Another Gimmic Exposed

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  #1  
Old 02-23-06, 09:53 AM
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Another Gimmic Exposed

Glucosamine and Chondroitin

All along, it was smoke and mirrors.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11504415/

Think of the millions, if not billions of dollars consumers have spent and justified their use in order to help themselves in the matters of arthritis. On NBC last night they stated that users got more from the placebo's than the supplements. It does state that those with severe problems had some response to the product, but we are talking about the majority of those spending hundreds of dollars a year. Not fair to those who are being told they need it, and no remedy is taken. It also states that long term usage of the product has not been addressed for any known side affects. In other words, it wasn't tested to FDA standards rules and regulations since it is not required as a supplement, only if it is a medicine.

Heck, even my dog at one time was subjected to this onslaught of media frenzy. My veternarian advised us to buy a specific dog food containing these two ingredients to help with his current situation with degenerating discs in his spine.

Now I know that what money I spent on my dog's best interest turned out to be just high priced fertilizer for my yard,

just had to pass through my dog first.
 

Last edited by DUNBAR PLUMBER; 02-23-06 at 10:06 AM.
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  #2  
Old 02-23-06, 11:45 AM
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Yah my sister went on and on about how good it was and I needed to try it. I did for 2 months, didn't help a bit although my wallet did lose weight

Now if we could only get all the pharmaceuticals to quit advertising all the new miracle cures and pass the savings onto the customers in reduced drug costs. Never happen but it is nice to dream.
 
  #3  
Old 02-23-06, 03:48 PM
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wow...maybe you should re read it:
67 percent who took the combo pills(glucosamine or chondroitin) had reduced pain,while 70 percent reported the drug Celebrex did reduce pain.

Of the 354 people with moderate to severe pain, 79 percent who took both supplements reported relief compared with 54 percent who took the dummy pills and 69 percent who took Celebrex.

The supplements showed no known side effects during the government’s six-month study.

oops
Clegg, the lead researcher, and 10 other scientists who worked on the study reported receiving fees or grant support from Pfizer or McNeil Consumer & Specialty Pharmaceuticals, which makes Tylenol.

it also didn't say what the dosage amount was, but if it runs true to most governments/drug company studies for non drugs, I'm sure it was low.

The one major problem with supplements is that to many people/companies try to take advantage of the consumers, and their products (usually low priced) don't contain the ingredients or dosage they say.

here's an interesting article on the government (specifically the fda) and non drugs.
http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/Ms...%20cherries%20
read the whole thing. It's just one example.
 
  #4  
Old 02-23-06, 05:25 PM
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When the surgeon scoped my knee and found no cartilage left, he suggested I take Glucosamine to rebuild cartilage. He didn't endorse it, he just said "what have you got to lose".

I thought it was hokey that it could rebuild cartilage but I took it anyway for 3 months. I noticed a definite reduction in pain which I wasn't expecting because I never knew it was supposed to kill pain.

However, I get the same relief from taking Motrin when I need it a couple times a week rather than Glucosamine every day.

I don't take Glucosamine anymore because its inconvenient. I can vouch that it does work but its a hassle and other anti-inflamatories work better.

I can't call it a hoax but its definetly no miracle drug. My wife still takes it everyday "just in case".

PS: Celebrex works super well but apparently it wrecks your heart, so its out now too.
 
  #5  
Old 02-23-06, 05:50 PM
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As shown below, sometimes the "alternative" may not be quit as strong, but is usually always safer.
In the case of glucosamine, it may take quite awhile for the effects to show, but in the long run in may help much more than a simple pain killer.
Motrin: More common motrin side effects may include:
Abdominal cramps or pain, abdominal discomfort, bloating and gas, constipation, diarrhea, dizziness, fluid retention and swelling, headache, heartburn, indigestion, itching, loss of appetite, nausea, nervousness, rash, ringing in ears, stomach pain, vomiting

Less common or rare motrin side effects may include:
Abdominal bleeding, anemia, black stool, blood in urine, blurred vision, changes in heatbeat, chills, confusion, congestive heart failure, eepression, dry eyes and mouth, emotional volatitity, fever, hair loss, hearing loss, hepatitis, high or low blood pressure, hives, inability to sleep, inflammation of nose, inflammation of the pancreas or stomach, kidney or liver failure, servere allergic reactions, shortness of breath, skin eruptions or peeling, sleepiness, stomach or upper intestinal ulcer, ulcer of gums, vision loss, vomiting blood, wheezing, yellow eyes and skin.

Special warnings about motrin:
Peptic ulcers and bleeding can occur without warning. Tell your doctor if you have bleeding or any other problems.
This drug should be used with caution if you have kidney or liver disease, or are severely dehydrated; it can cause liver or kidney inflammation or other problems in some people.
Do not take aspirin or any other anti-inflammatory medications while taking Motrin unless your doctor tells you to do so.
If you have a severe allergic reaction, seek medical help immediately.
Motrin may cause vision problems. If you experience any changes in your vision, inform your doctor.
Mortin may prolong bleeding time. If you are taking blood-thinning medication, this drug should be taken with caution.
This drug can cause water retention. It should be used with caution if you have high blood pressure or poor heart function.
Avoid the use of alcohol while taking this medication.
Motrin may mask the usual signs of infection or other diseases. Use with care in the presence of an existing infection.
If you have diabetes, remember that the suspension contains 1.5 grams of sucrose and 8 calories per teaspoonful.
Motrin chewable tablets contain phenylalanine. If you have a hereditary disease called phenylketonuria, you should be aware of this.

Glucosamine:RESEARCH SUMMARY

Two recent meta-analyses have confirmed that glucosamine is useful in the treatment of osteoarthritis. One of these meta-analyses included all double-blind, placebo-controlled trials that lasted four weeks or longer. This meta-analysis also included trials that studied the effects of chondroitin sulfate (see Chondroitin Sulfate). In all, there were l3 of these studies (six involving glucosamine and seven involving chondroitin sulfate).
All l3 studies found positive results in hip or knee osteoarthritis. The authors of the meta-analysis judged a trial positive if there was 25% or more improvement in the treatment group compared with placebo. The Levesque Index and global pain scores were used to assess improvement. Very significant improvement was associated with both glucosamine (39.5%) and chondroitin sulfate (40.2%), compared with placebo.
In another recent meta-analysis of nine randomized, controlled trials of glucosamine, glucosamine was significantly superior to placebo in seven of the studies and was superior to ibuprofen and equal to ibuprofen in the other two studies.
Recently, a long-term, randomized placebo-controlled trial of glucosamine sulfate's effects on osteoarthritis ended with the conclusion that the supplement halts progression of structural joint damage and reduces symptoms of those with osteoarthritis of the knee. The study involved 212 patients 50 years or older who received 1500 milligrams of glucosamine sulfate daily or placebo.
Radiographic evidence, at a three-year followup, showed joint space narrowing--the prime indicator of arthritic joint damage--in the placebo group consistent with what has been documented to be typical in untreated osteoarthritis. The glucosamine-supplemented subjects, on the other hand, showed only a non-significant increase in joint space at the same three-year followup.
There has been one study demonstrating an apparent synergistic effect using glucosamine and chondroitin together. The combination was more effective than either substance alone in inhibiting progression of degenerative cartilage lesions in an experimental study.
Clinical research is needed to determine if this effect is truly synergistic, additive or non-existent. The National Institutes of Health has started a large, multi-center study that may shed further light on this issue.
It is probably not surprising that glucosamine may be helpful in osteoarthritis. Glucosamine is crucial for the construction of glycosaminoglycans (GAGs) in articular cartilage. Reduced GAG content in osteoarthritic cartilage matrix corresponds with the severity of osteoarthritis. Oral glucosamine appears to be capable of prompting the chondrocytes to secrete more GAGs. This knowledge, derived from animal and in vitro studies, has prompted clinical trials of glucosamine in osteoarthritis.
CONTRAINDICATIONS, PRECAUTIONS, ADVERSE REACTIONS
CONTRAINDICATIONS

There are no known contraindications to glucosamine supplementation.
 
  #6  
Old 02-24-06, 11:26 AM
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Ever notice that just when you think you finally have the answer, some scientific study or theorist blows it away?

OK..............I'm back to the drawing board.
 
  #7  
Old 02-25-06, 09:29 AM
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and now they're saying all those calcium supplements don't work either
 
  #8  
Old 02-25-06, 02:20 PM
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Can't help myself!

How about the one that says butter is now good for you, margarine is bad.
No wonder I feel so good after a quad serving of theatre buttered popcorn.

.
 
  #9  
Old 02-27-06, 05:41 AM
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Now even the names are dumb

Okay, here's my vote for dumbest name for weight-loss snake oil: H57 Hoodia. Guess the really stupid name means it MUST work!
 
  #10  
Old 03-02-06, 06:42 PM
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Thanks for all the responses. Only thing is, I didn't get the instant email notification on this thread. ????

Anyway thanks Tae for the info. I edited my thread that same day I posted when I read farther back into that subject and added the fact that those with severe problems did have results.

I guess I was painting the subject with one brush, meaning that the hype had lasting effects on a large group of people, including animals even in the marketing machine this product created.

My question is how often was this product taken in conjunction with other products that might of masked its potential, along with those who did the stand alone treatments. I've tried the product myself and I am forced to take heavy pain medications in conjunction with G&C. I tried coming off slowly off the pain meds and G&C did not cover the specific pain I endure. That doesn't mean that it won't work for someone else, it just seems that when this info sprung up on NBC news, it was a buyer beware sort of news story.

Did anyone else have problems on this thread with instant email notification?
 
  #11  
Old 03-02-06, 08:21 PM
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I don't get the mail notification so I couldn't tell you on that one.
It is probably not surprising that glucosamine may be helpful in osteoarthritis. Glucosamine is crucial for the construction of glycosaminoglycans (GAGs) in articular cartilage. Reduced GAG content in osteoarthritic cartilage matrix corresponds with the severity of osteoarthritis. Oral glucosamine appears to be capable of prompting the chondrocytes to secrete more GAGs. This knowledge, derived from animal and in vitro studies, has prompted clinical trials of glucosamine in osteoarthritis.
Blah blah blah..it means that it helps to reduce/stop damage from getting worse. pain reduction is or would be an added benifit.
that's the trouble I have with the "hype" of natural products. You take a good thing, then to make an extra buck you make some other claims and hype it, then when it doesn't work, people stop taking it.
As mjd2k said, he was asked to take it to help rebuild cartilage. side benifit,it also helped with the pain, but since asprin worked better for the pain, it was stopped, totally forgetting it wasnt for the pain in the first place.
Course, it also kills me when he said:"I can vouch that it does work .....I can't call it a hoax but its definetly no miracle drug.thumbs down" Wow, it works but it sucks...and all that after a whopping 3 months! whoo hoo. (sorry mjd2k, just my pet peeve)
Some "natural/alternative" products can work very fast and are very strong(look up red yeast rice or grapefruit seed extract) and others are very slow and subtle, and some are somewhere in between, like condroitin and glucosamine.
 
  #12  
Old 03-03-06, 07:31 PM
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"As mjd2k said, he was asked to take it to help rebuild cartilage. side benifit,it also helped with the pain, but since asprin worked better for the pain, it was stopped, totally forgetting it wasnt for the pain in the first place.
Course, it also kills me when he said:"I can vouch that it does work .....I can't call it a hoax but its definetly no miracle drug.thumbs down" Wow, it works but it sucks...and all that after a whopping 3 months! whoo hoo."

Hmmmmmm. Just a personal choice based upon ..........Effect/Cost/Convenience

2 glucosomine pills a day x 365 days = 730 pills a year.

Primary reason for usage was to rebuild cartilage but research shows there is a slim to zilch chance any "significant" growth of cartilage would occur where I needed it the most. Even my surgeon thought it was just a shot in the dark. Not worth taking a pill every AM and PM for the rest of my life unless I felt it would really work.

Secondary use was for pain reduction and anti-inflamation which can be managed easily so far with a couple motrin or a huge number of alternative remedies. Glucosomine is just one of many solutions so 730 pills a year is overkill.

No offense taken, we all have our pet peeves. I might wind up back on it someday but today it isnt' worth the trouble.
 
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