New fence gate post warped already?

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  #1  
Old 04-22-18, 07:31 AM
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New fence gate post warped already?

Hello all,
Installing new wood fence using 4x4 PT Pine #2 GC posts. I used a 10 footer for gate hinge post (left), dug 3 1/2 foot deep 12” wide hole and put 6” of gravel, one 50lb bag and two+ 80lb bags of concrete. It’s been several weeks, and this post appears to be warping away from latch post and It gets worse, the higher up it goes.
What would you do?
 
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  #2  
Old 04-22-18, 12:19 PM
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IMO, since it is warping away, not toward, that might be a blessing in disguise. The weight of the gate (once you mount it) will want to pull the hinge side post back over toward the latch side. Plus, when you build the fence, you can push the post back with your horizontal boards simply by the length you cut them. If the next post is plumb... and you cut your 2 horizontals the same length, in theory that would help push the hinge post back over.

If you want to keep those 2 posts plumb and parallel, you really ought to nail a temporary board across the top to KEEP them parallel until the fence is built. If it's 43" across at the bottom, (outside to outside) it ought to be 43" across at the top. So cut a 2x4 43" long, and nail it to the top of one side, then pull the posts together and nail it on the other side. That's a very simple precaution to take. Wood warps. Use a ratchet strap around the top of both posts if you can't push them together by hand.
 
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Old 04-22-18, 12:38 PM
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Not a lot can be done short of replacing if what Xsleeper does not work or you don't want to do what he says. If you replace it, make sure the treated post is "weathered" before placing in cement. I'm betting the wood was still wet or heavy from the pressure treatment Most pressure treated lumber is not properly kiln dried prior to treatment. You need to buy from reputable lumber company.Not what you normally get from the big box stores.
 
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Old 04-22-18, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
IMO, since it is warping away, not toward, that might be a blessing in disguise. The weight of the gate (once you mount it) will want to pull the hinge side post back over toward the latch side. Plus, when you build the fence, you can push the post back with your horizontal boards simply by the length you cut them. If the next post is plumb... and you cut your 2 horizontals the same length, in theory that would help push the hinge post back over.

If you want to keep those 2 posts plumb and parallel, you really ought to nail a temporary board across the top to KEEP them parallel until the fence is built. If it's 43" across at the bottom, (outside to outside) it ought to be 43" across at the top. So cut a 2x4 43" long, and nail it to the top of one side, then pull the posts together and nail it on the other side. That's a very simple precaution to take. Wood warps. Use a ratchet strap around the top of both posts if you can't push them together by hand.
Thanks!
I was kind of hoping along those "blessing in disguise" lines because if I replace it, the same thing can happen since I only have big box store wood, nearby. And thanks for the heads up on nailing a temporary board and using ratchet straps across the top, to KEEP them parallel. A friend mentioned something like a "come along" and/or a "turnbuckle". FWIW, the fence is going to be 6' cedar board-on-board, with three 2x4 cedar rails but I have not yet installed all the posts, yet. That said, would you hurry and get the gate on there, first?
 
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Old 04-22-18, 03:32 PM
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No. The gate is usually last. Your fence is what will square everything up. You cant expect to do those posts one day and expect them to be straight a week or a month later. You would be better off putting in 2 fence posts and building the fence between them as you go. If you put in posts like that with no support they will all surely warp. A big crew would get it all done in a day with no problems. But working by yourself evenings and weekends you have to go about things a bit differently.
 
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Old 04-23-18, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Norm201
Not a lot can be done short of replacing if what Xsleeper does not work or you don't want to do what he says. If you replace it, make sure the treated post is "weathered" before placing in cement. I'm betting the wood was still wet or heavy from the pressure treatment Most pressure treated lumber is not properly kiln dried prior to treatment. You need to buy from reputable lumber company.Not what you normally get from the big box stores.
Thanks!
Hoping to avoid total replacement because if I replace it, the same thing can happen since I only have big box store wood, nearby, but we'll see. That said the rest of the posts are stacked in garage, to dry with small blocks in between to let air circulate but I don't how dry I can get them before installing, doubtful anything close to kiln dried but it looks like I'll be building fence, for a while before the next post goes in.
 
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Old 04-23-18, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
No. The gate is usually last. Your fence is what will square everything up. You cant expect to do those posts one day and expect them to be straight a week or a month later. You would be better off putting in 2 fence posts and building the fence between them as you go. If you put in posts like that with no support they will all surely warp. A big crew would get it all done in a day with no problems. But working by yourself evenings and weekends you have to go about things a bit differently.
Thanks!
That certainly explains A LOT, because I am working by myself evenings and weekends, for a month now and apparently have to go about things a bit differently, moving forward because I've already installed a total of 7 of 17 posts, like that with no support, other than the initial 24 hours, when they had a couple of 1x4s clamped on, to hold them in place, for curing but no rails or pickets.

I still have one post, to install, on the right of the latch post, next to garage, while the rest are or will be installed, on the left of hinge post and then up a 90 degrees into backyard towards and around circle of pool. That said, would you use the actual rails or scrap 2x4s, temporarily, to try and straighten the hinge post?
 
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Old 04-23-18, 07:33 AM
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Probably the actual rails. Once they are in you won't have to worry about the posts as much. But you might still need the temporary board and the web clamps to help you get the rails in on the left.
 
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Old 04-24-18, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
...cut a 2x4 43" long, and nail it to the top of one side, then pull the posts together and nail it on the other side. That's a very simple precaution to take. Wood warps. Use a ratchet strap around the top of both posts if you can't push them together by hand....

Probably the actual rails. Once they are in you won't have to worry about the posts as much. But you might still need the temporary board and the web clamps to help you get the rails in on the left.
Thanks!
If I have to strap around the top of both posts, to pull the posts together; how do I make sure the latch post (Right) isn't pulled off plum, while the hinge post (left), is pulled into plum?

I'm planning to put the actual rails on the outside, so when you say "nail it on the other side", do you mean, the inside, where the pool is?

Also. what are "web clamps"?
 
  #10  
Old 04-24-18, 01:30 PM
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Complete the section of fence to the right, which will help the right post stay plumb. I meant to say ratchet strap, not web clamp... but they are basically very similar.

If you can't complete the section of fence, at least put your horizontals on. Then run a board diagonally from the top of the right post down at an angle to the bottom of the next post on the right...as an angle brace, which can help square that side. You would need to be sure that post is plumb before you screw the diagonal on.

I am saying that if you put a temporary board between the gate posts, that you could just lay it across the top and nail or screw it to the top of each post.
 
  #11  
Old 04-24-18, 04:55 PM
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Yes, build the fence first and use the rigidity of the fence to straighten out your posts. Just pulling them together with a come-along may warp the right had post instead of straightening the left hand post. A solid section of fence on both sides will allow you to square up your gate posts.
 
  #12  
Old 05-15-18, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
Complete the section of fence to the right, which will help the right post stay plumb. I meant to say ratchet strap, not web clamp... but they are basically very similar.

If you can't complete the section of fence, at least put your horizontals on. Then run a board diagonally from the top of the right post down at an angle to the bottom of the next post on the right...as an angle brace, which can help square that side. You would need to be sure that post is plumb before you screw the diagonal on.

I am saying that if you put a temporary board between the gate posts, that you could just lay it across the top and nail or screw it to the top of each post.
Originally Posted by czizzi
Yes, build the fence first and use the rigidity of the fence to straighten out your posts. Just pulling them together with a come-along may warp the right had post instead of straightening the left hand post. A solid section of fence on both sides will allow you to square up your gate posts.
Thanks!
I'm working on completing the section to the right, to help use the rigidity of the fence to straighten out the posts. The end post needs to be attached to the garage, which is concrete block construction finished in stucco. I got these 4” corner braces (see pics below), which look good on house but I’m thinking I have 2 issues with them.

1) The holes, for the screws seem too close to edges on 4x4.
2) Wood screws, included seem too small for the job.

I also picked up this ratchet strap and but it looks like I'll need an eye bolt or something similar, to attach hook, unless I can somehow just wrap it around.

I’d appreciate any thoughts!
 
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  #13  
Old 05-15-18, 01:47 PM
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Not sure you have to anchor the post to the stucco at all. If needed, I would drill new holes in the brackets for the 4x4 attachment and probably use some other screws than those provided with the bracket.
 
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Old 05-15-18, 02:33 PM
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And you just need to hook both ends of your strap together and loop it around both posts.
 
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Old 05-15-18, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by czizzi
Not sure you have to anchor the post to the stucco at all. If needed, I would drill new holes in the brackets for the 4x4 attachment and probably use some other screws than those provided with the bracket.
Thanks!
I don't want to anchor post to my home but I have to. That said, I am also digging a posthole, at the location, and installing the post in the ground BUT about 12-16" deep, I hit the foundation of the house, like a shelf, so the post will just sit on top of it. Local code calls for, at least 24" deep footer, so inspector told me I have to attach it to house.

What size screws would you use, attaching brace to 4x4 and house?
FWIW: I'm using tapcons on the house.
 
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Old 05-15-18, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
And you just need to hook both ends of your strap together and loop it around both posts.
Thanks!
Sounds good, I've never used a ratchet strap, before and have not un-boxed this one, yet so I'll have to check it out.
 
  #17  
Old 05-15-18, 08:09 PM
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You need to use an exterior screw rated for pressure treated lumber and around 2" long if you ask me. For the stucco, you need to be mindful of the framing of the house, you may have 3 1/2" of wood to hit in the corner. Tap cons are not needed as under the stucco in the corner will be wood. Outside the corner will be void and nothing to hit. Just drill into the stucco until you hit wood, change to a wood bit and pre-drill for your anchors into the framing of the house.
 
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Old 05-16-18, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Cizizzi
You need to use an exterior screw rated for pressure treated lumber and around 2" long if you ask me. For the stucco, you need to be mindful of the framing of the house, you may have 3 1/2" of wood to hit in the corner. Tap cons are not needed as under the stucco in the corner will be wood. Outside the corner will be void and nothing to hit. Just drill into the stucco until you hit wood, change to a wood bit and pre-drill for your anchors into the framing of the house.
Thanks!
Cool, I’ve got 2” & 3 1/2 coated deck screws, for the 4x4. As for stucco it’s about 3/4" - 1 1/4" thick but I don't believe there's any wood, to get to, just concrete block and stucco. Plan is to use tapcons, on house, so sounds like at least 3”-3 1/2”.
 
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Old 05-18-18, 10:56 AM
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Speaking of deck screws, here's are the wood I'm using:
5/8" x 5-1/2" x 6" Pickets
2" x 4" x 8 ' Rails
4" x 4" x 8 ' Posts

What size deck screws would you use, to attach...
1) Rails to Posts
2) Pickets to Rails

FWIW, I’ve got 2” & 3 1/2"...
Would you use these or just too long?
 

Last edited by c1351996; 05-18-18 at 12:16 PM.
  #20  
Old 06-13-18, 12:29 PM
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As for attaching the end post to the concrete block construction garage finished in stucco. I returned the original corner braces , from post #12 and I got 3 of these (top pic below) galvanized steel braces, which look & feel stronger; for which I need 9 screws.

FWIW: I've got 1 blue Tapcon concrete screw 1/4” x 2 3/4” and HD sells them in 8-packs (2nd pic below), which would give me the 9, that I need. That said, they also have non-blue stainless 8-packs, BUT for 2x price AND I’d still be missing one...

Which would you use, blue or non-blue stainless?



 
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Old 06-13-18, 12:39 PM
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You will want a 1/4x1 3/4" screw, the ones you have are likely too long. The blue ones are fine. You have to drill a pilot hole in the stucco/concrete with a hammer drill and their tapcon drill bit.
 
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Old 06-14-18, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
You will want a 1/4x1 3/4" screw, the ones you have are likely too long. The blue ones are fine. You have to drill a pilot hole in the stucco/concrete with a hammer drill and their tapcon drill bit.
Thanks!
Hmm? I have additional 3/4" stucco, from re-finishing, on top of what I'm assuming is another 3/4" of original stucco finish so I was looking for 2 1/2" but couldn't find any.

Yes, blue are fine but guy at HD said stainless would "react" poorly to galvanized and corrode...I don't now about that but I was thinking the stainless would look better than blue.
 
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Old 06-14-18, 08:50 AM
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Didn't know they made stainless tapcons for cement. If you don't like the blue, buy a can of Rustoleum cold galvanizing and spray paint them. Tapcons come in 1 1/4, 1 3/4, 2 1/4, 2 3/4, etc.
 
  #24  
Old 06-15-18, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
Didn't know they made stainless tapcons for cement. If you don't like the blue, buy a can of Rustoleum cold galvanizing and spray paint them. Tapcons come in 1 1/4, 1 3/4, 2 1/4, 2 3/4, etc.
Thanks!
First time, I had seen stainless tapcons for concrete, too. With the extra 3/4" stucco, which size would you use? Think I may go with the stainless but how concerned would you be about missing one screw from one brace?

Also, I'm planning to attach to garage, before adding concrete to base. That said, would you attach brace to post first or attach brace to garage, first?
 

Last edited by c1351996; 06-15-18 at 09:37 AM.
  #25  
Old 06-17-18, 12:18 PM
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FWIW: I've decided to go with the pricier 1/4” x 2 3/4” stainless 8-pack of Tapcons. Mainly because they will be visible so I like the look as well as the "stainless" ability. I'll be missing one but I'll use the spare blue tapcon I have, to make up for it...On the bottom hole. of the bottom brace.

Would you attach the braces, to the garage, first?
OR
Attach the braces, to the post, first?
 
  #26  
Old 06-17-18, 01:53 PM
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Screw it to the wood first, since it's easier to screw to the wood.
 
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Old 06-17-18, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
Screw it to the wood first, since it's easier to screw to the wood.
Thanks!
Hmm? If I attach the braces to the post, first and have to adjust it a bit, to get it plumb, the braces, on the garage, COULD end up NOT being tightened against the garage, leaving a gap between brace & wall.

The other way, if I attach AND tighten the braces against the garage first, it gives me the option to adjust the post a bit, to get it plumb, AND assures me no gap between brace & wall; if that makes sense...?
 
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Old 06-17-18, 03:18 PM
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You are definitely over thinking this. Is the post plumb as it sits? If not, which way does it need to move, and how far?
 
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Old 06-17-18, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by XSleeper
You are definitely over thinking this. Is the post plumb as it sits? If not, which way does it need to move, and how far?
No problem, didn't mean to be a bother...
FWIW, the post is not set, yet. I'm planning to attach the post, to the garage, to stabilize it, before adding concrete, to the base.
 
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