3 gang Insteon switch installation help


  #1  
Old 01-17-16, 09:51 PM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
3 gang Insteon switch installation help

Going a bit nuts here and my lack of experience is getting in the way.

Replacing 3 switches - 2 older 2 wire Leutron dimmers and a leutron 3 wire dimmer [which is also controlled at the other end of the kitchen. This 3 way switch has contrasting orientation.]

new switches are Insteon home automation type dimmers (2477D). The Insteon's have red/white (load) black(line) and bare copper ground wires.

I was able to get the 3 way working (far right) but having problems integrating the other 3 wire Insteons to the existing 2 wire setup that the leutrons had.

See pic. The other 2 standard 2 wire dimmers we're just pigtailed to a line and separately to loads, seems i've not completed the circuit.

My 2nd new switch (1st on left) has power but will not control light, ive not integrated the 3rd new switch yet- old leutron in in the middle

Name:  inprogress.jpg
Views: 3862
Size:  43.1 KB
 
  #2  
Old 01-17-16, 11:13 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Jersey
Posts: 65,967
Received 4,149 Upvotes on 3,726 Posts
You have many white wires there in a splice and labeled load. Those are neutrals not loads.
You are showing three wires on switch 2..... were two on one screw or on a push in and a screw ?

Your coloring of the wires is making the job difficult.

Name:  dim.JPG
Views: 3882
Size:  28.2 KB

Your new dimmer has three wires.
The white gets connected to the white neutral splice like the one you already connected.
The red wire goes to load and the black wire goes to line.

You should have two wires on a switch. Using a voltmeter test them. One will have 120v on it.
That is the line and goes to the black wire. The other one is the load.... red.
 
  #3  
Old 01-18-16, 07:33 AM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Hi,

The coloring is my edits of a photo I took, but here is the pic w/o coloring. I have volt tester.

switch 2 is the new Insteon [load line neutral and ground]. The old leutrons were 2 wires, both old switches were spliced to a single line and then to separate load lines. *see switch 3 as this is an original untouched config of the old switch.

So if i follow for the remaining 2 Insteon 3 wires switches:

1. connect all new dimmers white wires to the spliced neutral. Assume i need to add a wire to the splice as I've maxed out the cap and cannot add 3 more wires to this?

2. i know where the line is for the 2 other switches as they were joined to it (see pic)

3. for the load lines , the other 2 switches were joined to 2 sep. loads lines, use this?

4. what about the lone load line in the right of the pic. cap this?

thanks!

Name:  wp_20160117_13_58_24_pro.jpg
Views: 646
Size:  32.6 KB
 

Last edited by frodiggs; 01-18-16 at 07:53 AM.
  #4  
Old 01-18-16, 08:53 AM
ray2047's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 29,711
Upvotes: 0
Received 15 Upvotes on 13 Posts
I have volt tester.
If you mean a non contact tester you don't. To test for voltage you need a multimeter, preferably analog, or a neon test light, or a solenoid tester.
 
  #5  
Old 01-18-16, 09:48 AM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Jersey
Posts: 65,967
Received 4,149 Upvotes on 3,726 Posts
I can see 5) two wire cables in that box.

You said the right switch was set up for three way operation yet I don't see a three wire cable with a red wire that should be there.

I also see the white wire from a dimmer on a black wire. That is not correct.

You can't connect the dimmers until you ID each cable coming into the box.
 
  #6  
Old 01-18-16, 10:20 AM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
I have Klein tools ET50.

6, 2 wire cables in the box

original setup

all ground wires spliced together

wire cables 1&2: whites are netural and spliced, blacks are spliced and are line. the original dimmers were pigtailed to this spliced black line to their line wires

wire cables 3&4: whites are netural and spliced along with neutral from cables 1&2, blacks are load and independently went to the 2 wired dimmers as load

wire cable 5: white is netural and spliced along with neutral from cables 1-4, black is load went to red wire of old dimmer [and now connected to red wire of new dimmer]

wire cable 6: white is oddly line here and is connected to black wire on new dimmer. black wire not used currently

working new dimmer on far right also has neural added to 5 spliced neutral wires and ground wire connected to spliced grounds.
 
  #7  
Old 01-18-16, 10:28 AM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Jersey
Posts: 65,967
Received 4,149 Upvotes on 3,726 Posts
Cable 5 and 6 are mostly dedicated to the three way circuit. I'd cap the extra black wire off.

Wow... you've ID'ed everything perfectly. There should be no problem now.

Black 1, black 2, dimmer 1 black, dimmer 2 black all get connected together.
Black 3 goes to dimmer 1 red.
Black 4 goes to dimmer 2 red.
Whites get connected to the neutral splice.
 
  #8  
Old 01-18-16, 10:59 AM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
This makes sense as the old 3 way setup was on the end also. At the other end a basic paddle turns this light on or off.

So for the neutral splice is pigtailing a new wire for the other 2 dimmer to use the right term? Now way I want to add 2 more wires to this splice.

thanks much~
 
  #9  
Old 01-18-16, 12:19 PM
ray2047's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 29,711
Upvotes: 0
Received 15 Upvotes on 13 Posts
I have Klein tools ET50
Good, that will work. Just wanted to make sure. We have had some threads that ran many post until we found out the member was relying on a non contact tester and had been giving us incorrect information based on a false positive.
 
  #10  
Old 01-18-16, 01:04 PM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
also on the ground just grounding the last switch to the spliced grounds is fine?
 
  #11  
Old 01-18-16, 01:43 PM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
just finished. switch 2 and 3 are fine.

the first switch - [using spliced black 1-2 for line and black 3 for load] does not turn off the light, it is in a constant 'on' position.

hmm re testing shows black 3 is hot now which is connected to switch 1 red load. however when not connected it is not hot. black 4-5 have a lesser charge but do show voltage only when switches 2-3 red wires are connected.
 

Last edited by frodiggs; 01-18-16 at 02:13 PM.
  #12  
Old 01-18-16, 02:49 PM
ray2047's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 29,711
Upvotes: 0
Received 15 Upvotes on 13 Posts
All voltage testing needs to be done with the wire disconnected. It needs to be tested to ground or neutral. Attempting to test connected can lead to false positives because a feed through a connected load.
 
  #13  
Old 01-18-16, 05:19 PM
F
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: usa
Posts: 9
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Got it working, seems the 1st switch was faulty.

really appreciate all the help here!
 
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
 
Ask a Question
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: