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Got a problem with someone holding a title on my vehicle? What should i do... IL

Got a problem with someone holding a title on my vehicle? What should i do... IL

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  #1  
Old 11-14-10, 07:06 PM
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Exclamation Got a problem with someone holding a title on my vehicle? What should i do... IL

Long story short.. EX PROBLEMS
I was dating this girl years ago, and i needed a new truck. I went to a used car dealership and got a loan on a truck. I needed a cosigner, and she signed. As her credit was better, the dealership worked the loan with her name first on the title. We were on the same insurance policy...
I was making my payments on the truck and we started to fall apart. I lost my job, and we had to move. We seperated, and eventually cut it all off. She was P.O.ed when i got involved in another relationship.

There was a balance of maybe $1500 left on the truck. I was out of work still. She told me she was pulling me off of the insurance policy. I told her, that was fine, but the problem was that the truck still being under a loan, had to be insured. She decided to take a chunk of her tax return and make a one time payment to the lein holder and pay off the truck. They sent her the title. Both of our names are on the title. Since then, I havent had work... Decided to return to school and continue on with my life...
SHE is still holding the title saying that i need to pay her for the balance of the truck. I told her that i thought that was a bit unfair as i paid for pretty much everything including bills that were not mine when we were together and that she should just give me the title. She refuses to answer phone calls or emails to her work. She has since moved from her last known address and I have no clue where it is. I only think that its still in Illinois, and im unsure if she still works at the same job. But more than likely she does.
I want the title to my truck, but if i request a copy from the DMV in Illinois, they need a copy of the lein payoff from what i was told.
I really dont know what to do, as Id be just fine putting insurance on the truck (if they will let me at an insurance company) and driving it until the thing blows up.... But what do i do then? Can i just turn it in to a junkyard with no title? Should i tell her to just come pick up the truck?
The total amount on the loan was around $6000 i paid all of it up to about $1500 left, and her last claim was that she wanted $1200 from me to get the title? I dont have $1200 to just give her, nor do i think that i should. Shes just pissed that i moved on, and i didnt want her in my life anymore.

Is there anyway that i can legally force her to give me the title? Or is there anyway that I can legally get rid of the truck? If i sold it to someone and they wanted the title.... I dont know what she would do when the "law" became involved? Can she sue me? Or it probably wouldnt even be worth it to her?
Thanks for your help, and ANY questions needed- ILL answer....
 
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  #2  
Old 11-14-10, 07:40 PM
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I was making my payments on the truck and we started to fall apart. I lost my job, and we had to move. . . .

There was a balance of maybe $1500 left on the truck. I was out of work still.
The way it’s worded makes it sound like you made payments on the truck until you guys started falling apart. Seems to imply she started making payments after you lost your job. Is that correct? If so, what was the total amount of truck payments she made? What is the estimated fair value of the truck today?
 
  #3  
Old 11-14-10, 08:02 PM
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First off~ thank you for the response and help...
You made a great point that i didnt even make note of in my O.P.!

The way we had it "verbally" agreed upon was that I would pay her $300 a week out of my check which was towards my truck and bills. Truck payment totaled $140 a month and insurance was $120 a month. Figured this was good as she was an accountant. Guess again, as all bills fell behind and were bouncing out of disconnect/shutoff all the time. Always playing catchup (irrelevant anyhow).

But She had set up automatic deductions from her bank account for the truck payments/insurance/and her car payments.

So if you look at it from the "paperwork" standpoint, all payments came directly from her account...

In "fair" condition (which its probably not), Private Party value from KBB is around $2500 right now? (just checked that online now)
 
  #4  
Old 11-14-10, 10:32 PM
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Let’s start with the legal part. Since the title is in both of your names, I think each of you would have a 50% interest in the truck absent anything in writing to the contrary. If you had an at fault accident involving 3rd party injuries or damages, and there was no insurance on the truck, a judge might rule in favor of the injured 3rd party by giving that person an opportunity to collect from one or both of you. In other words, a judge is not going to try sorting out this mess in a way that harms an innocent 3rd party when both of you helped create it. I wonder if your ex has considered this angle as she could find herself in a major bind if such scenario unfolded.

On the other hand, if either you or your ex-girlfriend sued the other, I think you’re the loser in that scenario. The only reason she would sue is if you further aggravated her and she wants to make your life miserable . . . it will cost her more than she will get but she can also run-up your costs if it becomes a matter of principle rather than money. I don’t know her demeanor but I doubt she has money to burn. I think a judge would find evidence that (i) your credit was bad before you lost your job, (ii) your ex had her own car and didn’t need to buy a truck for her personal benefit, (iii) you needed a truck and was the primary user, and (iv) your ex was trying to help you out. While not knowing what was going through her head, I suspect your $300/week payments to her stopped coming or became irregular after you lost your job. She probably wondered why she was stuck making your truck payments and paying high interest to the finance company. Therefore, she elected to pay-off the loan balance rather than pay a larger amount through monthly payments. This action was taken to protect her credit score, and not intended to be construed by you as an act of generosity. In trying to settle this matter, she asked you to pay back $1,200 and I think she was telling you she would sign over the title to you. Instead of making any claims for half the value of the truck, I think she was willing to walk away at that point. I think she just wants out of this bad situation but is not going to allow you to walk over her. By disappearing, I think she has analyzed the situation by feeling you wouldn’t ever pay her a dime, so she is out nothing by holding on to the title. Once she mentally writes off the money as uncollectable, she essentially turns the table by letting you squirm in trying to figure out how you’ll eventually get rid of it since you have no lawful way to sell it. It would be a bad idea to fraudulently convey title as they will come after you, not her unless she participated in the scheme which I don’t think she is going to do. I think you’re two alternatives is to (ii) reach a settlement w/ her, if possible or (ii) junk the truck at some point. You may run into issues junking it as most guys are going to want to have title to protect themselves from adverse claims. You might call your state’s motor vehicle dept. to see if they have any remedy to pass title if a person named on it cannot be found.

While I read you trying to justify why you feel you should pay her nothing, I wonder if you really believe you’re being fair and reasonable to her. The fact that you came into this relationship w/ bad credit makes me think this is not a first time occurrence.
 
  #5  
Old 11-15-10, 04:20 AM
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How is the ownership recorded on the title? you and her or you or her ??
There is a big difference with those 2 words. And - requires 2 signatures. Or - only needs 1 signature to sell the truck.

You should be able to get a copy of the lien satisfaction from the lender.
 
  #6  
Old 11-15-10, 05:16 AM
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Your absolutely correct to the most part. She did decide to pay off the truck, mainly due to the fact that she wanted to drop the insurance on me. As since the truck was covered on the policy, i was also named on the policy. If removed, her rate went down. But the only way she could drop the truck from the policy was to pay the remaining balance of the truck.

NO~ this hasnt happened to me before. My credit wasnt "bad", its just I had NO credit. And at the time a "new" vehicle was WAY to high on payments. But the dealership could of gotten me into a new car. They also could of gotten me into the loan for the truck with my name "first", but the rate was going to be higher. Thats why we decided to go with her name first.

YES~ she did say that if i paid the $1200 she would sign over the title to me. But im stuck in a position now of not having the $1200, and thats extremely embarrassing to say. I was making great wages and great money. She just dragged me down with our finances. I made alot more money than she, and she always was falling behind on things as i helped her get back on track only for her to in turn to ignore the fact of everyday bills coming in. In all reality the girl took my money to pay for her car/cell phone/past credit and pay "her" childs care.

Do i feel, im being "fair and resonable" to her, probably not in reality as the easiest situation would be just to give her some money. I wish i could just run and pay the $1200 and have her disappear altogether. But at this moment in time, thats not something that is going to happen. What i was wondering was, is there a way that i can just have the title in my hand???? Im not going to sell it, as I need my vehicle... I just want to be able to not have to have her hang on to it. Is there anyway that i can legally obtain the title from her?

As for my two alternatives--- Like stated before, i would love to settle with her and just remove her name from the title. or Ill run the truck into the ground and then junk it? But, like stated before, Is there anything she can do if she somehow finds out the truck has been junked? Or will the "law" somehow track her down and end up holding her responsible in some way for the truck? I dont want to cause MORE problems, and the easiest solution on my side is for her to just sign the title, walk away. But im assuming she wont do this due to the fact that she is still P.O.'d at me for leaving her.

Her credit was NEVER destroyed in the process of our relationship. If anything, I made it better for her.
 
  #7  
Old 11-16-10, 07:14 PM
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She did you a favor and took a substantial risk by using her credit so you could buy a vehicle. Then she paid it off when you were unemployed and unable to make payments.

Suppose the truck had been in your name? Very likely it would have been repossessed and you would have lost the vehicle.

You want the title? Accept the deal she offered you ---the title in exchange for $1200. That's entirely reasonable as I read the facts.

Can't afford that payment now? Send her a contract to sign in which she agrees to sign over the title when she receives $1200 in payments, and enclose a check for $100 for the initial payment.

If she sends you back the signed contract, send her additional payments as soon as you can until this transaction is concluded.

I'd also thank her for the time you spent together and her generosity in helping you buy the vehicle.
 
  #8  
Old 11-17-10, 04:50 AM
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Yes, I knew this was the easiest solution... And thats more than likely what will end up having to happen. But, ill be sure to do all except for
"thanking her for time spent together"... Thats a cold day!!!

Thanks for your help everyone...
 
  #9  
Old 11-17-10, 05:48 AM
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Yes, I knew this was the easiest solution... And thats more than likely what will end up having to happen. But, ill be sure to do all except for . . .
cturboaddict-I should’ve asked this question earlier as I made an assumption this has been playing out over the past year or so. Is that assumption correct, or does this go back years ago?
 
  #10  
Old 11-17-10, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob R. View Post
cturboaddict-I should’ve asked this question earlier as I made an assumption this has been playing out over the past year or so. Is that assumption correct, or does this go back years ago?
Your correct Sir, just figure she paid it when income tax refunds came in this year.

Would anything change if it was longer?
 
  #11  
Old 11-17-10, 08:02 AM
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After reading your responses as being a person who may be more open and straight forward than I first assumed, I decided to read some of your unrelated posts.

A recent one (11/6/10) caught my attention when you said . . . “My wife reminded me that last year we had trouble with it turning off. . .”.

That made me think whether this situation goes back years ago, and being better not to shake the bushes to see what might come out.

With your clarification, not only should you think about tracking your ex-girlfriend down but what are consequences should she track you down at your home and your wife opens the door to greet her. Just think about whether this could disrupt your life if trying to move on, and possible ways to blunt the effect should that scenario unfold.

I also did a search of ‘involuntary conversion of car title’ to see if there might be an opening for you to maneuver through. I was wondering how a family might move on w/ their lives if a member went missing for a long number of years, and how they might cure title to allow a vehicle to be sold if jointly titled w/ a missing family member. I did not find a specific procedure like this in IL after searching their DMV website (doesn’t mean that one doesn’t exist). In reading PA’s procedure, suffice it to say that it appears more designed for a situation not involving a money dispute as it requires publishing notices in newspapers and going before a hearing officer to make a ruling. An affidavit from a detective showing law enforcement could not locate the missing person would likely bolster the case. While the procedure doesn’t specifically exclude a money dispute, I think it would be difficult for you to handle your type situation in this manner.

Also, take a careful look at what marksr said at #5 to be sure an opening is not created if the title happened to be worded ‘or’. While it takes stringing bits and pieces of info together, I think this finally ended up as your ex as a co-borrower, not a co-signor. This leads me to think the lender worded it as ‘and’. If you’re not absolutely sure about how it was worded, go to your local DMV and demand access to see it as it should be considered a public record. Another issue that hasn’t surfaced is whether you will be mailed your tag renewal or whether your ex directed that to her address . . . may be a way to track her down assuming you want to.

There was a carve out provision in PA’s procedure so that salvagers’ could change ownership on title for abandoned cars so they would not be indefinitely stuck storing them. At IL’s DMV, I saw several links related to abandoned cars. Since your truck is probably nearing the end of it’s useful life, this may be something you want to look at as a way for you to get off this title at some point. By not leaving anyway for you to contact her, my guess is that your ex-girlfriend has also decided to move on w/ her life, especially if she determined you have a wife. However, people change their minds. You should think through ways to cover yourself should your ex-girlfriend surface someday and makes claims for money she believes are owed to her. One consideration might be to send a certified, return receipt letter to her at her last known address. If you write her a letter, keep it very professional, aimed at fairly resolving this matter, and a specific deadline for her to notify you of her decision as such letter could surface as evidence, and hopefully in your favor if properly drafted. If she left a forwarding address, then you’ll have to say what your willing to do to settle this matter . . . it should also be persuasive in telling her why it is in her interest to settle if you go the route of abandoning (i.e., junking) this vehicle as neither of you are well served to leave your names on a title as there is no way of knowing if this vehicle could end-up back on the road. If she left no forwarding address, the returned letter will evidence your attempt. Make sure you make a copy of the envelope, letter (best if it shows the USPS tracking number at bottom of letter), and mailing receipt. If the postal service returns the envelope as undeliverable, do not open it and store this in a safe place for future reference along w/ the copy you retained.

I hope you guys get this sorted out so that everyone involved is satisfied enough and can move forward in life.
 
  #12  
Old 11-17-10, 09:52 AM
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I've bought and financed 2 vehicles with my wife and both were titled 'me or her' I just doubled checked the registration on our new jeep and it has 'me or her' listed as the owner. We bought a new merc in 1998 and when she sold it, she signed the title, I didn't need to.

While I wouldn't condone not paying someone what they are owed - I would think verifying how the title is worded would be the 1st order of business. If it isn't clear on your registration, the DMV office can get the info for you [it should be free] I've been told here in tenn you can take a vehicle to the crusher without a tittle IF the vehicle is over a certain age. I don't know this for a fact
 
  #13  
Old 11-18-10, 05:59 AM
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@ Rob R.
Thats easily seen, as I always put it.. "Things written in text on paper, can EASILY be taken out of context". Think about it: Legal Paperwork, Text Messages, emails, forum posts, traffic tickets-it never seems on paper what is really going on in reality for the most part.

Yes, my wife knows whats going on. Her "take" on it is, you should just get some money together when you can and see if she will settle for it that amount. IE offer her $800 cash when i have it, and see if she will bite...

And Ill have to look more deeply into the "junking" of the truck, if that comes first. In all reality, i dont want to get stuck in a situation where the truck becomes "worthless" in a resell, and have to lose money on trying to get rid of it. And i dont want to go tracking her down just yet, as if i do find her... Her response will be more likely of~ I want my money... Understandable but unfeasible at this time for me.

Also, im more than pretty sure that this is a Co-borrower situation vs a co-signer situation.

@marksr
Ill try and see what DMV can do to help. But i know when i asked them about obtaining a duplicate title- That meant i had to verify that the previous title is lost and that i would have to show the payoff of the lein? Im unsure if that would still have to be done seeing that the title was still sent though.

And for my tag resgistration paperwork? Ill have to double check that, as i have the paperwork here at home to renew it. It needs to be done, but as i said-I havent really driven the truck as its just been sitting here.

Im hoping that calling an insurance company to insure it shouldnt be a problem even though her name is still on the title.

Thanks for all of your guy's help.
 
  #14  
Old 11-18-10, 06:15 AM
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Insurance shouldn't be a problem. My wife helped our daughter in law buy a new car. She has bad credit so the car and the loan is in my wife's name. The car is insured on my stepson's policy and him and his wife make the payments.
 
  #15  
Old 11-18-10, 06:43 AM
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Maybe it works differently...but when I've purchased a vehicle (new)..I never even saw the title til it was paid off. When it was, they (loan company) sent it to me stamped and sealed paid in full...then I went down to DMV and got a clean title with no liens.

When I bought one used....I had to go in and have the title transferred...but since I paid the full amount..I'm not sure about any liens or anything.

DMV should have a record of if there are any liens still listed...if there are..then you'd still need to contact her.

Sorry if any of this was said before...
 
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