Aprilaire 400A Install Newbie...

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Old 11-16-08, 08:07 AM
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Aprilaire 400A Install Newbie...

Hi,

I am new to the forum and after reviewing the different DOITY posts, I am considering installing the unit myself.
But of course I have some questions mainly electric.

First I have two furnace unit ( Basement and Attic) Trane Model 50A50 (C 94), in short do I need 2 humidifers as well? if one, is it best in Attic/upper floor unit (no water currently) or sufficient and easiet in Basement? 2 story open floor plan, abt 1500sqft per floor

The install guide mentions only 2 electric connection/wire from humidifier to the furnace: W/G (whiteGround?) to 24 VAC furnace Accessory Terminal and Cf to Common (?).
On my furnace, I have HUM and EAC (Hot) and HUM and EAC (Neutral) terminals. What would be your recommendation on how to properly connect it? thank you.
 
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Old 11-16-08, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by pcnamib View Post
Trane Model 50A50 (C 94),
That is not a valid model #, the model should start with "T".

do I need 2 humidifers as well? if one, is it best in Attic/upper floor unit (no water currently) or sufficient and easiet in Basement?
I don't know where you are out of, but attic is NOT ideal area if the temps gets below 32˚. You are best to put it on the furnace in the basement.


What would be your recommendation on how to properly connect it? thank you.
Mount the transformer like this photo.

There is a HUM wire, wire the transformer to this and other wire to common/white wire.

Wire humidistat's W/G and Cf to the transformer.

then run R and C to board's R and C (where t-stat wires hook up)
 
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Old 11-17-08, 06:13 AM
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Thank you for your response. Yes, you are right, the furnace model # is Trane TUJ060A936A0 with Whiter Rodgers Emerson 50A50 474 control module. This should help me but I must be dense..I am trying to understand how to connect the Automatic Humidifer Control to the furnace. I understand the power supply piece but I am still unclear about the connection between the Humid Control Unit and the furnace module: there are 2 wires described as follows: 1/ W/G to 24 VAC furnace accessory terminal, I am seeing 2 sets on the furnace module: HUM or EAC, hot or neural? 2/ Cf to Common (?) not sure what the Common is on the furnace module either...yes I am a newbie I just realized that due to my funrace configuration that the bypass connection will require an additionmal elbow, is that a problem? would you recommend the humidifier on the return or suppply? Thanks for your patience and help. Paul DIagram of 400A http://www.ntsupply.com/files/produc...65-400inst.pdf
 
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Old 11-17-08, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by pcnamib View Post
the furnace model # is Trane TUJ060A936A0
I've never seen a "J" in the model. I looked it up and came back nothing. Must be an older model? (Not important anyway)

I must be dense..I am trying to understand how to connect the Automatic Humidifer Control to the furnace.
Ignore the papers on "how to wire" it. Wire it as I showed in my last reply.

I am seeing 2 sets on the furnace module: HUM or EAC,
Is there a wire hooked up on to this? If if there is already wire on it, then the wire is brought up into the juntion box as shown in my photo above. Otherwise, if there is no wire hook up on it, then you mount the transformer down there near the control board.
Due to my furnace configuration that the bypass connection will require an additional elbow, is that a problem?
No, that is not an issue.

would you recommend the humidifier on the return or suppply?
On the return if you have room.
 
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Old 11-20-08, 07:22 PM
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Hi Jay, sorry for the delay, I had to return the 400A for space issue on install with the bypass. I just received a 700M.

The transfomer has a black and white wire. If I understood your picture correctly,
the Black wire goes to HUM not EAC(hot) on the furnace module?
and the White wire goes to HUM (neutral) or common.

from transformer I also need to connect 18-2 to the provided humidistat, and humdifier ( 2 Brown wires). Does it need to be connect to my current Thermostat at all? Thank you paul
 
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Old 11-20-08, 08:07 PM
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The 700 is going to change the wire hook up here. DO NOT wire it up yet.

You get the humidistat that comes with it? (Digital display)
 
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Old 11-20-08, 09:23 PM
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I have the 700M with manual humidistat not 700A which comes the digital display. BTW, can I put this humidstat in my main room or does it have to be 6 inch above the humdifier?
I look is up again and my furnace module has 2 HUM and 2EAC ( Hot and neutral) available. If I understood you coorectly, the transformer that comes wit hit, black and white wire to HUM HOT and neutral ( 120V) and the other side of the transfomer to the humidifier and humisistat. Thank you.
My plan is to install the unit tomorrow, and the wiring will comes last... thank you .
 
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Old 11-20-08, 10:10 PM
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Ok, your new humidifier is going to be wired another way around.

Look to see if you have EAC taps on the board.

The humidistat can be mounted on the return or in the living space.
 
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Old 11-21-08, 09:39 AM
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Thank you.
I have 2 EAC and 2 HUM taps on the EMerson 50A50 white rodgers funrace module, one EAC HOT (Black?), one Neutral (white?)
So with the provided transformer (120to 24), i have to connect the transformer black wire to HOT EAC tap (120) and White wire to EAC neutral (120)
From Transformer, one 18-2 wire directly to humidistat and one 18-2 loop between humidifier (2 brown wires) and humidistat. Thank you.
 
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Old 11-21-08, 09:46 AM
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You will not need the transformer with this humidifier.. It has a built in one.

Wire it like you see below.


 
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Old 11-21-08, 03:00 PM
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Hi Jay,
I will be frank Jay, you lost me... are you 100% sure, hate to question you though.... I just completed the hardware install and I am ready for the wiring so i think :-)
The unit/product came with a separate transformer.
Yes, the humidifier as a power cord 120 vac that I plug into an outlet next to the furnace but it also two brown wires.
According to the provided shematics ( that I need to ignore...) one brown wire goes to the humidistat and the other direclty to the transforner. Sorry I am very confused...
My board as 120 EAC HOT did you have a chance to look at the suggested schematics
http://www.ntsupply.com/files/products/700INSTALL.pdf

Thanks for your patience...I feel stupid not being able to figure it out.
 
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Old 11-21-08, 03:15 PM
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Ok, you got me... They must of changed the system... For kicks, just plug the unit into the out let, and touch the two brown wires.

Does it run or not?

If not, then yes we need to wire the transformer onto the HUM on the board.

If it does run, then do like I suggest.
 
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Old 11-21-08, 05:45 PM
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I followed your first instructions and it does not run.
So I will connect the transformer black wire to the HUM hot and the white wire from the transformer to the white hum neutral on the board. Did have a chance to look at the wiring diagram suppiled with the unit? http://www.ntsupply.com/files/products/700INSTALL.pdf
Thank you.
 
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Old 11-21-08, 06:13 PM
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Yes, I saw the manual.

Wire it up as shown, but you won't need the A50 relay since the board is cycling the power on and off as needed.
 
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Old 11-21-08, 08:07 PM
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THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!! thanks for your patience with me, it is working. I am SO excited....Beer 4U2
WOW, now I need to be patient and hopefully see the RH go up in my house... next project UV in the attic furnace, hopefully should be easier... THANK YOU! made my week and saved me $600. Sincerely paul
 
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Old 11-21-08, 08:18 PM
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Glad to help. We learn something new every time.

keep us posted if you have anything else.
 
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Old 12-06-08, 07:39 PM
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Similar situation, same solution?

"Mount the transformer like this photo.
There is a HUM wire, wire the transformer to this and other wire to common/white wire.

Wire humidistat's W/G and Cf to the transformer.
then run R and C to board's R and C (where t-stat wires hook up)"


Does that same solution work for the Model 500A Aprilaire unit(same RP-58 thermostat), but with a Lennox Pulse 21 model # G21Q3-80-1?

I think it does, since everything you described looks like what I'm facing right now as well.

Thanks in advance for your reply.

-Kevin1158
 
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Old 12-06-08, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevin1158 View Post
I think it does, since everything you described looks like what I'm facing right now as well.
Kevin, This furnace don't have the line voltage hook up like HUM or EAC on it.

You'll have to use a A50 relay, and transformer.
 
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Old 12-14-08, 08:01 AM
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ok

OK...I'll give it a try. But I don't understand what the W/G and C are for. R and C connected to the 'always on' transformer give the humidistat power...and the solenoid for the water, plus the outside moisture sensor are self explanatory. So what are the W/G and C, wired to the W and C on the furnace doing if they're not giving power to the humidifier and water solenoid when the furnace cycles?
 
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Old 12-14-08, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevin1158 View Post
R and C connected to the 'always on' transformer give the humidistat power...and the solenoid for the water, plus the outside moisture sensor are self explanatory.
R and C is only providing power for the humidistat outdoor sensor, and display. Not the solenoid valve.


So what are the W/G and C, wired to the W and C on the furnace doing
W/G is power for the solenoid valve, C is for the common side of the valve.
 
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Old 12-20-08, 02:07 PM
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More Wiring Questions

OK, so I have the A50 relay connected to the common wire on the blower. This is to allow for power to the solenoid controlling water to the pad when the blower is operating correct?

I have everything else wired according to page 18 of the Aprilaire R-58 instruction here.

manualhttp://www.aprilairecontractor.com/products/category/humidifiers/43571.pdf

120-24V transformer is powered, then connected to R & C on the R58 Humidistat. This is then jumped to the W/G & C on the humidistat, in essence meaning that the humidistat display, outdoor sensor and soleniod are always powered. These are getting ~ 27 V, so this is working.

Common wire from blower is wrapped around A-50 Current sensing relay 3x and then wired in a circuit with the humidistat and humidifier as described in the drawing. This wire wrapped around the A-50 is still shielded...should it be bare?

The problem is that I stil can't get the water to flow in the humidifier. I have a voltmeter, but don't know how to trouble shoot each of the components to make sure they're working.

Any suggestions you have on re-wiring the unit, or troubleshooting the relay or the soleniod would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

-Kevin
 
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Old 12-20-08, 02:43 PM
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some more info to help diagnose

Tried two things with the voltmeter over the past 10 minutes...see if this helps you diagnose.

First I placed the voltmeter between the A-50 relay and humidistat, and measured that circuit:
Circuit #1
A50 --> Voltmeter --> Humidistat --> back to A50

Humidifier powered and unit: OFF ; ON
Resistance: OL ; 35 Mohm
Voltage: 0.38V ; 0.32V

Then included the solenoid in the circuit and although the resistance dropped with the humidifier turned on, it is still rediculously high:
Circuit #2
A50 --> solenoid --> Voltmeter --> Humidistat --> back to A50

Humidifier powered and unit: OFF ; ON
Resistance: OL ; 22 Mohm
Voltage: 0.38V ; 0.32V


So V= IR says I'm not getting current, or enough current.

Again, any help or advice woudl be appreciated.

-Kevin
 
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Old 12-20-08, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevin1158 View Post
This wire wrapped around the A-50 is still shielded...should it be bare?
Wire should be shielded.

The problem is that I still can't get the water to flow in the humidifier.
Is mode switch set to "A"? (Step 3, and Figure G)

Anything happens on Test mode? (FYI, this model is not a flow though, so if the tray is full, it won't allow any water flow.)
 
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Old 12-21-08, 10:40 AM
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Yes!!

That did it!

I got so focused on the wiring diagrams and circuits that I neglected to make sure that everything else was correct!

Thank you for your help and patience...

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a 1:00 date with my remote control and couch!

Go Browns!

 
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Old 12-21-08, 07:47 PM
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Glad to hear it was an easy fix! :-)

How did the date go? Did the remote get thrown out the door? hehe
 
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Old 12-31-09, 07:09 PM
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Jay I need help with my AprilAire 500a. My furnace is a York G1UA048517B. I am a VERY VERY VERY big neby on electrical. How do I wire this thing? I can read instructions but need someone to break it down like whote to this and red to that witht he labels of my furnace circuit board. Can you help me out like you did the others?
 
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Old 01-01-10, 08:48 PM
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G1U? Not a valid number..


Most York has 120 v HUM on the board.

Wire the transformer to this, then that wires to W/G and Cf on the humidistat.

THen R and C wires to R and C on the board.
 
 

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