One more reason why I hate Seattle.

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  #1  
Old 05-18-15, 03:30 AM
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One more reason why I hate Seattle.

Program offers meth pipes to drug users for free in Seattle | Local & Regional | Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News | KOMO News

While i am 100% against the "War on Drugs" this is just plain ludicrous. Here is another, although state-wide and soon to be all across the country: States help get heroin antidote into hands of regular folks | National & World News | Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News | KOMO News

I have no problem with publicly funded drug treatment centers, in fact I think they are an excellent use of tax dollars, HOWEVER, supplying drug users with the paraphernalia to continue their habit as well as antidotes to overdoses is simply giving these people the blessings of society to continue their parasitic actions against society in general.

In my opinion, if a drug addict wants to get clean they should be welcomed into a treatment program with the proviso that they have ONE allowance for falling off the wagon. After that one forgiveness if they fall again they are on their own. If they are convicted of any crime while under the influence of drugs they are out (after the one allowance) and any subsequent problems will be dealt with as a matter of law and not compassion. The TRUTH is that no one is forced to try illicit drugs, it is ALWAYS a choice and bad choices have bad consequences.

I come to this position having known some drug users over the years. Some were fairly benign such as many that used marijuana on a regular basis but still could hold down a full-time job without consequences. Some have been methamphetamine users and among those were some that kicked the habit as well as others that died as a result of their habit. I even had a somewhat close relationship with a heroin addict that was on a Methadone treatment plan.

I think that the insane War on Drugs at the federal level needs to halted and the money currently being misspent needs to be funneled to treatment for those that want it and the rest of the drug users can go to that eternally hot place. At a more local level I would allow anyone 21 or over to use whatever drugs they desired BUT they would be held totally responsible for their actions, meaning that if they violated any other laws (stealing, driving under the influence, harassment or whatever) they would be be held fully accountable under the specific laws in those violations. If someone had overdosed themselves I would NOT be in any hurry to give them the instant remedy (for heroin, as listed in the second news story) simply because it proves there is no need for a person to be responsible for themselves.

Harsh? You bet it is! Needed? I think so. This world is being destroyed by overpopulation and far too many people are giving nothing to society in general but ARE a major drain on society.

Just my opinion.
 
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Old 05-18-15, 03:42 AM
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I have to agree!________________________________
 
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Old 05-18-15, 04:56 AM
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While I'd prefer there was no illicit use of drugs, the main thing that gets me is how the druggies actions affect the innocent. It's one thing for them to destroy their own lives but when they steal to support their habit not to mention what they put their family's thru. 25 yrs ago about the only illegal substances in the area where I live were moonshine and marijuana, now it's meth and pills
 
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Old 05-18-15, 05:37 AM
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My niece was killed in a car accident by a heavy equipment driver who rear ended her and pushed her off the road. He was tired, coming down off his meth high. Witnesses say he was weaving all over the road. Unfortunately, in Nebraska the fact that he was on drugs was thrown out of the court evidence because unlike alcohol there is no test to determine exactly "how much" meth was in his system. He got a very light sentence (90 days) which was an injustice to the family, especially to her husband and infant who survived the crash. The judge even said that he didn't think prison time was appropriate. Really?
 
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Old 05-18-15, 07:40 AM
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I think a DIY heroin OD antidote is a great idea & long overdue. Heroin is so pernicious because it's cheap and reportedly the high is so amazing it easily addicts young new users. It's a fast-growing society plague that's in every high school in the nation. Unlike a typical poisoning, a heroin OD just blocks the body's automatic mechanism to breathe. An antidote (Naloxone) is cheap, quick and easy but a teenager who ODs at a drug house or friends basement often just gets pulled into an alley and left to die because the current alternative is to call police or EMS.
 
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Old 05-18-15, 07:58 AM
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Mark, I agree. If all those that desire to abuse drugs were to go off to a deserted island and "do their thing" I wouldn't care much at all. It isn't what they do to themselves that bothers me, not at all. It is what they do to everyone else that is criminal.

X, I am truly sorry for your loss. It was about 27 years ago my brother was killed by a man running a stop sign. As far as I know he wasn't impaired, it was truly an accident, but that doesn't make it any easier to accept. As for the judge...I wonder how he would have ruled if it had been his relative that was killed.

Guy, I was a teenager once as has been every single adult on the planet. MOST teenagers are able to prevent a heroin overdose by never trying heroin. I'm sick and tired of having to cater to the least common denominator. Now IF the person who overdosed learns his/her lessons and never again touches illicit drugs then I'm okay with saving their life. But how often does that same person go back to try it, or some other drug, again?
 
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Old 05-18-15, 04:35 PM
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I have no problem with needle exchange programs. I'm not sure this whole pipe exchange is doing the same thing. Sounds like a bit of a stretch.

I'm for the police and paramedics having Narcan. I don't see a downside to regular citizens having it either. They started a pilot program here with Narcan and it has saved many lives. It seems to be controversial and I'm not sure why. While I don't respect dope addicts and agree that they are in their position because of their own choices, I don't think we should be deciding who is worth saving and who isn't. Everyone should get the same level of service from the police and paramedics. If you don't want to save someone from an overdose, then you shouldn't be in the field of saving lives.
 
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Old 05-19-15, 09:12 AM
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Excellent post on all points, drooplug.

I'll add one thing regarding "choice". Certainly it's a bad choice to EVER try an addictive drug but teenagers aren't known for making the right choices. According to most experts, once addicted rational choice is off the table. I recently heard a presentation that claimed only about 2% of addicts kick the habit permanently. That's why therapists and 12-step programs say "relapse is part of recovery".
 
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Old 05-19-15, 04:23 PM
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There are also a lot of people who get hooked on opiates because of doctor prescribed drugs.
 
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Old 05-19-15, 05:08 PM
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Drooplug, That's very true. But I think a persons personality has something to do with getting hooked on any drug be it alcohol, caffeine, barbiturates, cocaine, etc...

I have no scientific data or anything other than my observation but I've noticed people with high IQ's or those that tend to be perfectionist (even if there life style does not exhibit success) will have a tendency to become addicted to things even if not drug related (food, candy, sex, work). Where as those that have a "take it or leave it" attitude and can be content with "average" results don't seem to get hooked on anything in particular.

I use myself as an example. I am a heavy coffee drinker and will drink it whenever its available. But if it's not available I don't need it nor crave it. Same goes for certain foods or snacks. When I had my two back surgeries I was told to take Oxycontin (spl?) or similar. After about a week I felt I was in a daze and feeling high (still had pain but so what). I did not like the feeling and stopped taking the drugs. Doctors yelled at me but I said I'll put up with the pain without drugs. I cannot get into the zone with exercise (running, gym workouts, sports in general) but yet I'll enjoy regular bicycle riding or working if it's a means to and end. Yet I know friends who will run in any weather (extreme heat or cold) in the name of being healthy. They are addicted to it. Many now have bad knees.

Point being, I think high achievers will tend to get addicted if opportunity presents itself.
 
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Old 05-20-15, 04:09 AM
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I don't know if it's personality or genetics but it does seem that some folks are predisposed to addiction. I experimented some with drugs when I was a teenager but never went hog wild although I had some friends that did I did have a fondness for beer and drank it daily for 20+ yrs for some reason I had no problems when I decided it was time to quit. For me that was a lot easier than quitting smoking.

Not sure I buy the highly intelligent perfectionist theory. There seems to be a lot of young dope heads around here that disprove that but maybe if they had never gotten involved in drugs .......
 
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Old 05-20-15, 04:42 AM
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Yeah, there are people that are predisposed. I don't see a link with it only being high achievers. There is also a different between addiction and habit.
 
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Old 05-21-15, 06:49 PM
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What's to hate about Seattle other than a relatively liberal approach to the issue of drug abuse? I heard it's a nice city. Was actually thinking about visiting to see if it's somewhere where I might want to live. Tired of Midwest and, while enjoy DC metro, not fully sold.
 
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Old 05-21-15, 08:43 PM
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I agree, Seattle is a nice place to VISIT. Would I ever live there...no. Far too many "slackers" in my opinion. They go to school...work at a restaurant, a bookstore, hang out with friends, etc etc...but many never get beyond that.

Not that they aren't smart or interesting folks, but when a place decides how much people should be paid and that they can just stand on the street smoking dope (that was State)...sorry, I'm out.
 
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Old 05-23-15, 10:37 AM
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Furd,

You expect people to be responsible for themselves? Seriously? Unfortunately it seems we need to cater to the ones that can't follow the expected social mores. Then there are those that will always find a way to say that they are victims and that someone else needs to pay or to be sued.
 
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Old 05-23-15, 12:37 PM
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Nowhere did I state that people need to be responsible for themselves, what I DID state is that they need to be responsible for their actions. There IS a difference.

I know, an interesting concept that is all but lost in today's society.
 
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