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Shed - Rehab or Tear Down & Start From Scratch???

Shed - Rehab or Tear Down & Start From Scratch???


  #1  
Old 03-19-10, 10:19 AM
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Shed - Rehab or Tear Down & Start From Scratch???

I recently bought a house with a 20x20 shed that has seen some better days (its 100 years old). I actually think it used to be a horse barn back in the day. It was built on a rubble/rock foundation and has a dirt floor. The wood frame is in good shape. It has a single pitch roof that needs new sheathing/shingles.

I am considering rehabing the shed. It would probably be much easier to tear and down and build a new one but the code police are insane here. Anything bigger than 8x16 requires a permit with stamped plans, and the whole works. It is treated the same as if you are building a house. I understand the reasons, but these people are way overboard. They are really picky/annoying and expensive. So I'd like to save the shed if it makes economic sense. (I have to jack it up to put a real foundation under it and pour a slab).

That said, I could use your advice on whether or not I should tear it down. The decision is going to largely be based on cost. I've helped build other peoples sheds but never my own, so short of drafting some plans and getting pricing from Lowes I figured I'd ask you guys.

If I build a 8x16 shed....this is what I would go for:
1. Concrete Footings
2. 4x4 PT wood beams
3. 2x8x16 PT floor joists, 16"OC
4. 3/4 Plywood floor
5. 2x4 walls, 24"OC
6. 2x4 Trussed Gambrel Roof
7. 1/2 Plywood sheathing on roof, 3/8 Plywood on walls
8. 20/25yr shingles
9. Tyvek or similar house wrap
10. Double 30" doors in front
11. Two small windows
12. Cheap vinyl siding

Can anyone provide a ballpark figure on how much you think it would cost to build a shed like this yourself? I'm just looking for a guestimate. Thanks in advance!
 
  #2  
Old 03-19-10, 12:12 PM
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Shed

I would make 2 changes:
Use 8 ft. floor joists.
Space wall studs on 16 in. centers.

Start with the foundation and work your way up listing a bill of materials.
Will you mix the concrete for the foundation or buy ready mix delivered ready to place in the forms?

General List:
Foundation materials and form materials
Mud sill
Floor joists and rim joists
Joist hangers
Plywood floor
Wall framing including bottom plate, studs, and double top plate
Plywood for walls
Doors ( or material to make them yourself)
Door hardware
Windows?
Roof framing
Roof Sheathing
Roofing felt
Roof shingles
Outside trim materials
Nails and screws
Paint
 

Last edited by Wirepuller38; 03-19-10 at 12:14 PM. Reason: Additions
  #3  
Old 03-19-10, 12:26 PM
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I'm okay with those changes, it makes perfect sense any wont cause that much extra.

I'll be mixing the concrete by hand one sona tube at a time.
 
  #4  
Old 03-19-10, 01:04 PM
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Quick story. Riding stable had a big old barn just 10 feet off of the road. It was an eyesore. They wanted to tear it down and build a nice new one. Town said "no", if you tear it down, it would be too close to the road to allow you to re-build. So he asked if he needed a permit to re-model the inside and they said no. So his re-model job was actually a complete new barn built inside the old one. This is a true story. Then he asked if he needed permission to remove the old barn. Thinking they had won they said no permit required. He removed the old barn and there stood the brand new one, just a bit smaller. Today, I don't think I would recommend this, as future permits could have problems.

Anyway, I have torn down several old buildings and the ones that were just old could have easily been saved. Make sure you can get it up off of the ground enough so there are no water issues and add pressure treated where it rests on the concrete. If you do the rehab all at once, will they still want a permit?

Bud
 
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Old 03-19-10, 02:58 PM
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Good story! You bring up a good point too. This 20x20 shed is within 3 ft of the neighbors yard. They are okay with this and actually like it because it acts like a fence. To replace it would require an easement (sp?). Funny enough, that is cheaper than getting the permits.

I would prefer to rehab the shed. It is bigger and shouldn't take any permits to do so. I wont be doing it all at once. One project will be improving the internal framing, the next jacking it up and puting some sort of foundation in there, the next would be replacing the siding, etc. It would be strung out over months.

The big thing is the cost. I'm getting estimates (and asking you guys) for the cost of a 19x19 slab which is the major cost in rehabing this shed. I am also looking to see how much an 8x16 shed would cost to build. If it is a lot cheaper to build from scratch I will do that.

Anyone have any idea how much the shed I've mentioned would cost to build? Rough ballpark guestimate?
 
  #6  
Old 03-19-10, 04:55 PM
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I'm trying to think of a number, but it is tough without doing a current cost. No way $2,000 will touch it. $5,000 can build a really nice shed and yours is looking nice. You do all the labor and you will probably be in the $3,000 to $4,000 range. Just off the top of my head. But things change, like, 3/8" plywood is more expensive than 7/16 osb. You may be required to use 5/8" on the roof. Trusses have a setup charge for small runs. Any lights out there? Any inside drywall? It should be anchored to the ground. Are those footings going to float or are they going below the frost line? Trim for the doors and windows. What are you using for fascia and soffit, with or without overhang? Any overhang on the gable ends? Any venting? Ramp or steps coming in?

There's always more.

Bud
 
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Old 03-19-10, 06:05 PM
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Good questions Bud! The labor would be done myself. I'm fine with OSB except maybe the floor. I don't want to spill something or leave the door open in the rain and end up with spongy wood.

I was actually thinking of building the trusses myself. It seems somewhat easy to do. Sure, it would be my first time but there are plenty of guides out there books to help me figure out the angles no? I suppose everyone who has done it did it for the first time at some point.

No electricity, no drywall. Everything would be anchored properly and the footings would be 4 ft deep. Trim for doors and windows would be minimal, most likely some vinyl product. Fascia for soffit with overhangs, no overhangs on gable end. I'm undecided on exactly what type of venting but more than likely I will have some sort of gable vent. I will build a small PT ramp.

You're right....it never ends.
 
  #8  
Old 03-21-10, 01:15 PM
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I'm with Wirepuller and Bud -- your original list needed some changes. Run the floor joists in the short direction, like Wirepuller suggested. That will eliminate the need for a center support beam under the joists (which the 2X8X16's would have needed) and it will allow you to use 2X6 joists rather than 2X8'. More than enough savings to make up for the extra joist hangers that would be needed.

The 7/16 OSB is going to be less expensive than the 3/8 ply for the wall sheathing, and it's stronger.

The 3/4 ply for the floor should be T&G, and run it in the opposite direction of the floor joists -- 2 sheets in the 16' direction, and stagger the joints between the two runs of it. (One run will be 2 full 4X8 sheets and the other will have a 4X4 panel at each end of the run with a full sheet in the center of the run.)

Roof sheathing can also be 7/16 OSB -- that's as strong as 5/8 ply. Another savings.

Material cost will be in the range of $3500 to $4K, give or take.
 
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Old 03-22-10, 04:26 AM
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Thanks guys! The deeper I get into this, the more consideration I give into rehabing the existing shed. Your input has been much appreciated and it looks like a new shed would cost a little bit more than I originally expected.

It will likely cost around the same or less to rehab the existing shed but the end result will be much better. I'll end up with a 20x20 instead of a 8x14. I'll also have a garage door and a concrete slab.

The only tricky thing to do now is to figure out a way to move the existing shed out of the way so the slab can be poured. I'll probably brace the hell out of the shed and jack it up enough and put it on some sort of rollers and pull it out of the way. It would make working on the slab a thousand times easier. I'll probably start a new thread on how to move the shed. Thanks agaiin!
 
  #10  
Old 03-23-10, 05:59 AM
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From what you describe I would keep it and fix it If it has stood for 100 years on it's foundation why mess with it? Is it leaning? If not then I would build a wooden floor using pressure treated joists attached to existing studs. If needed a ledger board could also be used. If the foundation is really that bad then get some foundation blocks and put a few of them around. It's a shed after all and if it heaves a little so what.
 
  #11  
Old 03-24-10, 04:44 AM
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I would say 75% of the foundation is in good enough shape. The remaining 25% has shifted over time and needs some help. After all, it is just rubble and rock so I suppose it wont take a great deal of effort to push it back into place. Throw some mortar in there and done! (sort of)

My original thoughts were similar to yours mgmine. Its just a shed, some heaving is okay, and its already stood for 100 years.

A concrete slab would be nice but it would require a huge effort. The shed would have to be braced like crazy and moved out of the way while a slab could be poured. A wood floor is starting to sound like a good idea! Not to mention it would be much much cheaper.
 
  #12  
Old 03-24-10, 06:57 AM
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I have a log cabin in Canada that had a 16x20 wood shed out back with a dirt floor. At least 40 years ago a floor was put down buy laying 2x4's on the dirt and covering them with pine boards. Pressure treated wood wasn't even available at the time. It's still in use today and doesn't show the least bit of spring. The only foundation holding the log walls up are the native stones that were either in the corners or put there.
 
 

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