Education, or lack thereof.

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  #1  
Old 08-28-12, 12:32 PM
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Education, or lack thereof.

I was reading a post today and I immediately thought of these lines from an old movie.

Abbott: "Did you ever go to school, stupid?"
Costello: Yeah, I came out the same way!"

Did they give up teaching English grammar and composition sometime in the last thirty years? This post had no capital letters, one period and no other punctuation. It had atrocious sentence structure and a perfect example of a run-on sentence. I couldn't believe how many misspelled words, or wrong words for the context had been used. It was all I could do to understand what the person was trying to convey. I almost asked if Americanized English was a second (or third) language to him but I bit my tongue
 
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  #2  
Old 08-28-12, 12:43 PM
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My daughter and I were at my parents' house over the weekend and my mother had yelled something to me from another room and I responded to her. My curious eight year old daughter inquired "What did Grandma say?" to which I replied "Nothing." She then immediately responded "What did she ask? I was so proud.
 
  #3  
Old 08-28-12, 12:51 PM
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I'm with you Furd. Sometimes I see letters to the newspaper and I know they are from kids based on the "text" language they use....but I also see letters from adults that are less intelligible than the kids posts.

Here is a letter to the editor post by a County Supervisor candidate who is in his 50's at least...likely 60's. Seriously?

I like your thought but taxes are #1 and rules , codes, regulations must be adjusted correctly before buiness will listen to you, 3 majority companies that I brought out here made it very clear ! The people need help and they will not recieve it unless the BOS stands up,People vote for your family, not for your friends friend !!
And that was one of his better ones....

My step-son is 23 this year and writes almost perfectly...schools in San Diego, VA, and WA state. He's also a text maniac...so thats not the whole problem.

Some of the posts here...it's obvious that English is a 2nd language, but even those normally have punctuation, capitalization and sentence structure.

I have to tell ya....sometimes I will just ignore one I can't read...or sometimes I will ask them to break down their statement into smaller sentences.

I write pretty much how I talk....at least here. I'm not writing letters to my Congressmen. Sure I make mistakes (well...my fingers do actually...not my brain...lol) but my info/intent is clear.
 
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Old 08-28-12, 12:56 PM
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Mitch, you have an 8 y/o daughter? I thought you would have been having grand-daughters by now? Have I aged you inappropriately? I guess I just put you in the almost old fart category for some reason.
 
  #5  
Old 08-28-12, 01:04 PM
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Sure I make mistakes (well...my fingers do actually...not my brain...lol) but my info/intent is clear.
I make far too many mistakes in my postings. I used to blame it on the keyboard but after getting a new keyboard and making just as many mistakes (same on a new computer) I realized it is ME making all those mistakes. Now I'm blaming it on my arthritic fingers.

I do agree that it is usually fairly easy to distinguish the ESL writers from those that are just plain sloppy and like you I often just pass over the posts that I cannot decipher. That's the great thing about volunteering, nobody can MAKE me answer.
 
  #6  
Old 08-28-12, 01:08 PM
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My biggest issue is I'm a smart-alec and very sarcastic. The problem is my typing can come off that way even when I am not trying to be either of those. The grammar and syntax, in my opinion, are much less of an issue for me. Poor typing skills, though....

Vic: FWIW, I'm 42, I just look older than that
 
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Old 08-28-12, 02:14 PM
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Rode hard and put up wet, so to speak ! It depends on where I am as to the grammar I use. I try to use proper language skills here, but when I worked at ATL, there was a door from operations to the general office and the languages were as different as night and day. Proper American English for those in the general office strata, and straight from the hip street talk out on the docks and tarmac. Tongue biting was a daily thing for me as I was in operations.
 
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Old 08-28-12, 03:25 PM
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I consider myself fortunate in that the company I retired from was often like a United Nations with people from all over the globe and from many different ethnicities and languages. I got to deal with many different people during my career and I was always respectful of the differences.

But that is not what I am referring to in this rant. I am referring to people that more often than not were born, raised and schooled in the US of A and just plain can't be bothered to use the communication skills they were (or should have been) taught. People that can't be bothered to start a sentence with a capital letter or to end a sentence with a period. People who can't be bothered to write out before but instead write b4. Probably the one that rankles me the most is when someone uses the phrase, "...me and my brother..." (or whatever) instead of, "...my brother and I...". Almost as bad is "him and me..." instead of we.

Then there are the people that can't be bothered to use paragraphs and when these people also have run-on sentences it makes the post all but unreadable. I know that rules for comma usage are difficult, I have problems with them myself, but I'd rather see too many (not to many, two many or 2 many) commas than to see none at all.

Yes I AM an old fuddy-duddy (or worse), I admit it.
 
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Old 08-28-12, 03:41 PM
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Ok Furd...you are officially labeled as a Fuddy Duddy.

"...me and my brother..." (or whatever) instead of, "...my brother and I...". Almost as bad is "him and me..." instead of we.

That's never going to change...never ever ever.

The rest I agree.

Hey...maybe we can get Admin to change your name.....most of the same letters right? lol
 
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Old 08-28-12, 03:46 PM
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...me and my brother..." (or whatever) instead of, "...my brother and I...". Almost as bad is "him and me..." instead of we
Gee, that's pretty much proper english here in the south

I don't have much of a problem with improper english or the wrong words used from time to time [I've been guilty] but when you have to read the post multiple times just to try and figure out what is being asked...... that takes all the fun out of trying to help.
 
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Old 08-28-12, 03:51 PM
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I think part of it is the language you hear growing up If your immersed in grammatically incorrectly spoken language then you tend to use that in writing, especially if you never discovered the joy of reading. I grew up hearing correctly spoken English so when doing exercises in English class I could "cheat" most of the time and get a good grade. By cheat I mean the exercise would just ask you correct the mistake in a sentence. I'd just read it in my mind and change the word that sounded wrong to one that sounded right. Usually they didn't ask why so it was pretty easy. Even when they asked why it wasn't that hard because I knew just from reading which was the incorrect word.

Watching shows like The People's Court will prove just how bad the language of native born speakers has gotten. "Judge I ax him to borrow me some money."
 

Last edited by ray2047; 08-28-12 at 06:29 PM.
  #12  
Old 08-28-12, 05:50 PM
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I need to set this one up. Seattle is located in King county, Washington. In fact, Seattle is the "seat" of King county although that part isn't relevant.

I just saw an advertisement on the television for a local plumbing company. In big red letters on the screen it stated, "King counties most trusted pluming company! " I couldn't freakin' believe that actually made it on the air.
 
  #13  
Old 08-28-12, 06:28 PM
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Looks like one of my posts before I edit.
 
  #14  
Old 08-28-12, 06:55 PM
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I actually klnow hoew to touch tyoe but this is how it comes out because of may fat fingers and arthritis,

Hmm, that wourlked better than most.
 
  #15  
Old 08-28-12, 08:27 PM
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I am just as bad, but I thought this was funny. And thanks to Furd, before I post, I take the time to fix all my spelling mistakes. The rest I cant help....LOL



 
  #16  
Old 08-29-12, 04:03 AM
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You know, it would behoove sign printing companies to employ at least one educated person to "proof" the work before blindly printing signs or emblazoning your $40k truck with a goofy mistake. On my work trailer, when I had it "run through the printer" they left off an area code on the back door. Not a big deal, normally, but the exchange is duplicated in a town adjacent in North Carolina, so it is confusing.....is it 706 or 828??? They offered to correct it, but it was too much to take all the lettering off, so I just told them to make a small "706" and put it beside the exchange vertically. They even put me a small American Flag on to make up for it.
 
  #17  
Old 08-29-12, 06:11 AM
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I just blame pure laziness. heck i could type like this on every post but i choose not to
 
  #18  
Old 08-29-12, 06:20 AM
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I wonder if the post that started this thread, sent their post in from their Iphone?

BUT, if you're going to type a long post such as that one, they should take the time to go to their computer. Doesn't everyone have a computer these days?

I won't reply to posts like that. It takes too much effort to make sense of them and it's hard on the eyes, too.
 
  #19  
Old 08-29-12, 07:01 AM
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I will comment specifically on how their presentation made it difficult to read their post - be it punctuation or spelling or whatever. If they don't change, I'm done reading their posts.

And Furd is right, you can generally tell when someone is using English and it's not their native tongue but the mistakes there tend not to be spelling and grammar as much as word choice. Those people get more patience from me, though I will definitely try to get them to use the correct word if it's significant to the question - like receptacle or fixture instead of outlet in the electrical forum.
 
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Old 08-29-12, 07:20 AM
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If they don't change, I'm done reading their posts.
I read them because the University of Cambridge says I am smart....LOL




blog.morgan.hk


Now this I have trouble reading.


Amazon.com
 
  #21  
Old 08-29-12, 07:42 AM
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Not related but Mike's signs reminded me of one I thought was funny a while back:

There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who do not.
 
  #22  
Old 08-29-12, 11:50 AM
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I thought that this was a DIY site. I didn't realize that it was monitored by the grammar police.

People come here to get help. None of us know what their circumstances are. Should we ignore a guy with a clogged toilet because he forgot to use a comma.
What if he's an 8th grade drop out or just a guy that has poor writing skills and he's doing the best he can?

It's one thing to ask for clarification of a poorly written post but to actually criticize or ignore someone looking for help is wrong. I wonder how the poster feels when he visits this site looking for help with an electrical problem and he gets a punctuation lesson instead? My guess is the next time he needs help he'll probably look elsewhere.
 
  #23  
Old 08-29-12, 12:33 PM
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Wayne: We're not talking about missing a comma, we're talking about situations where the sentences are so poorly structured as to be difficult to read - like an entire paragraph with no punctuation at all (and that happens with some regularity). IMO, most of the time this is due to laziness, not a lack of ability; the vast majority of those who speak English as their native language can do much better than this.

For those with limited skills, including those who are using English as a second (or more) language, the presentation will include a different set of errors, if you will, and those people do not get ignored.

I think a better way to say this is I'm looking for someone who wants help to have the common courtesy to write their question in a manner approaching the best they can acheive.
 
  #24  
Old 08-29-12, 04:29 PM
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My writing abilities are not very strong, but I try. I know exactly what type of post Furd was referring to in his first post. I just ignore them. I know it is only going to be a struggle the whole way through.

You have to at least separate your thoughts. There is no excuse for those people that come here and post with no periods. It makes no sense. My impression of the people that do that is that they are sitting on a pile of filth so high they have to hunch over in front of the computer so their head doesn't hit the ceiling. It is selfish and self absorbed.
 
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