Single or Two Stage Compressor?

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Old 11-08-07, 01:46 PM
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Single or Two Stage Compressor?

I would like to get some opinions of what type of system I should purchase for an upcoming renovation project.

I have been quoted two systems:

1. 2 Stage 4-Ton 16 SEER system with variable speed handler (Lennox)

or

2. Single stage 3.5 ton 14 SEER system with variable speed handler (Trane)

There is a $4K difference in the price of the two quoted systems. Based on the calculators I have seen, it would take 60 years to pay off the 2-Stage system. Is there somethin else that I should be considering to make a valuation of the two systems?

Thanks for any comments you can provide!
 
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Old 11-08-07, 06:14 PM
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You're saying it's 4k more for the Lennox?? Yikes!

It depends on where you are at. If you have a long cooling season, then two stage maybe a good choice, I'd ask Trane to get you a bid on their's XL16i system.

If your cooling season isn't long, then the XL14i will do a good job.

Do you know what you are getting for t-stat? I'd ask for the Honeywell IAQ t-stat. That t-stat is able to do the electric heat in stages, and also slow down the blower on a humid day.
 
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Old 11-08-07, 09:52 PM
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Im with Jay there. I cant see $4k diff there. But Id say go for the XL15i and get the tax credit from the IRS. We do use some 2 stage compressors But I dont like them. Its just one compressor and it has a unloader inside it. If you do have a long AC run and you say heatpump . Go for the XL19i It has two compressors in it. That can give you a seer about 17.90 and a HSPF 8.90 The best $ for $ and the one we sell the most is the XL15i with a V/S blower coil thats a seer of 15.10 and a HSPF 8.05
 
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Old 11-09-07, 02:55 PM
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The model that I am being quoted for is a Trane
XR14 with a V/S 80,000 Btu Furnace. The T-stat is a Trane XL800. Total for that package (plus a couple of returns and supplies) installed is $6,500. The Trane dealer also quoted XL16i and it comes in at $9,500.

I ran a calculator that shows a 20 year payback period for the more expensive unit.

My question is, what would I be sacrificing by going with the XR14? Ultimate comfort?

Also, the lower cost unit is R22. Will I have a problem in the next 10 years as for as service goes?

Thanks.

Matt
 
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Old 11-09-07, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by matman View Post
The model that I am being quoted for is a Trane
XR14 with a V/S 80,000 Btu Furnace. The T-stat is a Trane XL800. Total for that package (plus a couple of returns and supplies) installed is $6,500. The Trane dealer also quoted XL16i and it comes in at $9,500.
Not a bad price. I don't know if the XL16i is in line or not.. They are not seen around up here much since our summer are not extrem. If you are going with the heat pump, the T-stat you were bid on will not give you a TRUE staging on the furnace.. It will go on a timer for 2nd stage. I'd suggest you get the Honeywell IAQ t-stat to give you a true staging for your furnace when you do run on gas.

I ran a calculator that shows a 20 year payback period for the more expensive unit.
You have a link for us on this?
My question is, what would I be sacrificing by going with the XR14? Ultimate comfort?
You pretty much said it... Comfort. You can gain the comfort with the IAQ t-stat. The IAQ is able to slow down the blower in the summer to help remove the extra humidity. Otherwise, if you went with the other t-stat, and the dealer says "It has dehumidity control", it don't... it over cools the house up to 3˚ to try to bring down the humidity.
Also, the lower cost unit is R22. Will I have a problem in the next 10 years as for as service goes?
Go for it.. It will be around a while yet. Just won't be put into new equipment when it's made.

Speaking of service, get the 10 years parts and labor warranty from Trane.. It'll give you a piece of mind for the next 10 years if anything did go wrong.. You may be thinking, why would I want to spend an extra $xxx.00 on a warranty? Well, what if you were laid off, or some reason that money is really tight... you don't have that cash laying around and a repair bill may be $500...
 
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Old 11-09-07, 05:43 PM
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Honeywell Thermostat and Cost Calculator

Jay,

Here is the link to the cost comparison calculator:

http://www.energydepot.com/pgect/heatcool_1.asp

What is the actual model number for the Honeywell T-stat. I tried looking up the IAQ and could not find it. Can you post a link to the actual model you are referring to?

Thanks,

Matt
 
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Old 11-09-07, 08:02 PM
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That R 22 will be made till 2030. Most units we put in are still R22. Parts for it will be around for a long long time.
Go to http://warmair.net and compare fuel cost for where you are. Id say go for gas or go for a heatpump. We dont put H/P on top of gas units anymore. People are not happy with them at all.
 
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Old 11-09-07, 08:53 PM
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Heat Pump with Gas

Ed,

People aren't happy with the gas furnace as auxillary heat? Why not? The number one thing driving me from using heat strips as auxillary heat is that I don't have enough amps available to service the strips. But maybe I am mistaken, what are the amp requirements of the heat strips. I have a 1800 sq ft. house with a J-load that 70,000 Btu heating requirement.

I have been told, that the gas is a better heat source on the days and nights that are well below freezing.

Thanks.

Matt
 
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Old 11-10-07, 04:50 AM
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Yeah, I was wondering about that as well. People around here who has heat pump has gas back up with no issues. (But then there not many out there in MN)
 
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Old 11-11-07, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Ed Imeduc View Post
That R 22 will be made till 2030. Most units we put in are still R22. Parts for it will be around for a long long time.
Go to http://warmair.net and compare fuel cost for where you are. Id say go for gas or go for a heatpump. We dont put H/P on top of gas units anymore. People are not happy with them at all.
Not true. Here is the phase out time frame:

January 1, 2010:
After 2010, chemical manufacturers may still produce R-22 to service existing equipment, but not for use in new equipment. As a result, heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC) system manufacturers will only be able to use pre-existing supplies of R-22 to produce new air conditioners and heat pumps. These existing supplies would include R-22 recovered from existing equipment and recycled.
January 1, 2020:
Use of existing refrigerant, including refrigerant that has been recovered and recycled, will be allowed beyond 2020 to service existing systems, but chemical manufacturers will no longer be able to produce R-22 to service existing air conditioners and heat pumps.
 
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