True Steam Installation Problem

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  #1  
Old 11-29-08, 10:16 PM
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Question True Steam Installation Problem

Ive installed a Honeywell True Steam 6 gal unit to my Carrier 58STA090 furnace.

With the help of several friends and my step brother who are all HVAC pros, I've wired up the unit according to the wiring diagram. I am using a manual thermostat which is installed in the return. I also installed a RP50 Current Sensing Relay to the humidistat.

The problem I am having is that when I turn on the humidistat, my A/C condensor kicks on.

I had my brother over most of the day yesterday trying to figure this out and at one point, we called Honeywells Contractor Help Line and all they told us was "there is a wire crossed somewhere." We checked all the wires and re-wired it again. (Ive re-wired it so many times I could do it in my sleep now) and again, the A/C always kicks on. I flipped the DIP switch #5 to on (you're supposed to turn it on when using an AFS) and the unit started working appropriately and continued to do so all night.

This morning, I went down to tuck in the wires and replace the cover to the humidifier. After I did that, the A/C started kicking on again. I again, re-wired everything with brand new wire and still the same problem; I turn on the humidistat, the humidifier starts running, but then my A/C alwys kicks on.

Im at my wits end and after talking to several pros, they are stumped too. Other than my brother, I have not had anyone else out here. I really dont want to pay for someone to come out because Ive talked to all my HVAC friends.

Can you help me with this problem? When I turn the humidistat off, unplug the humidifier and reset the furnace, everything returns to normal.

I have this thermostat, if that matters:

Buy Honeywell PRO 4000 Programmable 1 Heat/1 Cool Thermostat | Honeywell TH4110D1007

Thanks,

Johnie
 

Last edited by JohnieReb; 11-29-08 at 10:33 PM.
  #2  
Old 11-30-08, 08:44 AM
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What letter from the TrueSTEAM are go to where and what letters there.

For now, turn off the breaker for you A/C till we get this figured out.
 
  #3  
Old 11-30-08, 10:27 AM
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True Steam Furnace

R connected to R
C connected to C
GF connected to G

I have an RP 50 relay attached to the white cable coming off the fan and that is connected to one side of the Maunal Humidistat.

Conversely, the humidistat with the relay inline is connected to the 2 HUM connections on the True Steam.

I had the humidifier working with DIP switch 5 ON. Now it doesnt matter what setting its on.

Thanks again,

Johnie
 
  #4  
Old 11-30-08, 10:34 AM
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Is there any wire on Y at the furnace?

Do you have A/C? If so, where are the two wires from the unit outside go to?
 
  #5  
Old 11-30-08, 10:51 AM
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Yes, the Y and the C are connected and run out to the A/C Condensor outside. There is nothing connected from the True Steam to the Y on the furnace.
 
  #6  
Old 11-30-08, 11:15 AM
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Humm...

Is there only one wire on Y or two?
 
  #7  
Old 11-30-08, 11:18 AM
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There is only one wire to each terminal on the furnace except for the ones with wires from the True Steam.

"Hmmm" - I've gotten that response alot. It all just doesnt make sense.........
 
  #8  
Old 11-30-08, 12:21 PM
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Where is the Y wire from the t-stat go to?
 
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Old 11-30-08, 12:38 PM
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Good question, I only remember one wire going to the Y because we took it off Friday to see if that made a difference. It didnt; the fan kept restarting a running like it did when the condenser ran.

I am a firefighter who's on duty today so Ill have to get back to you in a couple hours. I have a friend running over to the house to check to see where that T-stat wire goes.......

Thanks for your help.

Johnie
 
  #10  
Old 11-30-08, 12:57 PM
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Sounds good.. We'll be here when you post back!
 
  #11  
Old 11-30-08, 01:18 PM
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Thanks, I see you are from MN........Go Bears!! hehe
 
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Old 11-30-08, 01:37 PM
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LOL

I am not a sports nuts, so who ever wins, is good for them!

I was down Chicago last summer for the first time, and reunited with a long lost cousin.

Fun city to visit, but not sure if I'd want to live there.
 
  #13  
Old 11-30-08, 04:17 PM
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The Y from the T-stat connects to the Y terminal and there is another wire that runs out out to the condenser from the Y terminal. So, there are 2 wires connected to the Y terminal.

There is 1 common wire that is also connected to the condenser.

Thanks,

Johnie

BTW, I live about 60 NW of Chicago near the WI border
 
  #14  
Old 11-30-08, 04:34 PM
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Ok...

You said in earlier post that the A/C still ran when you removed the Y wire going to the unit outside, Correct?

For kicks, I would remove the Y wire from the t-stat.

If that still runs the A/C, then put the Y's back on, and undo the C wire going to the unit outside.
 
  #15  
Old 11-30-08, 04:41 PM
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I stand corrected. We removed the common that went out to the condenser and I cant remember if the condenser ran or not, however, the fan continued to stay on like it was calling for the AC.
 
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Old 11-30-08, 04:45 PM
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If the humidifier is calling for humidity, it will turn on the furnace fan to add humidity into the home.
 
  #17  
Old 11-30-08, 05:12 PM
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But why is the condenser kicking on then? With the relay in place, the humidifier should only be kicking on when the fan is running; which it was doing when it was working properly.
 
  #18  
Old 11-30-08, 05:48 PM
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Thermostat

Are you sure g from t-stat is going through humidifier. If g from t-stat goes to heat pump first you can get back feed through some stats. Condenser will run
 
  #19  
Old 11-30-08, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnieReb View Post
I also installed a RP50 Current Sensing Relay to the humidistat.
Is this the correct model # of the relay? This is wired into the low voltage "C" line as shown in the drawing of the install manual of the TrueSteam?


the humidifier should only be kicking on when the fan is running; which it was doing when it was working properly.
Read page 14 of the install manual about the G/GF wire hook up.
 
  #20  
Old 11-30-08, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
Are you sure g from t-stat is going through humidifier. If g from t-stat goes to heat pump first you can get back feed through some stats. Condenser will run
Milk, this is not a heat pump set up.. Just a regular gas fired furnace.
 
  #21  
Old 11-30-08, 05:58 PM
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okay is g from t-stat going to furnace?
 
  #22  
Old 11-30-08, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
Are you sure g from t-stat is going through humidifier. If g from t-stat goes to heat pump first you can get back feed through some stats. Condenser will run
As far as I know, G is hooked up to the T-stat and then I hooked up GF from the humidifier to G on the furnace. Because I dont have a thermostat that monitors humidity, I did not have G from the T-stat hooked up to GF on the humidifier.

Should I take the G off the furnace that goes to the T-stat and hook that up to GT?
 
  #23  
Old 11-30-08, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
okay is g from t-stat going to furnace?

yes. g is going from the t stat to the furnace as far as I know.

This is the T-stat I have:

http://www.ntsupply.com/files/products/4110_install.pdf

The C is not hooked up from the T-stat to the furnace per installation instructions. The only wires on the C are from the condenser and from the humidifier.
 
  #24  
Old 11-30-08, 06:10 PM
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on page 13 you are suppose to go from t-stat g to gt then gf goes to furnace. Please verify with your manual.
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
on page 13 you are suppose to go from t-stat g to gt then gf goes to furnace. Please verify with your manual.
Well that may be the problem then. I do not have it hooked up that way as I thought because I dont have a humidity sensing t-stat, I wouldnt need to hook it up that way.
 
  #26  
Old 11-30-08, 06:13 PM
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if you have gf to furnace also when humidifier calls for humidity it will energize g on furnace and t-stat which can back feed through stat back down to y making condenser run
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:15 PM
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yep, Milk is right. G from t-stat needs to go to GT on the TrueSTEAM, then a new wire from GF to G on the furnace.

Did you read my question about the relay?
 
  #28  
Old 11-30-08, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
if you have gf to furnace also when humidifier calls for humidity it will energize g on furnace and t-stat which can back feed through stat back down to y making condenser run
Will the humidifier call for humidity? I have a current sensing relay hooked up to the humidistat in lieu of the AFS so that the humidifier will only run when the fan is running.
 
  #29  
Old 11-30-08, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Jay11J View Post
Is this the correct model # of the relay? This is wired into the low voltage "C" line as shown in the drawing of the install manual of the TrueSteam?
Sorry I missed that question. Its a Aprilaire RP50 current sensing relay that I got from a HVAC buddy of mine. I did have it hooked up to the C when the AC started kicking on. My brother who is also a HVAC tech hooked it up to the humidistat.

I will hook the relay to the C as in the diagram and then run G from the Tstat to GF. Hopefully that will do it?
 

Last edited by Jay11J; 11-30-08 at 06:39 PM. Reason: fixed quote
  #30  
Old 11-30-08, 06:20 PM
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they call for afs because if you have defective blower motor that is drawing amps but not spinning it can let humidifier run and cause water damage. Best to stick with honeywells spec
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:23 PM
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Remember a defective motor can draw current and not run. sensing relay will think its running
 
  #32  
Old 11-30-08, 06:26 PM
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Removed double post to advoid any confusion.
 

Last edited by Jay11J; 11-30-08 at 06:40 PM. Reason: Double post.
  #33  
Old 11-30-08, 06:29 PM
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looks like g from stat to gt. Just really look at manual to verify. Honeywell knows best.
 
  #34  
Old 11-30-08, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
Remember a defective motor can draw current and not run. sensing relay will think its running
Where can I get a AFS then? My local distributor says he doesnt sell them anymore; "They are old school and there is no need for them anymore with the new furnaces out there."
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:33 PM
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what state and city are you in
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by milkdud View Post
what state and city are you in
I live near Fox Lake, IL in Volo. Zip Code is 60073
 
  #37  
Old 11-30-08, 06:36 PM
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not sure I am in MD. I would call honeywell or I am sure you can get on-line.
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:38 PM
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Guys, thanks for the help, where can I send you some beer? I'll let you know how it works out tomorrow.

Thanks again,

Johnie
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:40 PM
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no prob...............................
 
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Old 11-30-08, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnieReb View Post
Its a Aprilaire RP50 current sensing relay that I got from a HVAC buddy of mine.
That is the wrong relay....

That relay is used for 120 volt, not 24 volts.. You want the A50 instead.
 
 

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