Replacing porch light - no junction box
#1
08-03-16, 08:41 AM
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Replacing porch light - no junction box
Hi,
I've currently got an old surface mount light by my front door that I would like to replace. I'm comfortable with the wiring aspect but want to make sure I understand what's required from a code stand point.
I'd like to install a new light similar to this:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]69164[/ATTACH]
Based on what I've seen in past threads on here, a junction box is required, and I basically have 2 options:
1. cut a hole in the siding (board & batten) and install a junction box in the wall cavity.
2. Install a surface mount junction box (pancake style?), which would mount onto the existing siding.
Am I correct? Based on the style of light I want, it appears option 1 would be better aesthetically?
I've currently got an old surface mount light by my front door that I would like to replace. I'm comfortable with the wiring aspect but want to make sure I understand what's required from a code stand point.
I'd like to install a new light similar to this:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]69164[/ATTACH]
Based on what I've seen in past threads on here, a junction box is required, and I basically have 2 options:
1. cut a hole in the siding (board & batten) and install a junction box in the wall cavity.
2. Install a surface mount junction box (pancake style?), which would mount onto the existing siding.
Am I correct? Based on the style of light I want, it appears option 1 would be better aesthetically?
#2
08-03-16, 08:48 AM
Group Moderator
You pretty much need to use choice one as a pancake box doesn't look like it will fit behind that light fixture. You can use a shallow 4" round box.
If the 4" round box is too large to be covered by the fixture then use a standard cut-in gem box.
Actually.... with the way that fixture attaches to its backplate.... a pancake box wouldn't work.
If the 4" round box is too large to be covered by the fixture then use a standard cut-in gem box.
Actually.... with the way that fixture attaches to its backplate.... a pancake box wouldn't work.
#5
08-03-16, 10:39 AM
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Based on what I've seen when in the crawl space and attic that circuit should be wired with the older 2 wire romex w/ cloth sheathing (house was built in 1956).
#6
08-03-16, 04:32 PM
that circuit should be wired with the older 2 wire romex w/ cloth sheathing
#7
08-03-16, 06:06 PM
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Hi Ray,
I did some poking around and discovered I have access in my basement to the section of wire between the switch and outside to the outlet. Could I install a junction box in the basement in the area pictured (~ 6 feet of wire from here to existing light), pull old wire back and splice new 90C rated wire and pull new wire back up into the new box that's required for the new light fixture? Since the current wire is un-grounded I'm guessing I'd have to contact my AHJ to see if they would allow?
It's the black sheathed wire shown here, goes up to light fixture. I couldn't see any text on the sheathing.
I did some poking around and discovered I have access in my basement to the section of wire between the switch and outside to the outlet. Could I install a junction box in the basement in the area pictured (~ 6 feet of wire from here to existing light), pull old wire back and splice new 90C rated wire and pull new wire back up into the new box that's required for the new light fixture? Since the current wire is un-grounded I'm guessing I'd have to contact my AHJ to see if they would allow?
It's the black sheathed wire shown here, goes up to light fixture. I couldn't see any text on the sheathing.
#8
08-03-16, 06:33 PM
ull old wire back and splice new 90C rated wire and pull new wire back up into the new box that's required for the new light fixture?
#9
08-03-16, 06:54 PM
Group Moderator
That fixture has a separate canopy. I don't think higher heat wire is required.
It's different with ceiling mounted fixtures where the heat goes into the canopy.
It's different with ceiling mounted fixtures where the heat goes into the canopy.
#11
08-04-16, 06:05 AM
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I guess it will come down to if the fixture has a warning about 90C wire being required or not - which based on Pete's info is not likely?
What's the easiest way to install that blue rework box? Pull the wire back into the basement, use a hole saw (4 inch?) to cut through siding and any sheathing, pull wire back up and through the box, then slide the box into place?
What's the easiest way to install that blue rework box? Pull the wire back into the basement, use a hole saw (4 inch?) to cut through siding and any sheathing, pull wire back up and through the box, then slide the box into place?
#13
08-05-16, 10:08 AM
Forum Topic Moderator
The old cable should be stapled in the wall. I doubt you will be able to pull the old cable out.
I have installed similar fixtures that did require the 90 degree wiring. Check for a label on the fixture or fixture wires.
I have installed similar fixtures that did require the 90 degree wiring. Check for a label on the fixture or fixture wires.
#14
08-06-16, 07:08 AM
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pcboss - since it's probably stapled, my best option will be a rotozip or similar so I can avoid nicking the wire already in the wall like Tolyn recommended?
Does the remodel box just sit on the siding where I've cut the hole out?
Does the remodel box just sit on the siding where I've cut the hole out?
#15
08-06-16, 07:39 AM
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Does the remodel box just sit on the siding where I've cut the hole out?
#16
08-06-16, 09:05 AM
Does the remodel box just sit on the siding where I've cut the hole out?
Ears retract for insertion then are twisted out behind siding to hold in place.
#17
08-10-16, 06:24 PM
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Sorry Ray,
When I read your earlier post I was picturing the ears twisting out but not actually clamping against the siding, it makes more sense now.
I'm going to need to pick up a rotary style saw, anyone have a preference between the rotozip or dewalt DW660?
As an alternative, could I use a 4 inch (4 1/8 inch?) hole saw? Or do I run the risk of nicking the wire?
When I read your earlier post I was picturing the ears twisting out but not actually clamping against the siding, it makes more sense now.
I'm going to need to pick up a rotary style saw, anyone have a preference between the rotozip or dewalt DW660?
As an alternative, could I use a 4 inch (4 1/8 inch?) hole saw? Or do I run the risk of nicking the wire?
#18
09-18-16, 06:16 PM
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Hi All!
I finally found the time to start on this project earlier today. Everyone's advice so far has been great - I was able to get the hole cut out for the new junction box today but hit a snag when I was going to install the box. I discovered that my siding is right on top of the plywood sheathing, creating a 2" deep piece of wood that the ears need to clamp behind. However, the Carlon box I picked up is only adjustable up to 7/8".
At this point I'm at a loss with how to proceed, any suggestions?
I finally found the time to start on this project earlier today. Everyone's advice so far has been great - I was able to get the hole cut out for the new junction box today but hit a snag when I was going to install the box. I discovered that my siding is right on top of the plywood sheathing, creating a 2" deep piece of wood that the ears need to clamp behind. However, the Carlon box I picked up is only adjustable up to 7/8".
At this point I'm at a loss with how to proceed, any suggestions?
#21
09-20-16, 09:32 AM
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Thanks for the advice guys, I attached it to the siding like Tolyn suggested and got the light mounted last night. Still need to go back and clean things up - haven't caulked the top & sides at the siding yet and there's a small edge of the junction box flange sticking out of the side, but overall it looks pretty good!
Thanks again!
Thanks again!
#22
09-20-16, 12:52 PM
Forum Topic Moderator
Looks good. The edge of the box can be trimmed or sanded off to allow the fixture to hide it.
