Saturn Vehicle Manufacturing Ending

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  #1  
Old 09-30-09, 06:43 PM
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Unhappy Saturn Vehicle Manufacturing Ending

Saturn is closing, GM is struggling. Will the American auto industry die as the electronic industry died as the steel industry died. Decades of wars we didn't win. Will America be a "second" world country in 50 years?

Admins Note:
By request and respect to all effected parties, title edited.
Saturn did not "Crash as originally titled." As in a collision or accident crash. Factories are closing and production is ending... Workers in all aspects of the industry of manufacturing, distribution, selling and repairing these vehicles will loose their jobs.......
 

Last edited by Sharp Advice; 10-08-09 at 08:46 AM.
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  #2  
Old 10-01-09, 04:40 AM
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Sad day to see the only quality vehicle GM built to take the plunge. We owned one for a number of years and had very little problems with it. They seemed to have a different philosophy about their cars.
If we don't take corrective action in 2010, it could happen in as little as 10 years. Someone needs to pull up and add power to the thrusters.
 
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Old 10-03-09, 01:10 PM
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The Roman Empire came to a halt. Hitler's regime did. And it is hard for anything or anyone to stay at #1. People get soft. Hard industrial work built this country. Then greed stepped to the plate, and finaglers found ways to take advantage of loopholes. As we know, pure capitalism does not work without checks and balances. We have to get past 2012 before we worry about why Rio got the Olympics in 2016, and other stuff. The world seems to be heading toward Biblical like catastrophe.
 
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Old 10-03-09, 08:01 PM
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Yes we are in grimm times but I have faith that we will eventualy right ourselves and become the shining city on the hill once again but not before many more trials and tribulations.
With all of our faults as a nation we are still and will always be THE GREATEST NATION ON EARTH......U.S.A!
 
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Old 10-17-09, 11:17 AM
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With this statement I due agree.

"With all of our faults as a nation we are still and will always be THE GREATEST NATION ON EARTH......U.S.A!"
Our country, IMO, would be far better off if we had an industrial and manufacturing base, as we had in the late 1950's and through some of the very early 1980's.

We allowed our federal leaders to convince us exporting our countries manufacturing and almost all our industrial base to be moved off shore. Which closed many factories and total industries at an alarming rate.... Which then de-employed far to many Americans....

As a country and a nation, we have lost our way. An industrial base creates products for home land purchasing as well as exportation to foreign countries. As well as providing much needed JOBS!

Which in turn creates an Federal and State income base and a state sales tax base. Added benefits, purchasing power to the average blue collar worker, lower unemployment and higher demand for consumer goods & services in America, etc.

You cannot due business with anyone whom does not have $$$. America needs it's manufacturing & industrial base. Attempting to have a nations economy based almost solely on a service industry, as we are presently isn't working well.

The evidence is presently as our country now is dealing with and experiencing. The result of failed economic and trade policy's, etc.

Manufacturing & industrial base creation of such is required. It would be an economic boom for the countries prosperity and it's citizens financial well being, IMO.

Beer 4U2
 
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Old 10-17-09, 11:44 AM
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I asked Michael J. Fox to take a little trip back in time in his DeLorian. He went back to the Mayan empire and asked them why their calender stopped at 2012.

When he returned, he gave me the true answer. Since they did not say to keep it a secret, I will tell you.

Ready??



They ran out of room on the tablet.

LOL
 
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Old 10-17-09, 12:50 PM
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So if Saturn didn't "crash", was it at least a fender bender?
 
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Old 10-17-09, 12:57 PM
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sounds like around 13,000 jobs will be lost, at least that is how many Saturn stated would be saved when Penske was trying to buy Saturn.

just as a bit of history:

somewhere in the '50's, the UAW approached the auto manufacturers stating that we needed to build small cars to compete with the Japanese, who were just starting to build cars and send to the US.

J. Edward Deming. In 1950, Deming taught the Japanese SPC (statistical process control; a method of of monitoring and using those stats to improve manufacturing processes). The US auto makers did not seek help from Deming until Fords overture in 1981. Ford was having some serious problems but after Demings advice, Ford soon after released the 1986 Ford Taurus, which went on to become one of Fords most profitable cars in their history. Ford's income, shortly after that, exceeded GMs income. That had not happened since the '20's.


Those 2 actions, alone, I believe, were two of the greatest reasons Japan whooped us when it came to cars and their quality.

Toss in the fact that Japan's business plans are generally 2 to 4 times as long as ours and their manufacturers did not grab for short term goals (fast cash) over long term goals (business growth) and you have a great percentage of the reasons we are now in the boat we are.

You can blame it on the government but you must realize that big business really does control our government. For an easy to see example that, just look at the cafe standards for fuel mileage for our cars. The manufacturers simply cry and whine until the gov relaxes them as well as the manuf, plays with model content and how that is considered in the mileage numbers to make the numbers come out how they want.
 
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Old 10-17-09, 01:05 PM
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Explanation of original title. Sharpadvice I respect your decision but the original title was a pun. See Black Friday and stock market crash for original historic references and this definition of "pun"
1.the humorous use of a word or phrase so as to emphasize or suggest its different meanings or applications, or the use of words that are alike or nearly alike in sound but different in meaning; a play on words.

2.the word or phrase used in this way.

Source: Pun Definition | Definition of Pun at Dictionary.com
.
 
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Old 10-17-09, 03:29 PM
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Who's the blame for all this? The American worker wanting $30+/hr to push a button? Government, all of the above?

It's very odd that they would get rid of Saturn. It's just like how they got rid of Pontiac but kept Buick of all brands.....odd.
 
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Old 10-17-09, 03:47 PM
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Well...as I understand..Saturn was great for the first few years..just a different philosophy of car production and sales. I knew a few folks that just loved their cars and the buying experience. But then they started to have to share platforms and components...

GM consisted of too many brands that overlapped in some areas. Olds was too close to Buick and Pontiac..they've been gone for what almost 5 yrs?

Now GM is going to luxury/high end performance (Caddy)...mid level (Buick) and economy/performance (Chevy). Of course there will be some overlap..but smaller than before. Buick is a huge seller in China..which is an exploding market.

I truly hope all the companies recover..but they will have to rethink the whole process.
 
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Old 10-17-09, 05:17 PM
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I never have been able to see the economic sense in having different badges on the same car; example - Ford Taurus & Mercury Sable. They sell more cars that way???
 
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Old 10-17-09, 05:23 PM
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And people tell me GMC trucks are WAY better then Chevy trucks. Whatever. I don't get it either.
 
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Old 10-17-09, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by the_tow_guy View Post
I never have been able to see the economic sense in having different badges on the same car; example - Ford Taurus & Mercury Sable. They sell more cars that way???
Originally Posted by Tolyn Ironhand View Post
And people tell me GMC trucks are WAY better then Chevy trucks. Whatever. I don't get it either.
I think it hearkens back to the old days when there was a difference in the sister vehicles although with the styling differences and most do actually alter the suspensions to reflect the ride to fit the target market, there are often a few differences even today.

Now, if you want to go thinking that, start checking out what Saturns are under the skin. When Saturn first started, all of their cars were unique. Now, they are generally bodies, or sometimes not even that much change, on a sister vehicle chassis.
 
  #15  
Old 10-17-09, 08:12 PM
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I think it all goes back to corporate overhead and the future costs of benefits (just one cause). The longer you have employees and the older they get (before dying), habits continue, the more the cost goes on/increases.

I think think Toyota pays more $ per hour than GM, Chrysler and Ford. Ford avoided the constraints and limitation imposed in the "bail-out" because they sold Jaguar and Rover to a huge, huge Indian company (Tata) for cash. Because of the lack of government limitations, they had the inventory to sell more cars (Ford first, Toyota second) than GM or Chrysler during the incentive program.

Old Henry Ford and his principles may be showing through after he developed the assembly line principle of manufacturing while he developed charcoal briquettes (Kingsford, after a cousin).

American cars have just been sheet metal and gimmicks while the real auto companies have been out-stripping them around the world with advances and technology. - I learned that when I had a 1995 Corvette and compared it to the other great cars in the world (pretty, showy, but really limited when it comes to real cars). - Just advertising and wrinkled tin sheet metal.

It is all market driven and the market has changed and the world is now much smaller. - China buys a lot of Buicks (more than GM admits and maybe more than they sell in the U.S.), but it is easier to get and cheaper than the Mercedes, BWMs and even Audi that out-sell them in China.
 
  #16  
Old 10-18-09, 09:28 AM
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Once again addressing the title change. For the originally stated reason above, the title was changed. By request and out of respect for all those whom will loose jobs. Regardless of whom is suspected to be at fault or speculated reasons why the production is ending. Bottom line. Jobs are lost.

Including employees of outside suppliers, etc. No one thinks any of this is funny, humorous nor in need of any puns. A sad day in our country when any American auto manufacture or any manufacturing company forever closes down it's production facilities.

BTW: We are not the only ones reading posts on the web site. Compliments, as well as complaints, suggestions and requests are sent. I review many of them and attempt to honor as many of the valid ones as possible.

======

All vehicle manufacturers (including imports) inter-change major components. Body frames (chassis) are but one of many. Very cost effective in all aspects of production.

Example: Build a pick up truck frame and chassis and you also have an SUV frame and chassis. Few changes in suspension parts, add an SUV body, new badge/brand name and another model is produced. If you're willing to look past the brand and/or model name, they all due it this way.
 
  #17  
Old 10-19-09, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by HotinOKC View Post
It's very odd that they would get rid of Saturn. It's just like how they got rid of Pontiac but kept Buick of all brands.....odd.
Pontiac Grand Ams and Grand Prixs, and Saturns, are on the roads here like mosquitoes. Probably net profit, per unit, is low, compared to say to the fleet of Buicks.

One of the auto-maker's CEO's, on tv, explained how it is not only the sales, but the fact there are bigger profit margins in the big SUV's, that people still kept demanding (like how soccer mom's want to make sure their kids survive a head-on), that caused the auto makers to keep making them.
 
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