Is new better than old?


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Old 12-26-02, 04:13 PM
cuffs054
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Question Is new better than old?

For many years I have had various fossil fuel forced air heating systems. All were old enough to predate circuit boards and inducer fans. While I realize the need for conserving resources as well as protecting our wallets, the more I scan this site the more problems I see with "progress" in solid state heating/cooling systems. Is it just my observation or do newer units seem more problematic than old? And are the savings worth freezing our butts off when they go down?
 
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Old 12-26-02, 06:10 PM
bigjohn
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Well, here my 2 cents worth. I've been in this business over 30 years and, IMO, the equipment built 2 to 3 decades ago was better for 2 reasons. First, it was less complicated. Furnaces consisted of standing pilot, gas valve, fan and limit control and and a blower. The operating sequence was simple and easy to troubleshoot. Condensing units had a contactor, compressor, fan and coil. Themostats were simple electromechanical units with simple circuits. Secondly, the equipment was built heavier. The cabinetry was thick metal. You know how we talk about units being so many tons which refers to the cooling capacity? We used to joke that, with Westinghouse units, the tonnage rating meant the weight of the unit because the cabinets were so heavy. Furnace heat exchangers were tough and didn't fail like they do today. Cooling coils were made of thicker metal and didn't corrode thru and leak refrigerant as readily as they do today. I'll grant you that more breakdowns = more business for contractors but customers don't like it. Cars and appliances have gone the same way. Appliances used to be simple to repair and they were very durable. Remember that Maytag or Kenmore dryer that lasted your mother 30 years? You can forget that today. In Cuba, they're still driving cars from the fifties. Speaking of cars, I can't work on my own car. I don't recognize half the stuff under the hood. Couple years ago, I owned a 1972 VW bus for a while. It ran well and I could actually repair the thing myself. The guy that owns it now put a nice paint job on it and drives it almost daily. Another problem with having more complicated things in our lives is that there are fewer people around to fix them. Why should someone work outside in the heat and the cold when they can fix/program computers and make more money? Sorry for rambling but that's what I think.
 
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Old 12-31-02, 10:03 AM
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cuffs054:

I tend to agree with bigjohn to a certain extent.

We have been working in our respective industries a similar amount of time and I know what he is talking about.

One thing I must say though is that in some cases processor controlled equipment has actually made my work simpler.

In commercial work, paired wire sensors that use impedance or capacitance signals to control equipment do away in some cases with six pairs of wires.
Ice machines that will tell you what sensor has tripped by the number of blinks of a light.
Furnaces that burn a fraction of the fuel the old ones did.

Even though I like what this new stuff can do, doesn't mean I'm not struggling with it.

A similar thing I am struggling with is that I do all my own automotive repair.
I aquired a mint condition service van from a friend with a blown motor.
I will up the engine from a 305 to a 350 and have a choice.........get an injected replacement engine and replace the throttle body and computer or use a carburated engine and cut all that cr** out of there like I did when I replaced the diesel engine in my current vehicle.

I posted my dilema in Automotive and everyone said to go computer.

So what do you think?.................New technology or old?
 
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Old 01-01-03, 10:53 AM
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IM WITH YOU ALL

I know some will say Im wrong so be it.The one that gets me is the SEER and what we save. All the A/C coils copper is thinner for more btu's out of the coil. They leak a lot more and we have to replace them so more energy is used to make the new ones. The coils in the highside units is bigger for the SEER. More copper and energy is used to make them.Lots of units have expansion vlaves in them now for a higher SEER. What about the start amp draw that this takes ,its a lot more than the old set up.We did have a RFC set up that would start with no load on it and no need for a start kit. So less amps and less material. The power company's.
Dont know if it just mine or more. But here its bad. 220volts down to 190 volts. One time that took out all of my fluorescent lights,had to put new ones in ,more energy.The power on and off all the time. If you dont have a time delay on your A/C unit,you might get 3years out of the compressor then you have to get a new one, more energy.The refrigerator in you home will ride its klixon for the next 1/2 hour before it startsand you got the one with he best SEER Some of the electric heat in the furnaces are now going to the chromalox strip heaters. With them if the volts go down the amp draw goes up, more energy.With the nickle chrome alloy wire units if the volts go down you dont get as much heat But the amp draw does go down.I said it and im glad ED
 
 

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