Troy built tiller.

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  #1  
Old 10-16-03, 02:24 PM
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Troy built tiller.

This tiller has a 7.5 kohler engine. It is about 20 years old, used very Little, looks like new, always kept in a barn, almost.
About three years ago I had used the tiller one day and just left it outside since it was supposed to be nice that night. Well, it rained like the devil that night. The next day I couldn't get it started so I wheeled it into the barn where it has been ever since!!!
I replaced the points, plug, condenser, put on a "New" carburetor, drained and cleaned the gas tank and lines, the vent in the gas tank cap is clear, used fresh gas. It will not run!!!!
There is a spark at the plug when you pull the starter cord, however it is absolutely dead.
I have worked on engines before but I am totally stumped!

With the time and parts involved I could have bought a whole new motor by now, but it has become a challenge of sorts!
Changeling
 
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  #2  
Old 10-17-03, 01:17 AM
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Hello changeling!

Try squirting a bit of gas into the spark plug hole and see if it will start for a second or two. Let us know what happens!
 
  #3  
Old 10-17-03, 12:55 PM
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I tried the gas in that, it sputered, and made an attempt, but no! Actually we have tried that about 30 or 40 times!
Changeling
 
  #4  
Old 10-17-03, 03:26 PM
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Hi there...

This usually means that you are not getting gas into the carb, or the carb has a blockage somewhere. Make sure your fuel line connection are tight and snug, then make sure that the tiny hole on the gas cap is not plugged. Shine a flash light through the hole, if you do not see the light then take a needle and shove it through there to remove the blockage. If you have a fuel filter, make sure it is clean and has no blockage. Once you have done that try to start the engine, if starts great job! If it does not, then you need to check out the carb inside. If you do that, the things to look for are below.

Check for trash buildup around float, needle valve and seat.
Check the jets, there are tiny holes on them, make sure very clean. If you could not get it to start and you did this whole last part, then you will need help from Cheese who will be replying at the end of day.
 
  #5  
Old 10-17-03, 04:39 PM
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What about compression?
Fish
 
  #6  
Old 10-17-03, 06:16 PM
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I agree...if it didn't start for a second or two, you may have a compression problem. My first guess would be a stuck valve, especially since you mentioned it has been in storage for 3 years after being rained on.
 
  #7  
Old 10-18-03, 12:39 PM
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I have done everything you guys have suggested more than once to no avail!
The engine has around 75 hours on it at the very most! Compression is fine, carburetor is delivering gas! Yes I know, compression-spark-good gas=start ! Not this motor! I just can't find out what is wrong!
Cheese, I gave you the wrong impression. After it was rained on we tried everything to get it to start off and on till this spring. All these attempts were made over the past 3 years. The valves are not stuck and compression is great, believe me , I have pulled that dam starter cord until I am worn out!
Changeling
 
  #8  
Old 10-18-03, 04:36 PM
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Changeling,
Just for yuks you might want to follow that plug wire back to its origin. Mice often get under blower housings and flywheels and settle in for the winter.

If they were nesting in there they may have gnawed the insulation off part of the plug wire. This happened to my tiller TWICE! Taping over the bare spot probably won't work.

The little buggers pee all over everything and when the urine evaporates the conductive salts remain where deposited. This could cause energy to the plug to "leak" (no pun intended) to ground. I actually measured resistance along a two inch section of plug wire insulation(using an old Simpson 260 analog meter set on the highest resistance scale) where the wretched little varmints had been.

Tom
 
  #9  
Old 10-18-03, 07:24 PM
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Ok, fire, fuel, compression. I guess you've checked the flywheel key? (I'm robbing Fisher's favorite response, lol). Is it possible that you are getting TOO MUCH fuel? Have you tried a new spark plug? Even though you have spark at the plug, it could still easily be bad.
 
  #10  
Old 10-18-03, 09:28 PM
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A Little Story About a Honda....

....I had that sounded a lot like this story with an unlikely end. It was a 10 HP vertical on the back of a Snapper Comet and like your engine, no electric starter. Everything was there, fire, fuel, compression, wouldn't hit a lick. After deciding to sell the mower off for the frame and engine parts I was pressure washing the whole rig and noticed MUD running out of the muffler. Dobbers had plugged the muffler and if air can't get out, it can't get in and its air that carries the fuel. This is common to two cycle engines but I have never had a 4 cycle with this problem. After the cleaning it started on the first pull.

I have seen Honda engines with 90 lbs. of compression that were so weak that they would run but under a load would bog down. I think they are fairly particular about the compression being where it should be.

I doubt this is the problem with yours but its worth a look when all seems to be well with an engine and it won't respond.....Mike
 
  #11  
Old 10-18-03, 11:49 PM
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Mike is right...not a common occurrence on 4 strokes, but it could very well be the problem.
 
  #12  
Old 10-19-03, 12:29 PM
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MikeJ I will try anything at this point. I haven't checked the muffler but will tomorrow. Cheese, I tried two new plugs! When I was racing I once bought a new set of plugs, one plug was bad! I don't know why (looked new), but bad.
To everyone else, please don't feel crazy by making an attempt at this problem, I will try anything at this point!
By the way, can you turn this type of motor over with a 1/2 inch drill arrangement anyway, man I am getting tired, LOL.
Funny thing is this thing used to start on the first or second pull every time.
Changeling
 
  #13  
Old 10-20-03, 11:02 PM
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Did you get the muffler checked out? Flywheel key?
 
  #14  
Old 10-21-03, 12:17 PM
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Muffler and key ok.
Changeling
 
  #15  
Old 10-21-03, 08:03 PM
mikejmerritt
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Hello changeling, sorry you are having a rough time with this engine. What is the compression on this engine?
 
  #16  
Old 10-21-03, 08:47 PM
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If everything we mentioed is right, it should run. I'm with Mike...what is the actual measured compression? You can rent a compression gague for free at autozone. If we get actual compression readings, we can eliminate it as a possibility, or find the problem, either one.
 
  #17  
Old 10-22-03, 10:52 AM
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Guys in regard to compression, it is like new, remember this motor has very very low hours.
Also remember, it ran beautifully until it was rained on! I think this might be the key to the problem at this point. I believe this motor has a magneto under the flywheel. This is the only thing I haven't replaced!
I have always thought that if you were getting enough spark to fire a plug, things were OK, but now I am starting to wonder.
Right now I have the fall chores to get done and don't have any more time to mess with it. As soon as I can I am going to find out how to check the mag and see if it is producing the correct amount of energy.
Changeling
 
  #18  
Old 10-22-03, 02:30 PM
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Even though the engine has very few hours on it, the compression could still be a factor. You really need to get the compression readings. You could have a stuck compression release and never know it.
 
  #19  
Old 10-23-03, 11:55 AM
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OK Cheese, I'll borrow a compression gage and make sure. But it is going to have to wait a little. Now my truck's engine light is on! Discussing this on the auto forum! Man when it rains it pours!!
Changeling
 
  #20  
Old 10-24-03, 12:44 AM
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Yeah, I know how it is sometimes. I went through a spell earlier this summer with things breaking and needing replaced. I had a break from it, then yesterday my truck sprang a water leak (no big deal), but the carburetor started acting up on me too. Don't know what in the world happened, but I guess I'll be working on that tomorrow.
 
  #21  
Old 10-29-03, 07:38 PM
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It might pay to check the points. Make sure they are opening OK when the engine is turned over. You could have good spark but improper ignition timing.
 
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