engine idles too high

Reply

  #1  
Old 02-07-08, 09:25 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
engine idles too high

Have a 1986, 8 hp Toro riding lawn mower. Rebuilt the Flo jet carburetor. Engine starts fine. When throttle is in slow position engine idles fine. The problem comes when I move the throttle to fast position, it runs excessively high.
 
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 02-07-08, 10:01 AM
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cottage Grove, MN
Posts: 239
If you can find the make and model numbers from the engine along with the manufacturer, we can look at a picture of the carburetor and maybe help point you in the right direction to solve the problem. Most likely all it may need is a minor adjustment to the throttle cable, but if we can get your numbers we can better help you.
 
  #3  
Old 02-07-08, 10:23 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
The engine model is a Briggs and Stratton engine, model #19170.
 
  #4  
Old 02-07-08, 12:25 PM
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cottage Grove, MN
Posts: 239
Briggs and Stratton engines have three sets of numbers. First is the Model (example 190402) Type (1023-41) and Code (08020788). #19170 is missing a digit, and we need the first 4 digits of the type also to accurately look up your carburetor.
 
  #5  
Old 02-07-08, 12:36 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
my bad . model # is 191707, tyoe is 2161 01, code is 86032612.
 
  #6  
Old 02-07-08, 07:11 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
einsteindog,

It's possible when removing/installing the carb (pulling on the throttle link) the governor arm could have slipped on the governor crank (shaft). If you are sure the linkage is hooked to the carb properly you may want to check/adjust the governor.

Procedure below;

1. Loosen screw holding governor arm to governor crank (shaft).

2. Rotate throttle plate linkage from idle position to full throttle position, Note the direction of rotation of the governor arm attached to the throttle linkage.

3. Place and hold the linkage in high speed position.

4. While holding the linkage in this position, Use a appropriate tool to rotate the governor crank (shaft) until it stops in the same direction as noted in step 2.

5. tighten screw holding governor lever to governor crank (shaft). Torque to 35-45 in. lbs. (2.8-5.0 NM).

6. Before starting engine, Manually actuate governor linkage to check for binding.

Good Luck
 
  #7  
Old 02-08-08, 07:32 AM
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cottage Grove, MN
Posts: 239
I didn't think there was ever a need to adjust the governor..?! Everytime someone says they should adjust the governor the Pros say you shouldn't do that that there is something else causing the problem. I'm not an expert, but I would look at the governor LAST.
 
  #8  
Old 02-08-08, 09:19 AM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Originally Posted by 31YTech View Post
einsteindog,

It's possible when removing/installing the carb (pulling on the throttle link) the governor arm could have slipped on the governor crank (shaft). If you are sure the linkage is hooked to the carb properly you may want to check/adjust the governor.
Originally Posted by Legal v8 View Post
I didn't think there was ever a need to adjust the governor..?! Everytime someone says they should adjust the governor the Pros say you shouldn't do that that there is something else causing the problem. I'm not an expert, but I would look at the governor LAST.
Well Legal v8, I guess I could be called a Pro and my post stands.

Different problems require different steps to repair, It all depends on the complaint as to what a Pro thinks the problem may be.

If the linkage (one rod) is hooked to the carb properly the only thing left is governor adjustment check. I can check this on any engine with-in 1 minute.

This governor is made of plastic and plastic wears and this governor arm can move on the shaft, This makes it more reason to check/adjust since this engine is going on 22 years old.

Cya
 
  #9  
Old 02-08-08, 10:20 AM
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cottage Grove, MN
Posts: 239
I'm not trying to step on your toes, by any means. I've just seen a lot of posts of people that want to adjust the governor and are told to do otherwise.
 
  #10  
Old 02-08-08, 03:51 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Originally Posted by Legal v8 View Post
I'm not trying to step on your toes, by any means.

Well Tim, I hope I wasn't either......


There very well could have been different circumstance's that were in those other post that lead the other Pro's to believe the problem was not the governor. As I said above, It depends on the situation that is presented as to what steps a Pro thinks one should take to try solving the problem.

Einstein did not mention this engine running excessively fast before he took the carb off to rebuild it, My post was based on face value of what he posted.

There is nothing in this carb when rebuilding would cause excessive engine RPM after re-installing unless the throttle shaft butterfly screws were left loose.

I just posted my opinion based on my 31 years experience and working daily as a Service Technician. It can be taken or left, I only joined this message board to give other's a hand.

Cya
 
  #11  
Old 02-10-08, 09:11 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
idles too high

I'm beginning to think I have an internal problem
 
  #12  
Old 02-10-08, 10:49 AM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Originally Posted by einsteindog View Post
I'm beginning to think I have an internal problem
OOOK, Can you explain why you think this ?
 
  #13  
Old 02-10-08, 11:28 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
I tried what was explained previously, still not working and the governor crank has a lot of play. Maybe I'm just doing something wrong.
 
  #14  
Old 02-10-08, 02:44 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
OK,

The above procedure is typed as in the Briggs service manual, Lets go over it in my words;

When you moved your throttle cable to full wide open/choke position the governor arm should have moved to the right rotating the governor shaft clockwise. When the governor arm screw was loosened the shaft should have been rotated clockwise and held with a light pressure while the cable is still at full/choke position then the screw tightened.


If you have up and down play in the governor shaft the shaft and or bushing is worn and in need of replacing, The bushing is a replaceable part but must be finished reamed after doing so;






Another thing to check is the locating hole in the governor, After so many hrs. the hole will get elongated and this will cause a non-functioning problem.





Good Luck
 
  #15  
Old 02-16-08, 12:24 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Thanks for all the help. disassembled engine, found the governor crank broken in two.
 
  #16  
Old 03-02-08, 11:49 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Finally got the engine back on the machine,now it won't start.Only way for the the engine to crank is to have a charger hooked up, after a few seconds the starter starts to click.Any thoughts-battery or starter?
 
  #17  
Old 03-02-08, 12:57 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Does it do this with the plug out as well ?

Check all your cable connections including the ones on the solenoid, You could take the battery to a chain auto parts store and have them test it to eliminate that as a problem.
 
  #18  
Old 03-02-08, 01:05 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Yes, it does it without the spark plug wire connected.
 
  #19  
Old 03-02-08, 01:34 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Originally Posted by 31YTech View Post
Does it do this with the plug out as well ?
Originally Posted by einsteindog View Post
Yes, it does it without the spark plug wire connected.
Hmmm.............???
 
  #20  
Old 03-02-08, 06:34 PM
hopkinsr2's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: canada
Posts: 1,561
31YTech is asking you to try & crank the engine with the spark plug REMOVED. I think this way he can narrow down a valve adjust / compression release issue. Have the battery load tested & check the starter draw,as well.Try what he asks & post back.. Thank, Roger
 
  #21  
Old 03-03-08, 10:07 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Installed a new battery. Engine cranks over, starts for a few seconds, then stops. smoke puffs out of the carb. Needs adjustment?
 
  #22  
Old 03-03-08, 04:54 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
You can try adjusting, Open the top adjuster 1 1/2 turns and the bottom 2 turns. This should get it running then set it at idle and adjust the top (low speed) till it runs the smoothest, Then give it full throttle and adjust the bottom (high speed) to run the smoothest.
 
  #23  
Old 03-12-08, 03:22 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Angry

I'm running into more problems with this machine. It seems like the throttle linkage is sticking.I put all new linkages in, including a new governor bracket. If I disconnect the cable everything moves freely.Tried adjusting the cable no luck.
 
  #24  
Old 03-12-08, 06:12 PM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,814
What won't move?
 
  #25  
Old 03-13-08, 08:10 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
The throttle cable.
 
  #26  
Old 03-13-08, 10:49 AM
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NE Okla
Posts: 432
If the throttle cable has the exposed coiled casing, you can liberally soak it with WD-40 and it should work, I've overtightened the holddown clamp positioned toward the carb that squeezed the casing such that it didn't work.
??????
 
  #27  
Old 03-14-08, 07:24 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
throttle cable conduit was rusted inside and out. replacing with new. Thanks for all the help.
 
  #28  
Old 03-21-08, 12:18 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Installed the new throttle cable works great. The engine still won't start. When I turn the key, It cranks, then theres a pop and white smoke comes out of the muffler.Tried adjusting carb. still no luck. Fuel is getting to carb. Theres spark.Any ideas?
 
  #29  
Old 03-21-08, 02:54 PM
CAMINO KID's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Southern Wisconsin
Posts: 354
When you replaced the governor arm and had the sump or base off, did the cam shaft get moved out of time? Was the cam removed and the lifters come out? Lifters removed and not installed in the orginal location will cause the valve adjustment to be off. If the cam shaft is not properly timed you will not start.
 
  #30  
Old 03-24-08, 10:37 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
Talking

Thanks Camino Kid. Took your advice checked the engine, you were right realigned the cam gear and the crankshaft gear. Put it back on the machine and it started right up on the first crank. Really appreciate everyones help. Next tiime I'll dot my I's and cross my t's.
 
  #31  
Old 03-26-08, 10:11 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
I think I spoke too soon. The machine does start and it will idle down when I move the throttle cable to slow. The problem is when I move the caable back to fast it still idles real high. Is there another adjustment to make?
 
  #32  
Old 03-26-08, 10:25 AM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Did you perform the governor adjustment I posted ?

While you were in and out of this engine did you check/replace the governor gear as I posted ?

You could have the high speed adjustment tang bent too far, The tang the governor spring is hooked to on the throttle control box. You may try bending it to put less pull on the spring when the throttle is at wide open position and see if it lowers the rpm.
 
  #33  
Old 03-27-08, 12:25 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
I have tried every which way that has been posted. Still no luck.
 
  #34  
Old 03-27-08, 03:25 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Did you check the locating hole in the governor as I posted ?

You said you installed new carb linkages, Where the throttle link hooks to the carb how many holes are in the shaft to put the link in ?
 
  #35  
Old 03-28-08, 11:24 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
This particular engine has a governor slinger. The governor shaft pushes the cup in.Everything looks like its working properly. The governor lever has two holes. One holds the throttle linkage(top).The other holds the Governor spring.
 
  #36  
Old 03-28-08, 12:41 PM
31YTech's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: EveryWhere
Posts: 1,263
Originally Posted by einsteindog View Post
This particular engine has a governor slinger. The governor shaft pushes the cup in.

Oh, I know how this works, Below is what I am speaking of;


After so many hrs. the hole will get elongated and this will cause a non-functioning problem.




If the governor can be moved around on the camshaft it needs to be replaced.

The governor lever has two holes. One holds the throttle linkage(top).The other holds the Governor spring.
That's fine, I was speaking of the other end of this link rod where it hooks to the carb.....How many holes are in the carb ?


Originally Posted by 31YTech View Post
You could have the high speed adjustment tang bent too far, The tang the governor spring is hooked to on the throttle control box. You may try bending it to put less pull on the spring when the throttle is at wide open position and see if it lowers the rpm.
This is what I was speaking about above;



This is located behind the throttle control assembly that your cable hooks to.
 
Reply

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Display Modes