3 speed blower motor wiring help

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  #1  
Old 01-09-17, 01:22 AM
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3 speed blower motor wiring help

The closest answer I've found was here: http://www.doityourself.com/forum/ai...ml#post2293695 but not sure if it applies to the system I have. Attaching images hoping for help please or any clues at all really.

I don't know what common/neutral/line mean, but I think I've managed to figure out all the wires except the yellow one. Hoping pictures will help avoid misunderstandings.

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Unsure if the orange common wire that is shown attached to the capacitor is what's supposed to be spliced with the yellow wire coming out of the new motor

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It is a 3 speed motor (D1036) that's replacing the original 4speed motor that was 20 years old or so. I capped off one of the medium speeds, attached high to high, low to low, and one medium.

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The old motor had an orange wire going to the old capacitor. The label on the new motor doesn't show the mysterious yellow wire being attached to the capacitor so far as I can tell --- but I've no idea where it should go, it simply indicates "LINE".

This is what the motor looks like behind the panel cover:

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Any ideas greatly appreciated, simply can't afford to mess this one up guessing my way through, thank you!
 
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  #2  
Old 01-09-17, 08:20 AM
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The yellow wire will be the common which connects to the transformer. Yellow doesn't need to go to the cap.
 

Last edited by skaggsje; 01-09-17 at 08:25 AM. Reason: added
  #3  
Old 01-11-17, 12:23 AM
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Size:  26.4 KBI don't know how to thank you enough! I will try to find the right place on the transformer right away!

Been searching google since worried about burning up the yellow wire if I hook it directly to the orange that comes off the transformer -that used to go to the old cap- since that orange wire is a much heavier gauge. Found some do-dads for splicing, wondered about putting in a fuse to be sure no fire, like in automotive wiring, though wasn't sure it was a right guess anyway, so very appreciative of the clue!

I kept finding others saying "common" but not "where" on any results I found over days of searching! You're a lifesaver!

Thank you so much for your time, we're at 6" of snow right now... multiple space heaters are a killer on the bill so we've been camping out in the family room. fun times.
 

Last edited by geemom; 01-11-17 at 12:28 AM. Reason: edit: add photo to show dif wire sizes
  #4  
Old 01-11-17, 12:38 AM
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Hm, assume nothing, I thought I wasn't assuming anything, but the yellow motor wire & the original orange wire coming off the transformer themselves seem to be the same gauge, just extra insulation on the orange one so I *assumed* it was a heavier gauge. -amazes self with foolishness yet again-

I'll be connecting those wires within the hour & powering her up. Jeez.

THANK YOU!

Lesson learned: strip the ends off and see what's really inside FIRST next time.
 
  #5  
Old 01-11-17, 03:36 AM
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No scary "pops" or breakers flipping themselves, awesome motor hook up help thank you so much!!!

At the thermostat control, pre-start-up, I set the system to 'off', not heat or cool, fan OFF, and guessed about room temp for the manually set, old style, no digital stuff here, temperature.

Well, for the first time the circuit didn't trip in the unit or main panel at the wall... BUT I only left the main panel breaker switch for the forced air on for about 10 seconds, 15 seconds... maybe 20 felt like forever, before turning it off, I just didn't trust it.

I slowly went to take the main consumer cover off the unit, the one for replacing the filter & such, and then the lovely electric burn smell it me. I ran a flashlight all over everything trying to catch where the smoke was coming from, but it was so faint, very light areas of it like two thick mysterious fleeting whiffs, I was unable to see WHERE it came from. There were definitely 2 whisps of smoke however, purple in nature as is the beast.

Upon closer inspection I notice a few connections were simply sliding off/on with a crusty sandy feel to them - uh-oh - and then noticed some charred/burned areas. HMMM I KNOW I hooked all the wires up, double checked the thermostat controls, etc. And there was no switch of the breaker in the unit or at the wall - weird.

After looking back at the pics I'd taken before I even came to find this forum, the damage was already previously there. No doubt from when this replacement motor was originally put in, in summer, when we dind't need heat and lived with regular house fans, and my dearest dearest installer attached wires by color instead of by reading the nameplate on the motor --- and you know, following directions. One pop of the circuit and he shyed away, death, fire, impending explosions, etc. were explained to me. I said the classic un-fine woman's "fine", and the motor and unit sat unused since. Until this snow storm, and I finally gave in to fix it myself.

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I see the sequencer is "only" another $25. or so + S&H. It can't be too hard to put in... BUT what else is probably damaged?

there's no circuitboard that I can see, it's a unit from 1997-ish. Coleman Evcon eb10b. There is NO option to put in a whole new unit. We simply must piece this one back together or if some parts are unavailable, improvise

Is this like a car where if you replace one part without replacing another, you end up in a circle of replacing both parts? If so, what usually gets replaced at the same time as a sequencer?

*EDIT TO ADD: previously, my dearest dearest had connected the new motor yellow (common) to the old motor yellow's connection spot which was "medium low speed", had NOT replaced the capacitor from a 7.5 for the old motor down to a 5.0 as required for the new motor, and had left the orange common wire from down below attached to the capacitor. BUT the breakers flipped themselves off IMMEDIATELY, so I don't know how much damage could have been done by his mis-wiring and/or wrong capacitor since it didn't actually have ANY Time 'running' and less than a second or 2 being 'powered'.
 

Last edited by geemom; 01-11-17 at 03:46 AM. Reason: detail for previous wiring error
  #6  
Old 01-11-17, 04:16 AM
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Trying to figure out what could have been damaged from previous mis-wiring, & which parts should now be replaced, sharing:

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Wondering with very little knowledge of household electronics, and limited on old cars, if power can wrongly travel to the sequencer from a miswired motor, like where the blue lines are marked-up considering how this motor was miswired before. Just trying to figure extent of damage before ordering parts instead of wasting time on onezy twozy orders. I can't be the only one to go through this, so sharing in case it helps anyone.

So far shopping list says brand new wire, sequencer, limit switches, and MAYBE elements.
 
  #7  
Old 01-11-17, 08:43 AM
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I'm not sure where you are here. In your first post there is an excellent picture of the motor wiring. It DOES NOT show anything other than the proper two wires to the capacitor. Having the orange wire also to the cap may have burned the motor windings.

Get one thing working at a time. When testing the blower.... put the stat in FAN ON. Don't turn the heat on.

The wires are discolored on the sequencer from the high power they handle and since they are so close to the heating elements. What is extremely important is tight connections. A loose connection will burn.

From what I see in your pics..... you didn't smell the sequencer/sequencer wiring burning.
 
  #8  
Old 01-11-17, 12:17 PM
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The pic was after I hooked in the new motor but before I put on the new cap and then powered it up. It had been tried previously with the orange wire attached to the cap, so... the motor wirings could be toast. Bad news but easy enough to test for perhaps.

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The connections I can clean/cut off & replace as needed to make sure they're tight next try.

The smell that my old nose smelled was in front of the lower wiring but not by the squirrel cage that holds the motor --- man I'm getting older, admittedly my directional senses aren't what the used to be, so I could be wrong.

I guess I'll pull out the voltmeter and test the motor, and see if there's anything else I can figure out how to test, before buying the next thing. Almost everyone is snowed in now so plenty of time today.

Thanks so much for the replies, I'd be lost without help.
 
  #9  
Old 01-11-17, 01:45 PM
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Upon further digging, the loose connections weren't really loose, the heater elements were moving along with the wiggling of the wire attachments. That was the sandy/gritty feeling. Ah, to be new and clueless.

Also took off the relay and the transformer, smelled both. Made boyfriend smell both (what fun). He said the relay definitely smells worse than the transformer, so thinking of ordering a new relay. Trying to find youtube vids on testing them first. May as well find a way to test transformers, too. Hoping to test both after complete disconnect from blower unit. Scared to leave it all attached, powered on, and possibly cause worse damage than what's already been done.
 
  #10  
Old 01-11-17, 02:12 PM
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There is a way to test the relay but extreme caution should be taken as this is 240 Volts.
 
  #11  
Old 01-11-17, 02:47 PM
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Thank you I'm taking your warning seriously since I'd like to know what retirement feels like one day... so I've ordered a new relay to be delivered on Friday. We're snowed in, so that may mean Saturday or Monday delivery, but it's on its way here. Usually I "ain't skeered o' nuffin'", but age shows me mistakes happen.
 
  #12  
Old 01-13-17, 02:21 PM
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New relay arrived today. Pulled out the old relay & with it in my hand I can see bubbling of the plastic near the corner of contact marked #2 and down the side a 1/4" or so to where #5 contact is labeled.

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Ah, going to try and see what all goes to there before I turn on the main breaker again. Maybe I can keep this relay from melting... maybe not, lol. Better to at least try though.

Will keep thread updated...
 

Last edited by geemom; 01-13-17 at 02:40 PM.
  #13  
Old 01-13-17, 02:41 PM
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I seem to have lost my bearings..... relay or sequencer ?
If relay.... which relay.
 
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Old 01-13-17, 03:52 PM
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Relay, and I didn't know there was more than 1!!!
The relay with the big red circle in the pic:Name:  whichway.jpg
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The 1 old relay melted near the tab connection marked #2, where the yellow wire runs to/from the sequencer.

(Sorry I don't understand which way the electricity runs, so i'm probably confusing, my sincerest apologies while I muddle through this)

I chopped off the end of the old yellow wire where it had melted at the corner of the relay and put a new female end on it. Then attached all the other wires to the new relay.

Not sure if it's okay yet to turn back on the power. So I'm googling. I don't understand if the miswiring probably melted to relay - since the common wire was hooked up as a "speed" wire. OR if something went wrong with the sequencer that caused the yellow wire between it & the relay to melt at the relay end.
 
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Old 01-13-17, 04:45 PM
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I volunteer on several sites.... so it can be hard to keep the threads straight.

In the colored diagram. Remove the blue wire from the relay.
Make sure stat is in OFF position. Nothing should happen on power up.
Put stat in FAN ON mode and the blower should run on high.

 
  #16  
Old 01-13-17, 05:13 PM
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Serious appreciation, I thought *I* missed yet something else, a 2nd relay perhaps

Well, it worked! it blew air! no bad smells!

*amazed*

Wondering what does that blue wire do, is it okay to hook it back up now?
 
  #17  
Old 01-13-17, 05:44 PM
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When you use the A/C.... the Y and the green G stat wires are live and activates that relay for high speed blower operation.

When you use the heat..... the sequencer supplies the power to the relays normally closed contacts to run the blower at a reduced speed.

So looking at the relay wiring....
yellow to black is high speed.
blue to red is reduced speed.

You mentioned you used the low speed motor tap for the heat. You may need to use the medium instead to get enough air across the electric coils.

I personally like a little more air thru the electric heat even if it is a tad cool coming out if the registers.
 
  #18  
Old 01-13-17, 05:57 PM
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Well then I'll do as you've mentioned and get that medium moved up to medium high if it's not already.

Thank you so very much for your time, I'll update as progresses
 
  #19  
Old 01-13-17, 08:56 PM
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It all works

I don't know how to thank you enough for your help here. My bf asked if he should get me a sandwich and a beer, lol!!! I said nope, just glad no electrocutions. This mom got to save the day (and rest of winter) with your help, and you so very very much
 
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Old 01-13-17, 09:02 PM
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You are very welcome. Good job.

Keep your eye out for burning wires. Loose connections create heat and burn up.
 
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