old john deere snowfire running problems


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Old 09-12-08, 10:45 PM
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old john deere snowfire running problems

i recently acquired a mid 80s john deere snowfire sonmoblie. i can get the thing to run but only at high rpms. there is no choke knob as it broke off today, but it never helped it start anyway. it will start if i have the throttle held wide open, and it will run for about 15 seconds or so if i hold the throttle wide open, but if i let off of it very much it will kill. a new carb and fuel pump was put on last year. there really isn't any air filter as it is only a metal screen that i can see right through. i took the carb apart today and everything looked perfect. it is a gas oil mix and it smokes very badly, i am running it a little lean but it don't seem to help. there is some sort of black tar like liguid coming out of the exhaust as the grass beneath it is covered with the stuff. there is 1 jet screw and the idle knob but messing with the jet screw doesn't seem to help at all. i plan on pulling the plugs off tomorrow as i didn't have a plug wrench on hand.
 
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Old 09-13-08, 06:09 AM
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It sounds like you have the oil mix in the gas too rich. That would account for the problem. Check your ratio there and adjust it.
 
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Old 09-13-08, 11:20 AM
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the previous owner told me to mix a quart with 5 gallons so thats about 6.4 oz or so per gallon, the tank had about a pint of gas in it when i got it and i added about a half gallon of my weed whip mix, which coincidentally was mixed with snowmobile oil, it is mixed at a 40:1 ratio, shoul i add some gas in the tank and see if that helps or am i about right? because i don't know much about gas/oil ratio in snowmobiles
 
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Old 09-13-08, 11:28 AM
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If the mix in the snowmobile is 40:1, the excess smoke isn't coming from the oil in the mix. It would have to be coming from the carb setting or a closed choke. Another possibility would be a perforated diapraphm on a fuel pump. That would let fuel into the crankcase when it isn't supposed to = rich mixture.
 
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Old 09-13-08, 01:26 PM
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i believe there was a new fuel pump and carb put on it last winter, the fuel pump has 2 ports goin out of it and one runs to the carb and the other is capped off, and there is no leak out of it, i was told that after the stuff was changed the snowmobile ran fine. i don't think that the choke ever worked right because it never helped to start it, but i broke the choke knob off yesterday so it is at the run spot.could it be that when the carb was swapped that the choke cable wasn't put on correctly?
 
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Old 09-13-08, 03:24 PM
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It's hard to say about the choke cable. It could just be corroded and stuck in its sheath. For that you'd likely need a new cable.

If the choke is stuck in the run position (full open and not showing in the carb throat, that's not causing the rich condition. However, with the excess smoke there is a problem of some sort.

Sometimes unburned fuel sits in the exhaust and burns when the engine starts heating up the exhaust system. Once that's burned out, the exhaust clears up. It may take a while if that's the problem.

I would get it started and run it for a few minutes to see if the exhaust clears up. Then check the plug for a black or sooty condition. If it shows either and you have a good strong spark, the setting in the carb is either out of adjustment or the metering for the fuel chamber is leaking. With an all position carb, there could be a problem with the pop-off in the carb. That usually isn't the case, but it is a possibility.
 
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Old 09-13-08, 05:51 PM
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thanks for the replys dude, i just got it running like new. i was right about the choke cable, when they changed the carb they didn't screw the choke cable on nearly far enough, there was about a half inch of threads showing and i screwed it all the way down. runs amazing. and it doesn't smoke nearly as much now, but i want to thankk you spicifically about sayin that the gas in the muffler(which i'm sure there is a lot of) is just burning off. tomorrow i will probably pull the muffler and spray a garden hose in it.

i set the back of it on some cement blocks so i could really get the rpms up, and i got 2 words: "HOLY ****!", it was crazy the ground was shaking like mad, and the neighbors started showin up at their windows so i figured i had better go in the house before they called the cops on me for disturbing the peace! lol

and another thing, it still has the original track and i better change it cause it has metal bars on it and they ain't legal here, how can i fing out what size i need, and how much will 1 cost?

Thanks much!
-Ryan
 
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Old 09-13-08, 07:07 PM
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to find out what size track you need i would guess you would measure the width of the track and its overall length then take the mesurements to a dealer and see what they come up with or take the old track with you.
 
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Old 09-13-08, 10:58 PM
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Dennis Kirk shows replacement tracks for some Deere sleds with steel bars. Are you sure they are illegal, and if so is there some sort of grandfather's clause being that it came from the factory that way?
 
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Old 09-14-08, 10:14 AM
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no, i'm not 100% sure that steel bars are illegal. my friend got a old snowmobile last year and it was the original studed track and him and every1 else were talkin about how illegal it was. i'm in MN so it might be a state law, and maybe it doesn't apply to bars, and maybe there is a grandfather thing, but how would they be able to tell if it was the original track?
 
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Old 09-14-08, 10:48 AM
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It is unlawful to:
operate a snowmobile with metal traction devices on paved public trails except as specifically allowed by state or local government.

Metal traction device means any metal device, or array of metal devices, attached to a snowmobile track to enhance traction. This includes metal components that extend more than one-fourth inch from the bottom of the track. Note: Metal cleats affixed perpendicular to the direction of travel of a 1981 or earlier snowmobile are not considered a metal traction device.
 
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Old 09-28-08, 11:21 AM
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i got more problems now, i can start is easy and i will let it idle for about a minute or 2 and it will quit. the idle just keeps getting slower and slower, and it don't matter if i got the idle know all the way up or not. i'm assuming it could be the jet knob. there is only 1 jet knob, i don't understand y there ain't 2 but o well, do any of u know if this is the air or the gas knob? any other suggestions. and when it quits then it don't wanna start, it's really and sometime it won't start at all after that, it will fire a few times but then it will quit. like i said about the choke cable that it's as low as it will go, should i turn it up a little higher or is it the jet knob? any suggestions?

thanks
-ryan
 
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Old 09-28-08, 11:40 AM
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ad when it idles it don't smoke much, but when i rev it up it smokes like crazy. here is a vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59UwZItkunU
 
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Old 12-22-08, 05:25 PM
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well about 2 months ago i accidentally broke a spark plug, got a new 1 today. can't get the damn thing to fire. it didn't help that it was -2 degrees F. do u wonderful people have any suggestions for me.

thanks,
ryan kliber

p.s. and it's an 82 i'm sure.
 
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Old 12-26-08, 09:55 PM
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Hi, I just joined the site and have a long history and experience with John Deere sleds. Your Snowfire can be equipt with a Mikuni float bowl carb...or a Mikuni slide valve carb.

You state you are certain that it is a 1982...there is a black and gray decal on the tunnel with VIN & Serial Number information. Does the Serial Number start with 190001 - 222000 or is it above those numbers?

-Rich
 
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Old 01-02-09, 10:04 AM
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thanks for the reply, i'm afraid i don't know what the tunnel is. i'm not too smart with that. i just know how an engine works. i say it is an 82 because of the seat style, it is flat and has a ridge at the back, the 83s had a slanted seat. i believe i am correct on that. but anyway i figured out that the fuel pump is just too cold, so the engine needs to be primed, i'm getting a boat primer bulb in the next few days, but for now i have to pour gas in the carb and it will start just fine. after running it for about 5 minutes it doesn't want to idle and after 10 minutes the engine won't reach hi rpms. i think that the problem is that the choke cable is screwed to far onto the carb creating a lean fuel/air mixture. but i have to wait for my primer becaue my dad took my tank of gas, so i can't pour any into the carb to get it running. again thanks for the reply.
-Ryan Kliber
 
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Old 01-05-09, 03:19 AM
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Take the exhaust off,

You may have a clogged exhaust system. This happens on two strokes. If you can take it apart to clean it, do that. If not just build a fire and toss it in for an hour.
Another common issue is crankshaft seals. If they leak air into the engine it will not run well, if at all. If there are rubber boots between the carbs and engine inspect them closely for cracks. They can definitely do this.

Originally Posted by rkylain24 View Post
i recently acquired a mid 80s john deere snowfire sonmoblie. i can get the thing to run but only at high rpms. there is no choke knob as it broke off today, but it never helped it start anyway. it will start if i have the throttle held wide open, and it will run for about 15 seconds or so if i hold the throttle wide open, but if i let off of it very much it will kill. a new carb and fuel pump was put on last year. there really isn't any air filter as it is only a metal screen that i can see right through. i took the carb apart today and everything looked perfect. it is a gas oil mix and it smokes very badly, i am running it a little lean but it don't seem to help. there is some sort of black tar like liguid coming out of the exhaust as the grass beneath it is covered with the stuff. there is 1 jet screw and the idle knob but messing with the jet screw doesn't seem to help at all. i plan on pulling the plugs off tomorrow as i didn't have a plug wrench on hand.
 
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Old 01-12-09, 02:28 PM
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yeah, the exhaust could be a problem. but i don't think it's the main cause. there is a rubber boot between the carb and the intake manifold. it's in excellent condition.
 
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Old 01-13-09, 12:00 PM
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john deere

really hate to sound negative, but i've been fairly mechanical all my life, and have re-done several old sleds, so speak from experience........that sled will cause u more grief and angst than it's worth, especially if u don't have more than a little knowledge of things mechanical. also, by the time u get it going properly, u'll have spent enough money on it to have picked up a newer one, and u'll still have an old stoneboat anyway! my best wishes, but put this message on the wall and read it once in a while. if i'm wrong, plse send a message and i'll offer on-line apology.

regards, gerry
 
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Old 01-26-09, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by spoiledsaskhunt View Post
really hate to sound negative, but i've been fairly mechanical all my life, and have re-done several old sleds, so speak from experience........that sled will cause u more grief and angst than it's worth, especially if u don't have more than a little knowledge of things mechanical. also, by the time u get it going properly, u'll have spent enough money on it to have picked up a newer one, and u'll still have an old stoneboat anyway! my best wishes, but put this message on the wall and read it once in a while. if i'm wrong, plse send a message and i'll offer on-line apology.

regards, gerry
actually i have thought about that. but i paid nothing for it. old ipod trade. and have only stuck a small amount of time and 1 spark plug and a $10 primer bulb into it. i say i'm still in the clear. i think it just needs more carb tweaking. and a carb cleaning wouldn't hurt.
 
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Old 02-01-09, 05:09 PM
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someone out there correct me if i'm wrong......one of his earlier posts said one of the fuel pump lines was capped off and the other one went to the carb. doesn't the other one have to go to the crankcase to create a pump for the diaphram in the fuel pump?

if it was mine, i'd get a new set of head gaskets and then take off the heads.....inspect the cylinder walls to see if they're all scored to h#ll. i'd also take off the exhaust and look inside with a light to see the piston skirts are broken off. guess you cud just lift the cylinders off while u've got the heads off, but then u'ld have to put them back on without breaking the rings. scored pistons/cylinder walls, or broken pistons make for some really interesting problems. that old sled looks like a free air and they can overheat very easily if ever run in warm weather.
 
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Old 02-03-09, 09:47 PM
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about the fuel pump. it's a dual carb fuel pump, and 1 of the carb lines is capped off since there is only 1 carb. so altogether there is 4 lines coming in and out of the fuel pump. gas in, gas to the carb. capped off. and the vaccum line from the crankcase. and yes it's a free air engine.
 
 

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