Custom Shed Build. Half Undergound

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  #1  
Old 08-09-14, 08:35 AM
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Custom Shed Build. Half Undergound

Hello people. im in the process of building a shed 10 x 10 or by 12. its going to be 5 foot underground and 7 above. i plan on building it half brick and half wood(on top) im not a builder. just love the shed idea and being able to customize it is this the place to be ??? any help/ideas on this would be great thanks
 
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Old 08-09-14, 10:25 AM
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Welcome to the forums! Your profile is incomplete so we don't know where you are located. Nothing underground will be build of brick. Concrete masonry units (CMU) , but ONLY after a proper floor is excavated and poured with moisture barrier below it, and edge footings for the weight of the building. You will need to excavate enough earth to allow for the construction of the wall as well as the waterproofing of the outside of the CMU. Otherwise you will have a 5' deep pool with a 7' cover.

The CMU will need to extend above the water table and from there you can start your wooden structure with a pressure treated sill plate. What do you intend to do with a 12' high shed with such a small footprint?
 
  #3  
Old 08-09-14, 12:52 PM
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cheeres for the reply. im in ireland. and not even blocks ? i need some thing cheap and wont rot when its covered with soil i was planning on wood on top as a second floor
 
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Old 08-09-14, 01:02 PM
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I don't know how you are going to build it without concrete flooring and block or poured walls, atop of which you can build your upper level. Remember, 12 divided by 2 will only be 6' for ceiling height, then take away 8 or 10 inches for joisting, you will have less than 5 1/2 feet head space in each cubicle.

Bottom line, wood will rot below grade. It will need waterproofing from the outside. Good luck.
 
  #5  
Old 08-09-14, 02:57 PM
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yea im not to sure about the base im gonna have to fill it with a base i guess. il upload pictures tomorrow of the area and abit more detail and well see from there thanks again
 
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Old 08-11-14, 06:55 PM
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Right! i only got my hands on a camera today so il up load a pics tomorrow and try sort out what can be done here. if anyone has any input comment away thanks
 
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Old 08-23-14, 03:16 AM
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Name:  SHED.jpg
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Size:  27.3 KB the rough sketch of the plans.. any help here?
 
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Old 08-23-14, 03:36 AM
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Nothing changed. Concrete floor on rock base with vapor barrier; concrete masonry unit (CMU) walls with extensive waterproofing and water drainage system on the outside prior to backfill; Bilco type entrance door. The fun part will be designing your roof, which you have left out. How close are the trees to the proposed site. You don't want their root system degrading the wall integrity.
 
  #9  
Old 08-23-14, 10:12 AM
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yea i dont think il be going with cmu walls because simply i wont have enough money to. instead ill be using the concreate base with stones around it for drainage and cavity blocks 4-5 ft high all around with stones around that also for drainage. but il need to cover the wall for insulation purpose aswell form the stones. i only plan on filling 2-3 foot of the border with stones and the rest air. and the trees a foot or so away and about half a foot from the wall but i havnet seen hugh roots or to many it does seem like it wil be a prob. + it has a nice soil bank on the other side of it with load of underground growing room, so hopefuly it will start to spread its roots that way
 
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Old 08-23-14, 10:22 AM
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photo ,...Name:  photosheddd.jpg
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Size:  27.5 KB this is the site im working on fill the hole with gravel and making small drainage trenches for gravel and possibley pipe if i can get my hands on it free
 
  #11  
Old 08-23-14, 10:23 AM
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Sorry, this sounds like a plan that's going to fail.
 
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Old 08-23-14, 01:55 PM
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I know we can't stop you, but our advice will remain the same. Don't do it. You are not using very good common sense or good building practices. You are zipping through your construction without regard to the finished product. Your walls will fail. They will leak since you don't want to excavate enough to properly waterproof it. Even if you had drainage trenches, where would they lead to?

Please reconsider doing this, as your time and money will be ill used for a project that will fail. Remember, we do this sort of thing for a living, and have already seen what can happen if someone does not take precautions.
 
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Old 08-25-14, 07:11 AM
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fair enough then. if i take it at a different angle and not go so underground (just a foot after the foundations in and good stone drainage and any brick underground waterproof painted and coved in plastic). as for the top floor should be easyer since it wil be out of timber and il more familiar with wood work. But my next question is connecting the timber frame to the cavitys and strong flooring? not that there wil be any major weight on the top floor, just good strusture in general
 
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Old 08-25-14, 10:59 AM
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connecting the timber frame to the cavitys and strong flooring
Usually you'll either fill the block cavity with concrete and insert a tie down bolt for the bottom plate or mortar the tie down bolt in between 2 cap blocks. Sometimes you can get by with just tap con screws into the cap block. Metal straps can be used to tie the floor framing to the 2x bottom plate.
 
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Old 08-27-14, 10:41 AM
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does anyone have an easyer explaination for this, as im a begginger with buiding i didnt understrand a word u said lol well the best bit of it anyway
 
  #16  
Old 08-30-14, 04:05 AM
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anyone more beginners info on this. its no long gonna be under ground just 8 x 10 foot and 12 foot hight with the bottom 3 foot made from brick and the rest timber. 4if anyone has good help on this , much appreciated or if u can guide me so some that can. that would be great thanks. and remember the main things is this is budget build 700-800 hun. tops.Cheers
 
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Old 08-30-14, 05:29 AM
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Brick are not structural. You will ned to dig a footing, probably a foot deep around your perimeter and pour with concrete, after termite treating the ground. Then you will be laying about 110 concrete blocks to achieve your wall height. Fill the cavities and install sill straps or "L" bolts into the concrete. Lay down 2x8 pressure treated wood flat around the perimeter. You will need to pour a floor. At this point you will have exceeded your budget.
 
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Old 08-30-14, 06:33 AM
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If you can go with an elevated floor, you should be able to get by with just digging/pouring footers for the 'legs' and then frame it up having a wood floor. Still going to be tight with that budget.
 
  #19  
Old 09-13-14, 02:54 PM
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hello again diy and builders. im getting a order of concrete next week for my base at 1.5m3, 35N - 10. Iv 1 tone of hardcore to be compacted into the 11 x 8 hole. Does anyone know how thick it will be when its in ?? thanks
 
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Old 09-13-14, 03:02 PM
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1.5m3, 35N - 10.
No idea what this nomenclature is. Put it in American terms, give us the thickness of the concrete pad and we can give you what you need. How much concrete are you ordering in cubic yards?
 
  #21  
Old 09-13-14, 03:26 PM
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1.5 cubic metre at 35 newton with small gravel mix. yards im not sure but is 1.5 cubic metre, but im hoping the hardcore under the concrete will be atleast 4 inch thinck the base dimensions again are 11 x 8 and iv a tone of harcore. do u know how thick the hardcore will turn out to be ??
 

Last edited by Tom O Toole; 09-13-14 at 03:41 PM.
  #22  
Old 09-18-14, 05:09 PM
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About cement mixs for 4' block laying (not cavity). what do i need for the cement mix and ill be laying about 150 blocks how much ruffly does a 25kg bag of cement stick blocks? iv heard that read mix sand and cement is better for smaller jobs but is abit more expencive. also gona upload a photo tomorrow to so u wer im at withe the foundation
 
  #23  
Old 09-20-14, 03:59 AM
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heres where im at now with the membrane and flattened hardcore underneath wait for the concrete

Mod note: See above pics
 

Last edited by lawrosa; 09-27-14 at 07:35 AM. Reason: Pic removed per request
  #24  
Old 09-27-14, 07:00 AM
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DPM with 4'' Hardcore under it Name:  photo (2)022.jpg
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And the 8'' concrete base Name:  photo.jpg
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Size:  47.2 KB first time poring and leveling a base and by myself, turnd out not to bad at all
 
  #25  
Old 10-06-14, 05:25 AM
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building the walls next week on the base, 3ft high X 8'' thick. It will be soild 4'' blocks on there side. but theres two corners of the base slightly uneven, about an inch or so. Name:  base levels.jpg
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i was thinking the best way to do this would be adding a little extra cement to the blocks on side that are to low and a tiny bit less on the corners to high. Any good sugestions for a strong fix on this? Cheers
 
  #26  
Old 10-22-14, 01:47 PM
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Right i need to attach 6 x 6 timber beams to a timber 8'' timber plank on an 8'' wall how do i go about doing this ? i guessing i need something like vertical Joist holders sucured with bolts, would that be about right, thanks
 
  #27  
Old 11-04-14, 11:49 AM
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Can anyone help me with supporting timber framing? iv 6x6'' posts on each corner of the frame witch will be on a block wall but i dont know how to hold the beams to the wall ? once there in place i can continue to support them more with the rest of the stud framing inbetween. i just need a verified idea for a stong hold. Thanks
 
  #28  
Old 11-25-14, 11:59 AM
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just a quick picture that i took this morning, the bottom floor framing is now done the second floor might be tricky because i plan on making it a foot wider on each wall. so there will be a small overhang to work with and support, that im not 100% about yet. Name:  3image.jpg
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Old 11-25-14, 02:20 PM
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Hopefully this won't be an inhabited building. Wall bottom plates must be pressure treated. Studs must be 16" on center, your top plates must be tied across each other to keep the walls tied together. How do you plan on keeping water out of this boat with a 3' hole in it? Your walls need to be braced in both directions, or siding/OSB installed to prevent racking.
 
  #30  
Old 11-25-14, 02:55 PM
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its mainily going to be a games room to be honest. and i bought the timber wall plates treated and treated them again myself and bolted with through bolts. the stud spacing on the bottom flooor now is 12'' and will probley do 16'' on the top half. the top plates are doubled with the 2nd top plate slightly longer then the one under and srewed to the top of the studs. as for the walls i have Grace product Bitumen GP and a protector layer. on the far side the door way will be this kinda idea, with steps going down Name:  door.jpg
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Size:  12.2 KB. Will a 1' overhang be a problem to support is there a certin way i should go about the second floor framing.
thanks
 

Last edited by Tom O Toole; 11-25-14 at 03:11 PM. Reason: spelling
  #31  
Old 11-25-14, 04:58 PM
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No the overhang won't present a problem, properly fastened and braced. The Bilco is a good idea. Be sure to waterproof it all from the outside prior to backfill.
 
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Old 11-26-14, 03:33 AM
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thats grand so Bilco, the word i was looking for yea il build the steps and run the waterproofing around that aswell for a full seal. cheers for the help and support il put up a pic again soon at the next stage
 
  #33  
Old 11-29-14, 04:37 PM
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need advice on a good way to sucure the second floor to the top of the bottom floor roof ( to stop it sliding off basically) im using 3x2s on top of these beams and doubled on the outer sides, and then the 4x2 stud wall bottom plate on top of them. witch i can just put 4' screws through into the 3x2s or nails if u think it would be ok. heres a rough pic of what i mean... its the white lines that im not sure how to fix.Name:  IMG_13764.jpg
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Old 11-30-14, 04:01 AM
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First, your lumber can't be laid on its side as you have it. Joists stand on edge. You have no strength the way you have them, now. Stand them on edge, apply a band board around the tails and install hurricane ties where they meet your top plate on the lower level.
 
  #35  
Old 11-30-14, 11:32 AM
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i was thinking that about the beams wasnt to sure tho. the overhang is covered by these beams from left to right (a foot extra each side) and the 2x3 from door to back wall, also a foot. since the 3x2s are over hanging long ways on there side also, on top of the 9x3s. how can these be fastned so the frame can go on to them then. if i was to screw through them into the beams below with 4-5 inch screws id need at least. would ths be the way. i didnt understand the'band board around the tails' part in the last comment that might answer this if i knew what it was lol. cheers
 
  #36  
Old 11-30-14, 12:04 PM
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The hurricane clips that Larry mentioned hold the floor framing to the structure below. It's possible they are called something different in your locale but basically it's a metal bracket that ties the 2 pieces of wood together. They should be available at any lumber yard.

http://www.strongtie.com/products/co...rce=strapscat#
 
  #37  
Old 11-30-14, 01:33 PM
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ahh i see what u mean now. i can use a couple of H1 plates on each end if i can get my hands on something similar. thanks for that lads
 
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