going to fix the garage wrapping, but wouldn't have if I hadn't asked them about it AGAIN! I ended up just doing the foam sealing around the windows myself because I was tired of watching him and having to tell him where to put it and to put more in. They weren't going to put any support in for my bow window either. It's 98" x 53" and 5 pieces. Does it need it? They tried to make me believe "no".They finally agreed to put in some cables to support it, as they talked about when quoting the job. Just before that a "boss" was by and going to put in a 2 x 4 support underneath just to keep me happy, not as if it needed it.

About the left and right tin snips, I have some. I brought them up from the basement after he made the comment about his snips only cutting good in one direction. He tried them and they worked fine, kind of made a funny face and that was the end of it. He still used his snips anyway.

At least the wifey is happy with the new windows
 
 

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