Removing Recessed Canister Light above bathtub/shower.

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  #1  
Old 10-29-07, 03:34 AM
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Red face Removing Recessed Canister Light above bathtub/shower.

There has been a problem with the light above our tub/shower not working. The wall switch is fine. I've removed the cover and dropped the light bulb receptacle to check it out. With the fixture in this situation, the light will come and go in dicating there is a short in the wiring itself and, I believe the short is in the wires attached to the light bulb receptacle itself. Can that be replaced. There is also a metal clip like device attached to the inside of the canister that has two wires attached to a piece that is anchored inside the metal clip. It is loose but does not slide completely out of the anchoring clip. Could this be the problem. Lastly, How do I remove the canister from the ceiling in order to replace it with a new one? I am the worst at destroying things because I never know what will happen when I begin to apply any type of pressure/force on a given object... like spinning the heads clean off of bolts when tightening them!!! I'm better but I still try to keep from doing much tightening or loosening of anything!!! There appears to be a metal piece coming down from the top of the canister that is bent in a fashion that makes it appear that it has someting to do with holding the canister in place. Along with that metal piece, there is also about an eighth to a quarter inch tip of a sheet metal screw sticking inside the top of the canister. I really need to get this repaired. Any help will truly be appreciated. I am definitely NOT much of a DIY kind of guy. Put me on a stage singing or behind a camera shooting B.B. King and I'm in my element.
Thanks...
W.A. Williams/The Reverend Billy Rose!http://www.myspace.com/thereverendbi...arysoulshakers
 
  #2  
Old 10-29-07, 05:18 AM
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Welcome to the forums! You say the light comes and goes. How long between intervals? If it is about a minute between going off and a couple before it goes on, it is possible you have too hot a bulb in it. Reducing the wattage of bulb will help keep the thermal switch from tripping (sort of like a resetting circuit breaker within the unit). If you have loose wires, it would be an "open", not a "short", just to clarify the terminology. Some "old work" ceiling boxes can be removed by releasing 3 black clips on the edges, but if you don't see the 3 clips, then it is a "new work" box, and is permanently affixed to the ceiling joists, and would be a bear to remove without messing up the ceiling material. check out the clips and let us know if they are there. You may want to also post a couple of pictures on a site such as photobucket.com and list the urls on this site so we can see what you see.
 
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Old 10-29-07, 05:41 AM
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A short is not your problem. A short would trip the circuit breaker. An open circuit is the problem. Something is opening the circuit.

It could be a bad connection. Heat could be causing a bad connection to open.

It sould be the thermal sensor, which is the item you are wondering about. It shuts off the light when there is tok much heat.

Remake ALL the connections at the light and see if that fixes the problem. If it does not, you can try replacing the thermal sensor or the light fixture itself. I would not worry about replacing the entire ceiling mount, as that is likely not the problem.
 
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Old 10-29-07, 11:55 AM
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Removal and replacement of recessed canister fixture

Larry...
Thanks for the response. I saw a posting about the thermal switch shut off and knew that wsn't the problem. It surely is an "open" problem. I think I understand that terminology. It is the clips and I finally released them. This fixture has been in place a long time. The walls, ceiling are the old true sheet rock and the fixture hole was cut right through it. There still remains a problem though. It's the wiring itself. Being familiar with this type of fixture maybe you will understand my feeble attempt to describe what I see am am experiencing at this point in time. The canister is dropped down as far as it will go and is still 3/4 of the way still inside the opening. It is suspended by it's wires. At the top inside of the canister, off to one side, there is a hole through which a plug like device has two wires threaded through it. One is black, the other white. The white wire goes directly to the light bulb socket and connects. The black wire goes to a little "coupleing device" (a resister of sorts?). The black wire goes in, connects to this little device and is ran back out and to the light bulb socket. You know the rest of the configuration the light bulb socket clips into a cone shaped reflecter which fastens to the cover which then fits up into the opening sealing the fixture. I can't get the canister to drop any further. Do I have to cut these wires in order to get the canister completely out of the hole? There is plenty of wire inside the canister. I can actually turn the canister inside the opening to the left and right until it is stopped by the connecting wire on the other side of the ceiling. I dare not cut anything without first getting the advice from an expert like yourself. The problem at this time... how to disconnect wires from canister to allow it to be completely removed from the hole and still be able to reconnect wires to new canister for installation.
Thanks...
W.A.
 
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Old 10-29-07, 07:15 PM
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If you are determined to remove it, and can turn the unit on its side, you should see a cable strain relief where the cables enter the junction box (or body of the fixture). Releasing this strain relief will release the wires from the fixture, and should allow you to drop it all the way out. Most new work fixtures have a junction box attached to the side of the bell and make it very difficult to remove from a round hole. Let us know what you do with the strain relief.
 
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Old 10-30-07, 12:08 AM
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Turn it on it's side?

That's confusing since the can is suspended between heaven and hell inside the hole. There is a "plug", a metal piece through which the wires run into the can. It may be pushed out but can not be pulled into the can. If I am able to somehow break that loose should it help release the wires enough to allow the can to drop further down? May the canister be rebuilt from the inside to rectify the "open" problem? I suppose this will be my last post/question until I see this thing through and then I'll be back to share the outcome. Thanks for all of your time and consideration. Here's the situation in a nutshell: hole (through real "sheet rock"?), can, can in hole, unable to drop can below hole to see and/or reach the power (line/source) connection. This may simply be impossible without breaking/cutting through the ceiling to reach whatever is on the other side. Or, I may just end up cutting the wires and releasing the can and take it from there. You DIYers are an amazing group of people with, apparently, the patience of "Job" himself! That's very commendable. And to spend additional time and energy coaching folks like myself is going the proverbiale "extra mile". Thanks for your time and consideration... it's a real service to your fellow man. I'm sure I'll be back and maybe I'll actually have some solution to contribute.
W.A.
 
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Old 10-30-07, 05:06 AM
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Whatever you do, don't cut the wires too short. If you do, you will not be able to install your new light. All junction boxes (which would be your only solution) have to be exposed, and having one in my shower isn't a pretty thought. If you have to destroy the old light, do so. You can install an "old work" light in the space. Destroying the can is much more acceptable than cutting the wires.
 
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Old 10-30-07, 09:31 AM
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Eureka!!!

About 2:30 this morning, I started messing with that can again. This time, I decided to make more of an effort to pull it out of the hole. It worked!!! There is basically a "cap" on top of the canister that probably isn't supposed to come of, but, in this case, it came loose on one side and popped up freeing the canister to be pulled out. The interesting thing is the electircal box was loose and came out with it. I appears that I could have cut the wires with no resulting negative consequences. The wires connected to the canister itself are threaded through to the electrical box and htat's where it all comes together. Cutting the wires would have freed the unit from the plug that was fasteninging the wires to the canister. All I have to do now is go get a new canister and wire nut everything together. My confidence has received a much needed boost in the DIY department!!! Thank you so much for helping me through this. Hopefully I will be able to contribute something, although, I suppose reaching this solution is a positive contribution, isn't it? LOL!!! Cool!!!
Peace...
W.A.
 
 

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