Chandelier not lighting


  #1  
Old 12-21-17, 03:35 PM
G
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 7
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Chandelier not lighting

Hi, I have a chandelier that is controled by two wall switches, one of which is a dimmer. One of the bulb sockets was intermittent. When trying to find the problem, I shorted the chandelier ( yeah, I know, dope slap already given). Now it will not turn on. I verified that there is power at both switches. I also verified that when the power is on there is power at the wires in the chandelier ceiling box. There is a plug in the chandelier wiring (photo). I pulled this plug apart and there was 120v at the box side of the plug. So the power is getting to the chandelier and gets interrupted somewhere from the lamp side of the plug on. It is not that the bulbs are burned out, there is no power to any of the sockets. Is this plug in the wiring also a fuse? If it is, is it replaceable? Since the lamp wiring I s connected to a 15A breaker, is this plug necessary? If it is not a fuse, any ideas what else the problem could be? Thanks, George
 
Attached Images  
  #2  
Old 12-21-17, 04:04 PM
Gunguy45's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 21,112
Received 4 Votes on 4 Posts
Does it have 3 wires to it or just 2? If three, it may be a watt limiter, though I haven't heard of those in just light fixtures before, only fans.

If it's 2 wires, then it's a fuse or fusible link of some sort and should be replaced with some sort of equivalent...at least I probably would. A 15A breaker is far more than what that lamp draws and would do nothing to protect the fixture itself from damage, overheating, fire due to some failure. You didn't mention how many bulbs or what ratings the sockets have, so you'd need that info to determine what to replace it with if not an OEM piece.
 
  #3  
Old 12-21-17, 04:08 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 62,627
Received 1,605 Votes on 1,479 Posts
Usually any kind of short will wipe out the dimmer. That would be the place I'd start.
 
  #4  
Old 12-21-17, 04:15 PM
Gunguy45's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 21,112
Received 4 Votes on 4 Posts
Pete...he said he has power at the box and on one side of whatever that is?
 
  #5  
Old 12-21-17, 04:36 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 62,627
Received 1,605 Votes on 1,479 Posts
Does he have power after the dimmer with the fixture connected ?
The dimmer can pass enough 120v to measure but not light the bulbs.
 
  #6  
Old 12-21-17, 05:51 PM
G
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 7
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
I metered the non-dimmer switch and there is 120v there. I disconnected the dimmer (only way I could acces the wire) and there is 120v there. I then reconnected the dimmer and metered at the fixture and there was 120v there. I am not sure if it was the dimmer or the non-dimmer was used to switch on the light. Does it matter? If the power was turned on from the non-dimmer switch and there is 120v at the light, could the dimmer still be bad? I can do additional tests tomorrow. Thanks for the info so far.
 
  #7  
Old 12-21-17, 06:39 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 62,627
Received 1,605 Votes on 1,479 Posts
It sounds like you do have 120v at the light. I don't see a fuse in that plug in the picture but it is possible. I'd imagine that plug makes hanging the chandelier easier but it can be removed.
 
  #8  
Old 12-21-17, 08:19 PM
Gunguy45's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 21,112
Received 4 Votes on 4 Posts
Heck, it could just have some arching in the contact areas of that plug? I'd cut the juice and ohm it out.
 
  #9  
Old 12-22-17, 06:19 PM
G
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 7
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Turns out that it is the dimmer. I had 120V at the light but when I connected that plug nothing lit. I noticed that when I turned either switch off there was still about 30V at the light. When I took the dimmer completely out of the circuit everything worked fine. I guess the dimmer has a short. Donít know why the breaker didnít trip. Also, why, s if there was 120V at the light, why nothing lit.
 
  #10  
Old 12-22-17, 06:48 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 62,627
Received 1,605 Votes on 1,479 Posts
That's what I mentioned in post 5. The dimmer allowed enough voltage for the meter to read but not light the light.

I thought you had put a switch in place of the dimmer.
 
  #11  
Old 12-22-17, 07:42 PM
Gunguy45's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 21,112
Received 4 Votes on 4 Posts
Somehow I assumed (yeah, we all know, but always forget about "assuming") that you had measured the output of the "plug" with it connected. 120V on input + 0V on output = open in my book.
 
  #12  
Old 12-22-17, 08:46 PM
G
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 7
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
ďThe dimmer allowed enough voltage for the meter to read but not light the light.ď
I understand what you mean but do not understand the situation. With my final readings,after playing around a lot, with the switch on I was reading 120V at the light socket itself but none of the lights on the chandelier would light. When I removed the dimmer from the circuit I still read 120 at the test socket ( there are of the on the fixture) and now all the lights lit. Why would the dimmer prevent the fixture from working if there was 120V at the light sockets? There was a short in the dimmer since I was reading 30V at the socket with the power off. With the dimmer out of the circuit there was no voltage at the socket.
Thanks for all the information. Just trying to get at the final explanation of how things worked together to cause the problem.
 
  #13  
Old 12-22-17, 09:03 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 62,627
Received 1,605 Votes on 1,479 Posts
A digital meter is VERY sensitive to reading voltages. It can and does show ghost or induced voltages from a dead wire if it's run next to a live wire. We, as electricians, run into this problem everyday. We use voltage testers that load the line under testing. The load applied to the line being tested eliminates any undesired induced voltages.

We usually tell members to use an analog meter because they present a load to the wire being tested.

The dimmer uses an electronic switching part..... usually a triac. That triac will always pass a small amount of current and 120v that a voltmeter can measure. The triac has a gate that is connected to the slider or knob. Once a short hits the dimmer,..... that gate is damaged...... but the slight current and 120v is still present.

That's why I mentioned checking the voltage AT the light with the light plugged in. The light is the load needed to stop induced or residual voltage readings.
 
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
 
Ask a Question
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: