Welcome to the DoItYourself Forums!

To post questions, help other DIYers and reduce advertising (like the one on your left), join our DIY community. It's free!

is my basement the right approach?


brianhunter01's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 305
NY

12-12-05, 04:21 PM   #1  
is my basement the right approach?

is my basement the right approach?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I just bought my house a few months back and found a surprise in my finished basement when we got a week of rain. I got nice puddles in my basement. I am about to get french drains put in my basement in about two weeks. In order to put the drains in my basement I was required to cut up from the floor up 4ft, removing the sheet rock and the metal studs. When I did this I saw that the studded wall was about 7 inches away from the concrete wall. There was also Paperback fiberglass insulation between each stud. I noticed though that there was no Vapor Barier behend the wall just the insulation and then the concrete wall. When I first saw this I was pissed that one the contractor the the previous owner hired put the wall so far away from the concrete wall and two there was no Vapor barier. In reading this thread it sounds like perhaps the contractor was on the right approach. Does this all sound like this is the right approach? When I put the studs back and re sheet rock the bottom should I do it the way it was? Also if anyone has ever cut out 4ft of metal studs and put them back any suggestions of how the secured the bottom back to the top part of the stud that was cut out would be greatly appreciated. Someone had suggested to me to take 16 inches of metal track and fit it in the track and screw it tight.

Thanks

 
Sponsored Links
em69's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 857

12-13-05, 06:33 AM   #2  
Have you considered trying to solve the problem outside? I am curious to know why people want the water to come into the house, when in fact the idea is to keep it out.

http://www.askthebuilder.com/070_Lin..._Seepage.shtml

 
Concretemasonry's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 6,125
MN

12-13-05, 11:02 AM   #3  
brian -

em69 has a good point about the esterior. Guttere, downspout extensions (8-10 feet) and proper grading to carry the water away can eliminate the need for drain tile.

If this is a new house, the area around it may have settled, collecting water and holding it until it can leak in.

The interior drain tile are costly, like any drain tile installation. Interior drain tile are effective and do a better job of reducing the water and water pressure under the slab due to a high water table. Make sure they go deep enough (below the bottom of the footing).

Good builders put in both interior and exterior.

Dick

 
brianhunter01's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 305
NY

12-13-05, 01:19 PM   #4  
Dick,

Thanks for the reply. I got a real good deal on getting the drains put it and it is a company that has been around for 50 plus years. I have heard nothing but good things. They go down below the footings and use pvc pipe ( I heard others use cheap pipe) I actually tried the whole landscaping deal and my spouts are away, unfort if I get a lot of rain over days it starts to seep. My goal is do eventually dig around the house and have both inside and outside. As far as the vapor barrier do you think I need it with the the wall almost a foot away from the concrete wall and just the insulation?

 
em69's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 857

12-14-05, 07:02 AM   #5  
I believe you gettin confused between a moisture barrier and vapour barrier.

A vapour barrier is installed on the warm side of a room to keep moisture from entering a cold space. This, IMHO is mandatory.

However, I believe you are referring to a moisture barrier which is installed against the concrete wall to prevent the insulation from contacting the concrete. This performs the same function as installing a moiture barrier under a concrete slab. Since your walls are very far from the concrete, then there is no chance the insulation will contact the concrete.

Having this space will cause other problems though which you should be aware of.

Here is a start:

http://www.joneakes.com/cgi-bin/getd...als.cgi?id=743

 
brianhunter01's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 305
NY

12-15-05, 08:37 AM   #6  
I see on the insulation that the paper on it that is facing the living space is a vapor barrier so now i understand that. As far as you saying I will have more problems with the 7 inches of space between the insulation and the concrete wall, is there anything I can do to fix this problem without having to re do all the walls?

 
Concretemasonry's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 6,125
MN

12-15-05, 09:16 AM   #7  
is my basement the right approach?

If you are concerned about the vapor barrier on the walls that are 7 inches from the concrete, take a look at the big picture - many people only look at a detail or one situation.

A basement is not an unconditioned space - it is partially conditioned (moisture and temperature wise.

Your finished space is an island in the basement, so all wals should be equivalent.

The finished basement area you are concerned with has several walls and a floor. Do the other walls in the finished area have a vapor barrier and are they insulated? Do you have a vapor barrier on the floor? The floor is only inches from the exterior walls and is the same temperature as the bottom of the wall.

It does not pay to worry about just one or two walls when the other surfaces have different conditions.

Dick

 
brianhunter01's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 305
NY

12-15-05, 10:28 AM   #8  
the walls are 7inches away from the exterior wall. They are insulated with reg insulation with a paper backing that says vapor retardar, there is no plastic. I just plan on sealing the first 4 ft of the wall with drylox, putting the bottom part of the wall back with the insulation and they re sheetrocking. I didn't know this was all too complicated. As far as the floor, it is just concrete poured and I plan on putting basement carpet down there. Am I looking at big problems down the road? I hear so many different scenarios on this forum. Any suggestions or feedback is greatly appreciated.

 
Concretemasonry's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 6,125
MN

12-15-05, 11:36 AM   #9  
is my basement the right approach?

I see no real problems with your appraoch and concern. It is done that way very often. It is very similar to one of my projects.

I was jusr trying to make the point that too often some people on the forum get wrapped up in details and not looking at the big picture. This is paticularly true when it comes to vapor barriers, compromising vapor barriers, method of installation, etc when it may make little if any difference for a specific project. I don't want people to think they will get struck by lightning if they do not do every step absolutely correct when there are othe considerations.

Basements are a prime example since the climates are different and every project is different. Yet, they try to apply the same canned soultion via a prescriptive code or standard and make you think there are no options.

It is unfortunate that the local code officials are not paid enough to attract enough people with the confidence and exposure to listen to and approve a specific project based on its merits.

I have spent over 30 years in codes and standards, both domestically and internationally, and have to laugh at the number of 180s I have seen when people try to get too specific. The "guidelines" are good, but it difficult to apply them correctly.

Dick

 
brianhunter01's Avatar
Member

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 305
NY

12-15-05, 12:35 PM   #10  
Dick,

Thanks so much for your response. I was confident before I got onto the forum but after reading all these scenarios I started to get worried, thankfully though after reading your response and several of your other responses to other questions (you obviously have a great knowledge in general on homes) I feel confident again. While I got you, I read your response to someone having no insulation and getting it blown in. I realized the upstairs portion of my house is not insulated. I had a feeling and then drilled a whole in the closet and sure enough I was right. My question is, is it very costly to have someone come in and blow it into the walls? I figured I am gonna attack this project next fall and worry about it then but if it is that expensive to have someone blow it in, I figure I am better off taking the plaster down on the exterior walls insulating and re sheetrocking. I know it is a lot of labor but if it is real expensive to get it blown it perhaps I will go that rout.

 
Search this Thread