tubeless tires

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  #1  
Old 03-30-03, 11:09 AM
MTgets
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tubeless tires

Hi,
I pulled out my portable chipper/shredder today and the tubeless tires were totally flat over winter. I cant get them to seal because the air keeps rushing past the rim and the tire.
How do you get the bead to seal enough to let the air stay in and build up enough pressure to lock the bead into place to inflate fully to 40 psi? I put water on the tire, rim and bead area to no avail. I see how soapy water finds a leak but I cant see how that would seal the bead for inflating. Confused?
Thanks for the advice
MT
 
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  #2  
Old 03-30-03, 12:37 PM
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Hello: MT

Interesting problem.......

Not too sure you will be able to find a tire pro within this forum and most likely not within any forum on this web site. Not exactly sure we have a tire pro. However, do not despair.

I am sure there will be several possible suggestions and advice solutions provided by the professional small engine techs in this forum. We all have ideas... Ideas but not solutions... shy of tire replacement.... which is very likely the only solution.

Possibilities:
The tires just may have dried out enough to cause them to shrink slightly. If that is the case, it may not be possible to reuse them. All depends upon how much rim clearance there is.

Allowing them to warm up in the sun just may increase the diameter size enough to allow them to fit and seal.

Check an automotive parts supply store for a product which is used to lube and seal the beads.

Any other possible solutions diy members and mods????

Tom_B
 
  #3  
Old 03-30-03, 02:29 PM
MTgets
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Tom,
Do I sense a little sarcasm in your first few sentences??

Well, it was a toss up, either post it in the hiking/camping, basements, HVAC, or small engines. I figured that most small engines are powering small wheels I chose this forum.

I also know that some of the pros that help here run repair shops for lawn and garden stuff. Mabye they would know.

Anyway, thanks for your advice, I like your idea of a lube or bead seal, just enough to get it sticky to make the air hold inside while the bead seats itself.

Any other ideas from the professional small engine techs

Thanks Tom
 
  #4  
Old 03-30-03, 04:47 PM
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Lightbulb Web Hosts Note

Hello:

You stated:
Do I sense a little sarcasm in your first few sentences??

My reply:
No. Not even close.

I stated it was an interesting problem simply because we do not have anyone on our web site whom I know of that can provide a professional answer to a tire question.

I could be incorrect and actually hope I am. If I am wrong, as the moderator hiring agent for this web site, maybe I should try to locate and hire one.

We do have several topics which are dedicated to vehicles. Which may indicate having one tire pro might be a good idea never thought of before.

Something for me to consider. Hiring a wheel and tire pro.

Thanks for the idea.

Web Site Host, Hiring Agent and Multiple Topics Moderator.
Tom_B
 
  #5  
Old 03-30-03, 05:08 PM
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Lightbulb Brilliant Idea!

Hello MT

I just sent a PM to several of our moderators in forums which deal with vehicles and requested they drop into this forum.

In doing so it is possible one or more of them can provide you with either pofessional advice and or alternate possible solutions.

Stay tuned Return often. An answer may be available so everyone can learn from it.....

Web Host, Moderator & Etc.
Tom_B.
 
  #6  
Old 03-30-03, 05:18 PM
MTgets
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Thumbs up

Thank you Tom!!

And I am sorry for taking your initial response the wrong way, probably I felt silly myself posting it here, I didnt know what forum to put it in.
I have know about you for over a year, to be a good fair and honest person.
Thanks for the PM to the Mods. No one I talk to seems to know how to keep the air in, to seal the bead.
I know there has to be a trick to it.

Thanks again Tom
with much respect
MT
 
  #7  
Old 03-30-03, 05:59 PM
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Hello MTgets!

Sorry, I would have answered your question sooner, but was gone a couple days on a fishing trip.

Tires like this can be a pain to get seated back, but you can do it. Pushing on the tire tread area towards the rim makes the sidewalls spread. Do this in two or three places using your hand and a knee. While doing this, fill the tire with air using air from a compresor with high volume (compressor with a tank). If it doesn't fill, remove the valve stem core and use a rubber-tipped blower nozzle to blow more air in it. It will fill with air so fast that the spots that aren't touching the rim will blow out enough to finally catch and seat.

If you don't have access to a compressor with a lot of volume and a tank, you most likely won't be able to fill it, and the best bet would be to take it to a tire center.

Let us know how it goes!

BTW: make sure the rim and tire are clean where they seat together to avoid leaks. Even wipe soap around the tire bead to help it seat and seal.
 
  #8  
Old 03-30-03, 06:10 PM
MTgets
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Thanks Cheese!!

That was a idea from my Bro-in-Law, that the gas stations air pump wasnt putting out enough air, and it wasnt doing it fast enough.
Looks like Ill just have to take it to a tire center, sometimes if you catch the kids finishing up for the day and slip em a 5 they do that stuff for you off the books. I know I would.

Thanks again!
 
  #9  
Old 03-30-03, 06:11 PM
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Tires come off the bead all the time when we are off road. We use a little trick to re seat them. We squirt lighter fluid around the inner lip of the tire and light it. This causes a huge expanding of the air and seats the beads. It takes all of about 3min, then top off with an air tank. If the tire dose not go out quickly have a water hose or fire extinguisher handy.


PS. I am sure the Surgeon General dsoe not think this is a good idea.
 
  #10  
Old 03-30-03, 06:43 PM
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Hehe...I thought about mentioning that, but you know why I didn't I imagine, lol.
 
  #11  
Old 03-30-03, 07:58 PM
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Just inflateing the tire dosen't fix the problem. In a few weeks or months it will be flat again if you don't repair the leak. Before you blow it up (lighter fluid pun) put some of that green gup in it that most of the mower shops sale.
The way I have repaired my mower tires is to put intertubes in them. It is safer and no mess.
 
  #12  
Old 03-31-03, 04:51 AM
mikejmerritt
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I think WeldGods idea is one of those we were discussing in the Lounge the other day....very effective, very dangerous. To clarify, the discussion was, should we pass dangerous tactics on to visitors here. I have my own method for tough to seat tires but sure won't pass it on here because its worse than WeldGods, but VERY effective. With all due respect to WeldGod I think MTgets should pass on the lighter fluid trick and opt for a tube or a pro tire store.
Some helpful thoughts.....I used to work in a tire store and we used a nylon ratchet belt wrapped around a stubborn tires tread to move the beads in place so they could contact the rim. Do as cheese says and remove the valve core and use high volume air.
When storing the machine for extended periods if you will put it on something that raises the tires off of the ground it will help the tires keep their shape even when flat....ah...out of air...Man this gets confusing.....Mike
 
  #13  
Old 03-31-03, 05:19 AM
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The ratchet strap is a great way to, I forgot about it until you brought it up.My method is not for everyone but neither is doing it yourself, you take on a certain amount of reasonability for things when you do them yourself. Most of the things we do can be dangerous, power tools, air tools, grinding, saws, mowers, and the list goes on. Even the cooking and decorating forums have potential danger involved, grease fireís and falling off latterís respectably. I think everyone has to make there own decision as to what is safe for that individual, I might be able to do something safely that some one else has no business even trying. I hope people can make up there own minds if they think itís safe. But with any thing you do you have to ask yourself, is this something I can handle or should I get a pro? I donít want to make those decisions for other people, so I just give them options and let them decide. I missed that post in the lounge, I better go check it out. And mike PM me with your solution, you have got me wondering.
 
  #14  
Old 04-07-03, 06:20 PM
MTgets
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Tubeless tire UPDATE!!!

Havent gotten on the puter much lately, finallly getting a chance to post this after a week.

I took the tubless tire from my yardman chipper/shredder to a oil change place, because I know they usually have hi-cap air compressors, and asked em if they could fill it up.
He tried and had the same results I had, air rushing right back out around the rim and rubber because the beads were not set.

Then he took the (schreoder)? valve out of the valve stem with a niffty little tool and said now we can get more air in faster.

BANG!! that tire just swelled up in a second and locked the beads right in place, then he quickly screwed the valve back in and inflated to 40 psi.
So the moral is...take the valve inners out, and inflate with a lot of air..real quick.
Thanks for the advice anyhow Tom and everyone else!!
 
  #15  
Old 04-07-03, 08:13 PM
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Yep...that's what I mentioned in my first reply..the valve stem core (sometimes called a schraeder valve).
 
  #16  
Old 04-07-03, 08:37 PM
MTgets
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my bad, my bad!!

Sorry cheese! Its been a week or so and I totally forgot that you mentioned it first, actually your idea is what drove me to the shop to see if they could take it out, since I never had taken one out before.

Sadly, when I got it fixed I did not go back to read and confirm you gave the idea.
Please dont think your post was for naught, or read over.
Your help is greatly appreciated and I have to give credit where credit is due.


I hope DIY realizes the great people on this board that help so many every day.
And you cheese, sure are one of them. Hope you can forgive my oversight.
Thanks again
 
  #17  
Old 04-07-03, 09:06 PM
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LOL! No offense was taken! I just read your follow-up and thought I had already mentioned that, so I went back up and read my first reply to make sure I did. (if I didn't, I was gonna kick myself in the rearend). Anyway, I just wanted to let you know that the schraeder valve and valve stem core are one and the same. Glad you got it fixed!
 
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