Heat pump issue


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Old 04-21-17, 07:45 PM
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Heat pump issue

How can I test the thermostat using a voltage meter? The inside unit comes on and works fine and I had a friend tell me via phone how to test to make sure the heat pump is actually functioning. It is. So I've got a communication problem from the inside unit to the outside heat pump. I have reset all breakers, the inside unit and pulled the fuses from the heat pump and put them back in. Still no go. He suggested testing the thermostat next but I have no idea how to use a voltage meter. I'm obviously a newbie to anything electrical. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
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Old 04-21-17, 07:53 PM
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Welcome to the forums.

What do you mean the heat pump is actually working ?
What is the exact problem you are experiencing ?
 
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Old 04-21-17, 08:32 PM
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I'm not sure what you call it but there is a mechanism next to the capacitor that is black. It has 2 brass what look like rods towards the outside and in the center of that there is a rectangular piece that when pushed the heat pump kicks on.
 
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Old 04-21-17, 08:36 PM
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Heat pump not kicking on when the inside unit is running

So when I turn my thermostat to cool and auto the inside unit runs but the heat pump never kicks in. It's like there is no communication between the 2. That's why my friend suggested testing the thermostat itself.
 
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Old 04-21-17, 09:00 PM
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Ok...cool.

The wiring runs from the thermostat to the air handler to the outside condensor. If you take the stat of the wall there is no way to check it.

You can take the stat off the base and either take a picture and post it here or tell us what color is on what terminal. http://www.doityourself.com/forum/el...-pictures.html

The best thing is to go to the air handler. This is where all the wiring is spliced.
At the air handler you'll need to check from Y to C for 24vac. The Y connection is the A/C compressor.
 
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Old 04-22-17, 05:30 PM
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Reply to heat pump issues with pics

Forgive me but I'm not sure what you mean by testing from y to c on the handler. Here are pics of the thermostat and inside the handler.

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Please let me know if your able to see these. All I see is a bunch of numbers..
Thanks for your help!
Wendy
 

Last edited by PJmax; 04-28-17 at 08:06 PM. Reason: removed un-needed pics
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Old 04-22-17, 07:18 PM
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Ok.... starting here.

1) I need to know what color is on what terminal. I can't see them all. Confirm the white and blue labels. These colors that we are working with here are the same ones that appear at the cable marked "thermostat" in the second picture. (just so you understand the relevance)

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O/B = orange
Y = yellow
G = green
R = red
W2 ? = white
?? = blue
====================================================

In this second picture... I've labeled the thermostat cable and the A/C condensor cable. There are letters on that board next to the screw terminals.

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2) Confirm the blue wirenut is on a red wire from the A/C and the yellow wire from the stat.
3) Confirm the white wire from the A/C condensor cable is on the C terminal.
4) What other colors are in the A/C condensor cable ?


A new dustless picture of just this area shown in picture 2 would be perfect.
Just answer my questions by number so you don't have to re-write everything.
 
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Old 04-23-17, 10:20 AM
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Respone to your questions with new pics

1)

O/B = orange
Y = yellow
G = green
R = red
W2 = white
C = blue

2) YES. Red from the AC Yellow from the stat

3) White wire from the condensor is on the "Y" terminal

4) Wirer colors from the condensor cable are "RED and WHITE"

5) Terminals on the Handler are as follows:
Top row left to right
G = Green
O = Orange
B = Blue
W3 = Empty
W2 = Empty
W1 = White from thermostat

Bottom row left to right
R = Empty
BK = Red from Thermostat
T = Empty
Y = White from Condensor
YLO = Empty

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Thanks again for all of your help!!

Wendy
 
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Old 04-23-17, 10:36 AM
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Excellent. Your pictures are a big help.


3) White wire from the condensor is on the "Y" terminal
4) Wirer colors from the condensor cable are "RED and WHITE"
There can't be two whites to the condensor unless there are two cables to it.

Check the condensor cable. There should be like 4 different wires.
I would expect to see a condensor wire on C screw terminal...along with the blue from the stat.

You're sure this a heat pump.... correct ?
The outside unit actually runs in the winter.

Just added this.... turn the stat to A/C for cooling. Wait 5 minutes and check for 24vac from the yellow stat wire to the C screw terminal.
 

Last edited by PJmax; 04-23-17 at 10:52 AM.
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Old 04-23-17, 02:38 PM
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Response to wiring

There are only 2 wires coming from the condensor. 1 White on red. The white condensor wire connects to the "Y" terminal on the air handler and the red wire is connected with the yellow under that blue cap.
What do you mean by testing the "C" terminal? I see nothing marked "C". Am I using the multimeter for this?
 
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Old 04-23-17, 04:42 PM
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You're sure this a heat pump.... correct ?
The outside unit actually runs in the winter?
A heat pump outside condensor unit requires AT LEAST three wires to work and usually 5.
You only have 2.

When was the last time this worked ?
So I'm at a brick wall here.
 
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Old 04-23-17, 08:29 PM
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Positive that it's a heat pump

It is a Trane heatpump. It worked all winter long. I then shut it off because the weather got cooler but then we soared to 86-88 degrees I turned it to ac and now it won't kick on at all. On heat or cool. It has been wired the same. I've never touched any of the wiring. The only thing that DID happen was my husband was rewiring a light switch. He crossed some wires and we had a power surge that blew half of the house. That's why I thought possibly the thermostat had been affected. I can take a picture of it if you like. I assure you it's a heat pump. It says on the paperwork that it's a split system heat pump.
 
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Old 04-23-17, 08:51 PM
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It's old. It's model TWR024C100A1. The inside handler was replace 5 years ago. The motor on the heatpump 3 years ago. Like I said before. I know the unit works because I tested at the capacitor. It kicked on. It's just not communicating from the inside to the outside.
 
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Old 04-23-17, 09:21 PM
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I believe you.

At your thermostat is an orange wire on the O/B terminal. That orange wire appears at the furnace board. It is the line for the reversing valve inside the heat pump. For heat mode.... it remains dead. For cooling it gets 24v on it.

I don''t see that orange getting to the outside unit where the valve is.
I've only seen red and white.
Is it possible there is a cable we haven't seen ?

Can you check out at the heat pump and see what colors are connected out there ?

You should see five wires connected...... red, black, orange, blue and white.
 
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Old 04-24-17, 02:13 PM
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Wiring

There are 2 wires coming from the condensor 6 from the thermostat
1 red from condensor combined with yellow from thermostat capped
1 white from condensor to y terminal

6 from the stat
Green to G
Orange to O
Blue to B
White to W1
Red to BK
Yellow combined with Red from the condensor capped.

I'm attaching a pic of the wiring schematic.

What would I be looking for on the heat pump? The wiring connected to to the capcitor or the wires running to the board? I'm sorry.. I know this is taking ALOT of your time. I apologize!!

Wendy

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Last edited by PJmax; 04-28-17 at 08:09 PM. Reason: removed un-needed pics
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Old 04-24-17, 07:05 PM
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Model # for air handler

It's a Trane variable speed. This is the model number that is listed on that diagram. Model #4TEE3F**A. Under that it has TWEO**E. it has a little note next to it saying that the ** signify all the digits used in this space. There is also a model # printed on the door of the handler. Don't know if you need that but I'm going to include it anyway. TWEO31E13FB2. If there is something I've missed please let me know. I'll get it for you. Your really going the extra mile here! I do appreciate it. Thanks again for all of your help!!
Wendy.
 
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Old 04-24-17, 07:38 PM
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Here's the manual for that air handler with the schematics you posted.
americancoolingandheating/uploads/2012/06/22-1717-10.pdf

page 22 is that exact diagram.

I was in error before.... I was telling you to check to C. There is no C. Your common is B.

Please try this for me..... power air handler down first.

Move the white wire that is on Y to the B terminal.
That will give you white and blue on the B terminal.
Try A/C and tell me what happens. (don't forget the 5 minute cooling delay)
 
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Old 04-24-17, 08:33 PM
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Reply to wiring check

Ok.. tried putting the white condensor wire with the blue wire on the "B" terminal waited 10 minutes and nothing has happened.
 
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Old 04-24-17, 08:44 PM
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After re-checking. It blew the fuse in the handler.
 
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Old 04-24-17, 09:10 PM
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Hmmmmm..... sorry about that.

I'm pulling at straws here.

There is just something missing.
Can you go out to the heat pump, look for where the thermostat cable enters the unit, remove that access cover and tell me what you see for low voltage wiring ?
 
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Old 04-24-17, 10:12 PM
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OH, also wanted to say that nothing has been touched as far as wiring goes from the day it was installed. Like I've said previously, it worked one minute, then the power surge then it didn't work. I'm guessing on that but it's the only thing that happened in between.
 
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Old 04-24-17, 11:18 PM
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With that test you tried for me.... that short may indicate a shorted coil in the contactor in the heat pump.

The low voltage wiring would be that little brown multi wire cable. We've seen red and white at the air handler end.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 10:59 AM
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The cable has multiple wires in it. They should all be connected right where the cable enters the unit.

What colors are coming out of the cable ?
What colors are spares ?

Ok... you see an orange or two capped together.
This orange wire is the one that is supposed to be connected at the air handler and isn't.

I'm now leaning towards a splice inside your house that you aren't seeing.

A recent member found a splice under the insulation next to his air handler.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 03:02 PM
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Wires to heat pump

Coming into the unit I see
blue wrapped with a smaller black capped. Red wrapped with smaller brown capped. Orange wrapped with smaller brown capped. Blacked wrapped with a smaller white or light gray capped.
Brown wrapped with smaller black capped.
Yellow running to the board.
Light blue wrapped with red and a small olive green capped.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 03:20 PM
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Perfect.

Since we haven't seen those at the air handler....there is a splice somewhere.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 05:11 PM
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More wires on inside handler.

I've traced the condensor wires down. There is 1 red capped with a larger black
1 white capped with larger black

Tracing up from the condensor
2 red capped with 1 dark red
2 orange capped with a darker orange
1 white with 1 light grey capped
2 yellow with 1 olive green capped
1 light green to 1 dark green
2 light blue to 1 dark blue

That is every wire I see on the handler.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 05:25 PM
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At the air handler
Not in any of the posted pictures.

I'm guessing you replaced the fuse and put the wire back I asked you to try moving.

Check for 24vac from red to blue. If there.... go on.
Put stat into cool mode and wait 5 minutes.
Check for 24vac from orange to blue.
Check for 24vac from yellow to blue.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 07:50 PM
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Voltage

Red to blue, 26-29
Orange to blue, 26-29
Yellow to blue, zippy, nadda, zero.
 
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Old 04-25-17, 09:21 PM
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Red = ok , orange = ok.

Back up in post 7 where I labeled the cables. The one I labeled A/C condensor with the red and white wires is not the condensor. It's a float switch that interrupts the Y to the compressor in case the drain pan overflows.

With the system in A/C mode check from Y terminal to B terminal at the air handler for 24vac.
If no..... check from the blue wire nut at air handler to B terminal.
If no.... pull stat off the wall..... jumper from Y to R. See if compressor starts.
 
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Old 04-26-17, 08:44 AM
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Y to b terminal tests 26. Now what?
 
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Old 04-26-17, 02:55 PM
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Hi Pete,
Checked Y to B terminal that has 26
Tested B terminal to B wire there's nothing
What do you mean by "jumping" Y to R at the thermostat?
Is that my next step?
 
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Old 04-26-17, 03:08 PM
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B terminal to b wire but nothing
That should be B terminal to blue wirenut.

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In order to keep this thread in one page I will be pruning some posts.
 
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Old 04-26-17, 03:38 PM
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Ok.... if you noticed I relabeled the drawing. It now says float switch.

Remove the white float switch wire from the Y terminal.
Open the blue wirenut splice. Connect the yellow wire to the Y terminal.

That leaves you with the two float switch wires (red and white) not connected.
Try your A/C. If it's on now.... there's a problem with or at the float switch.
 
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Old 04-26-17, 07:24 PM
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Now that the yellow wire is on the Y terminal... see if you have 24vac when in cool mode.
From Y to B.
 
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Old 04-26-17, 07:43 PM
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Testing Y to B

Yes. 25-26 with yellow wire on Y terminal testing with B
 
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Old 04-26-17, 07:49 PM
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That is good.

Check again at the splice point that you discovered. Yellow to blue for 24vac.
Then check again out at the heat pump. Yellow to blue.

We need 24vac on the yellow wire for the compressor to run. So we are getting closer.
 
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Old 04-26-17, 09:43 PM
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New test

1. So the unit should be on while doing this all of this correct?
2. Checking the new splice yellow to blue. Both of these at the new splice point?
 
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Old 04-26-17, 10:19 PM
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You have 24vac from Y to B at the screw terminal board. That means the stat is sending out 24vac in cooling mode. Now we need to get that same 24vac out at the heat pump on the yellow wire.

Check first where the two yellows come together at splice point.
If it's there... check for it out at heat pump.

You already checked red to blue and orange to blue and said ok.
Red runs the control board.
Orange is the reversing valve.
Yellow is the compressor.
 
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Old 04-27-17, 11:22 AM
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Heat pump wiring

Hi Pete,
Im unsure which wires your referring to in the heat pump. Here are pics of what I'm looking at. Name:  Heat pump 2.jpg
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Hoping to figure this out soon so I can quit bugging you!

Wendy
 
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Old 04-27-17, 05:02 PM
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Heat pump test results

Hi Pete,
I toolbar a shot in the dark. At the heat pump there is a yellow wire capped with black. Then there are 2 blue wire. 1 capped with black the other with red. I tested both. Yellow capped with black tested to blue capped with black. Nothing.
Yellow to blue capped with red I get the 24 we are looking for.
You mentioned in your last post about testing red to blue and orange to blue. Was that test to be done at the heat pump as well??
 
 

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