Hallway and Stairway Width in an 1880's Remodel


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Old 06-12-13, 12:36 PM
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Question Hallway and Stairway Width in an 1880's Remodel

Hi Everyone,

I have a completely gutted 1880's Victorian - just the exterior shell remains and all interior partition walls removed. We are just at the point at which we are preparing for the reconstruction. The current stairway to the 2nd floor (bedrooms, bath, laundry) is 30 inches wide, not including the rail. I think that is way too narrow for stairs so I want to widen it to 36 inches (on the side that is not load bearing). The problem is that eats into our hallway upstairs. And then over widening the hallway to 36" eats into the bathroom and laundry. I'd really prefer to make the stairs 36" and the hall 32" wide, which is technically against modern code. Both of these are improvements over the prior setup and the hall will technically feel more spacious because one side isn't a wall, it would be the rail over the said stairs. BTW, the landing for the stairs is only 32" deep and that really can't change.

My question is what is most of your experience with modern codes in older structures that are being completely renovated. Of course I can comply with things like smoke detectors, electric, etc, but some of the new codes are just not practical to implement in an old house even with a complete remodel. Most of the official information I read say you are grandfathered except in the case of alterations. My alternative is to leave a very narrow stair setup just to avoid "altering" the structure. Common sense would say widening the stairs and hall are both improvements, albeit still not to modern code.

And I know it is ultimately up to the inspector. The problem is this is a "weekend" job that is lasting for years. When I closed my demo permit, they said the next inspection would be for plumbing and electric and the framing would be after that (presumably because you can hack up the framing during plumbing). I am literally years away from that so I have to pull the permits after I start the work just to make sure they don't expire. So I have to frame it, and then pull the HVAC permit (I believe that's next), then plumbing, then electric, then framing - although I really have this question now!

My inspectors have been relatively accommodating so I don't expect problems beyond what is "normal."

Thanks for your input!
 
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Old 06-12-13, 12:57 PM
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There's no real way around the code thing since you are reconstructing it. It ceased to have 1880 grandfathering once you did the demo. However, your inspectors seem to be helping. They can be of more assistance with the width of the stairs. 36" is a minimum for turn around room, and 42" for ADA, but you aren't going there. I don't see a way out of it without the inspector's blessing.
 
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Old 06-12-13, 09:17 PM
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Once to open up that can of worms there also going to be looking at the head room over the nose of the treads, which in an old house I've never seem meet code. Then there's riser and tread heights and lengths.
 
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Old 06-13-13, 06:46 PM
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Well the stairs are where the stairs are and I can't (at least I'm not going to) do anything about that. I actually never measured, but I bet the riser height is against code too. That is certainly the case for the attic stairs which are very steep. But hopefully I can get away with just widening them, which I'm doing for myself anyway, but leaving the riser height, etc the way it was designed. I just can't see anyone logical saying, "well, now that you widened the stairs, you have to relocate the stairs unless you'll fail inspection."

But point being, I guess you guys are saying that there isn't a general understanding of leeway when it comes to older homes. So I will try to keep the hallway and stairs at 36". Maybe I'll just frame the wall with 2x3's and then I only have to find 3 more inches since it was going to be 32".

Thanks for the advice and anyone else please feel free to chime in if you have some relative stories!
 
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Old 06-14-13, 08:56 PM
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I'd be inclined to work up a few scaled-drawings of the existing footprint you have to work with, including the location of load-bearing members on the main floor and basement. Then you could play around with room sizes and locations, in an effort to relocate and widen the stairway and hallway to make things work, without chewing up the functional side of things.

And it goes without saying, keep the chute greased with your local inspector. Whatever plan you come up with, his blessing will be required.

Maybe an all-expenses-paid trip to Europe for him and the family?
 
 

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