Was told mower started but cant seem to start it

Reply

  #1  
Old 07-30-08, 06:34 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Was told mower started but cant seem to start it

Snapper LT160H482BV Was told my front engine snapper riding mower would start just not move but doesnt seem to start. I know they guy told me it had a bad starter so he would have to jump a wire from battery to starter. Is this possible or how do i know if starter is bad or if its just the module before the starter? Id appreciate a some advice here guys. Mower doesnt seem to do anything when i turn key and i have ran a wire from battery to starter and it just sparks and every once in a while it will nudge the engine because i can see the top of engine turn a little.. thanks people
 
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 07-30-08, 08:09 AM
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: GA
Posts: 150
The wire you're using may be too small. It needs to be at least a #6. You might do better just shorting between the two terminals on top of the starter solenoid with a screwdriver.

It sounds like the solenoid may be bad, or there may be a problem with the wiring or keyswitch. Can you hear any clicking sound when you turn the key to start? You can use a jumper from the battery + terminal to the small terminal on the solenoid to see if it's the solenoid or the switch/wiring.
 
  #3  
Old 07-30-08, 01:26 PM
bontai Joe's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 592
As Rogerflies mentioned above, I think you are using too small a wire, use one half of a set of jumper cables.
 
  #4  
Old 07-30-08, 03:07 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
well... it doesnt seem to be too small of wire im using. Im using wire from a washer plug prong.. Seems to be same size as the wire run from the solenoid to the starter.. And i also tried shorting the two terminals on solenoid with a screwdriver and it did the same... Just sparks and you can feel the starter jump every time i shorted the two terminals but didnt turn the engine everytime.. Just everyonce in a while it would bump the engine to barely turn it not even an inch. But you can feel it hitting the starter. Now with the positive wire just run from solenoid to battery it does nothing so the solenoid must be bad? correct? And when i turn key i hear no clicking just the key turning.. Would you guys say the starter is bad also? What else can i try?
 
  #5  
Old 07-30-08, 05:36 PM
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: GA
Posts: 150
It does sound like the solenoid is bad.

However, shorting across the terminals on the top of the solenoid should have made the starter crank the engine, so you've got other problems to deal with.

See if you can turn the engine over by hand with the key in the OFF position. You should be able to get enough grip on the screen on the flywheel on top of the engine to turn it.

If it turns without a lot of effort, continue on.

I'd start by removing the connectors at the battery, cleaning the contact surfaces with a wire brush, and tightening them up again. Try the jumper across the solenoid terminals again.

If it doesn't crank, do the same thing on the rest of the connections in the starting circuit and the ground connection from the battery to the frame.

Let us know if doing that helps or not.

Oh, the conductors in a washing machine power cord are about 1/4 to 1/3 the size you need to deliver enough power to the starter from a 12 volt battery.
 
  #6  
Old 07-30-08, 05:56 PM
Soadaman's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Arizona, Glendale
Posts: 77
Since the engine wont even crank there is a possiblity that the battery is low or dead......
 
  #7  
Old 07-30-08, 06:08 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
ok.. ill try all that you have mentioned. I just came in and is there anyway for me to test the key switch? Hooked up voltmeter and on black one is all i get the 11 volts of the battery. The other wires get like .14 volts when i turn the key. Battery is brand new not dirty at all so there isnt any cleaning i can do to the battery.. Also i tested the output side of the solenoid to the starter when i turned the key it would come up to .14 volts. Now is any of the volts with meter useful or since im jumping across terminals going to throw off voltage anyway? When i jumped across two terminals on solenoid i tested the volts at the starter and it came up to 2.0 volts.. thats all.. Is this helpful at all or jumping across not going to deliver ample amount of volts? I definetely can turn the engine by hand. I been turning it and its not loose loose but it turns with a little bit of resistance. I have taken the belt loose off the pulley at the rear where the transmission is because the mower rear is locked up like a brake stuck so i was seeing if the engine not starting was a cause of mower rear end being locked up.. Anywho the engine will turn and does have a little bit of resistance but doesnt seem locked up or anything. Also i tested the positive cord to the solenoid from the battery and does measure the 11 volts so this would confirm a good ground correct? And i have tryed jumper cables also to straight from battery to the starter and it does the same. I can feel the starter click but no movement. i have four wires from the dryer plug cord and im going to hook them all up to jump from the battery to the starter see if this makes a difference. Ill let you guys know what is going on.. Also none of the dc amperes gauges work on the mower, nor oil light but i believe they are disconnected. Im not sure if this could be one of the problems but ill take a look to see if they are disconnected.. Ill be back. thanks for you help..
 

Last edited by honda1998civic; 07-30-08 at 06:10 PM. Reason: Oh and been checking battery and it has dropped in volts but lowest its been has been to 10.80
  #8  
Old 07-30-08, 06:49 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
ok i hooked up three of the dryer plug wires to the starter and then touched the other ends to the positive on battery and it sounds like the starter turned more than it normally had been. I normally just got a small nudge. i wasnt able to see how much it moved because it wasnt that much more... I tried it again and all i would feel is the little clicks in the starter. it wouldnt turn.. I tryed banging the starter with a hammer as i ran the ends across the battery positive terminal but no difference. I tryed jumping the terminals again on the solenoid but all i got was the clicks on the starter again. battery still showing 10.48 volts.. Engine turns fairly easy.. no restrictions there.. The spark plugs shouldnt have anything to do with what we are trying now correct?
 
  #9  
Old 07-30-08, 07:27 PM
hopkinsr2's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: canada
Posts: 1,561
It really sounds like the battery is dead. You have about 10 volts at the battery terminals??? Measure the voltage under load as when the engine is supposed to crank with the key in the start position....You said the battery is brand new,, But what is the state of charge like in it?? You have to test that under load,, not just with a voltmeter, as betteries can show 12 volts but can't put out the amps required to crank an engine!! Roger
 
  #10  
Old 07-30-08, 09:07 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
well i did leave the multimeter on it while i was trying to start the mower and it didnt drop the volts any.. Well this is something i will look into tomorrow. Im going to pull the battery out of my pickup and use it on the mower. ill let you know how mower reacts to other battery.. thanks for this input..
 
  #11  
Old 07-31-08, 04:04 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Ok removed truck battery and tried it on mower and still just the clicks. I tryed jumping the terminals on solenoid and running straight from the battery to the starter and same thing. It did make bigger sparks but that was about it. Im in the process of putting new spark plugs but cant seem to find the right size... Is there special sockets for the spark plugs?
 
  #12  
Old 07-31-08, 04:24 PM
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 2,333
I would suggest since you haven't had the plugs out of the engine that you try to turn it over while the plugs are out, the engine may be frozen and all the battery/starter/jumper stuff is a waste. Have a good one. Geo
 
  #13  
Old 07-31-08, 11:44 PM
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: GA
Posts: 150
You need a "deep" socket wrench to go over the insulator and terminal and to fit between the fins and the plug. They make special spark plug wrenches that have foam liners to prevent damaging the insulator and to keep the plug from falling out as you're getting it into position.

At least the solenoid is clicking now, but it sounds like the engine is locked up or the starter is dead.

Do you have any recourse with the guy you bought this thing from? Sounds like he did you wrong, but maybe it wasn't intentional. I'd at least ask him about getting your money back, since it's obviously not as described.
 
  #14  
Old 08-01-08, 12:41 AM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
Are the battery connections tight? If the battery voltage drops from 11 volts to .14 volt, then either the battery is bad, or there is a bad connection.

Also, if the starter was good, it probably isn't now since it has fixed ceramic field magnets that break when you hit the starter with a hammer.
 
  #15  
Old 08-01-08, 05:04 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
No it wasnt the solenoid clicking it was the starter that was clicking.. And didnt know that about the starter having field magnets. I just related it to my truck when the starter was going bad i used to beat it with a pipe and it would turn on for me.. (whoops).. Well ill get a hold of the guy to see how he started it.. He said it used to start.. thanks for great info you guys.. ill keep ya posted.
 
  #16  
Old 08-03-08, 04:27 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Ok was told that the previous owner of mower had no problems starting the mower.. He would remove the belt to rear end off the pulley so engine would crank up but when he would put the belt back on the pulley the engine would not crank up to normal... Would be hesitant.. Also the way it was started was jumping from battery straight to the starter. If starter was bad would it still click? Do starters go bad slowly or do they jsut quit when they go bad? Please post comments thanks
 
  #17  
Old 08-03-08, 10:19 PM
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: GA
Posts: 150
The brushes and bushings in the starter wear out after lots of use, and can cause problems that get progressively worse.

The belt is usually loose enough with the clutch pedal all the way in that it doesn't put much load on the engine while it's being cranked. There may be some wear in the linkage, or it might not be the correct belt.

The clicking noise is probably the gear on the starter engaging the flywheel gear as the starter tries to turn.

Take the belt off, and remove the spark plug. Then see if the starter will spin the engine. If the starter and battery are good, the engine should spin pretty fast.
 
  #18  
Old 08-04-08, 04:08 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Ok i got the engine turning now.. It was the starter. I started taking shields off so i could get to sparkplugs to remove them. The spark plug sockets dont fit through the engine fins around the spark plug.. Really sucks... Anyways i got them off and i tryed to turn the starter with channel locks and it finally broke loose.. Sounded really nasty but the sprocket wasnt even up with the flywheel to turn it so i can see i never got it to budge. Anyway... i sprayed it down with some lube and kept turn it.. Then i gave it a bump with the battery and the starter sprocket gear jumped up with the engine flywheel so i just kept turning the flywheel which was also turning the starter by hand.. Finally i gave it another bump with the battery by jumping the solenoid terminals and away it went.. Now is there anything else i should look at or check to see if its gummed up? Im going to go get some spark plugs to see if it will crank up.. Im going to order that solenoid too because now i know that that is a problem.. Any comments you guys?
 
  #19  
Old 08-04-08, 04:21 PM
bontai Joe's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 592
Suggestions? Be sure the electrodes on the spark plugs are at the proper gap. I don't know what that is, but some one here will I'm sure. I'd dump the fuel in the tank unless you know it's fressh. I'd change the oil and replace it with a good quality straight 30 weight. I'd at least clean the air filter or replace it if in real bad condition.
 
  #20  
Old 08-04-08, 05:55 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Thanks bontai... Ok guys what is the gap on a snapper riding mower? Or is standard gap from store ok? 0.38 I went ahead and put the spark plugs curious to see if i could get the engine running but it just spun. I emptied gas tank, cleaned air filter, still has oil but ill change it as soon as i get this thing running. The fuel filter is new but when i removed old one it smelled awful like some strong fumes and it was gummy. I cleaned out the plastic hose going to i guess the fuel regulator? A little grey looking box that has three places to hook up plastic hoses. I know one line when i disconnected it and spun the flywheel it would puff up positive pressure through. Also when the spark plugs were removed and spun the flywheel it would also puff out positive pressure.. So looks like i have good air flow correct? I can test the plugs by leaving them hooked up to wires and seeing if they arch across gap correct?
 

Last edited by honda1998civic; 08-04-08 at 07:08 PM.
  #21  
Old 08-04-08, 07:38 PM
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 12
grey looking box

cleaned out the plastic hose going to i guess the fuel regulator? A little that has three places to hook up plastic hoses. I know one line when i disconnected it and spun the flywheel it would puff up positive pressure through........... thats the fuel pump, the positive pressure drives the pump...if your coil is bad and you replace the fuel pump it doesn't fix the problem.... ( don't ask me how I know )
 
  #22  
Old 08-08-08, 03:01 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Ok mower is up and running. The only thing i have not done is put on the belt to engage the blades. Should all the pulleys turn and alll blades move by turning one blade or do they have to be engaged to spin? Just making sure i dont need to lubricate more before i put on belt and engage blades with mower.. please respond. thanks
 
  #23  
Old 08-08-08, 05:14 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
Dont think one of my deck belts is the right belt for my mower. How do i go about finding a deck belt? contacted sears and they dont find any belts.. Do i have to go through snapper?
 
  #24  
Old 08-08-08, 11:48 PM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
Look up the belt for your mower and see if it's the same number as the belt on yours. Why do you think it's wrong?
 
  #25  
Old 08-09-08, 01:23 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
I didnt see a number on the belt i have and the reasons why i think its wrong belt is it doesnt look like the other two belts on the mower nor like any belt ive seen on other riding mowers i went to look at. This belt has teeth looking jagged edges on the inside up against the pulleys like a sprocket.. Also its super tight.. I cant disengage the blades because the belt is too tight.. It could be i didnt put it on right but im really sure that the belt is not the right one. I got Snappers number and im going to try and order me a new one. They cant be that expensive. I was able to start the mower without this belt now i can hardly turn the engine by hand with the belt on..
 
  #26  
Old 08-09-08, 10:16 PM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
Sounds like an automotive belt. You're right, it's not the right belt.

Expect the snapper belt to cost you 25 to 55 bucks.
 
  #27  
Old 08-15-08, 07:17 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
replaced solenoid and mower still will not start from keyswitch.. So does that mean it has to be the keyswitch or what else could keep mower from starting with key switch. It will still start when i jump terminals on solenoid..
 
  #28  
Old 08-15-08, 09:26 PM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
Could be the keyswitch, the fuse, one of the safety switches, wiring problem, or bad connection. Got a test light?
 
  #29  
Old 08-27-08, 05:50 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
went out and bought a new battery and deck drive belt for mower. Now when i try to start the mower the deck belt wants to engage even when i have the lever down to disengage it. The pulley below to engage it is moved over. Looks like i have the belt on the right pulleys.. Is the belt supposed to free spin on pulley when deck is not engaged or is the pulley supposed to swivel? if so can anyone tell me which one.. Thanks
 
  #30  
Old 08-28-08, 12:41 AM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
Do you have the belt routed correctly? The belt should be loose with the blades turned off, and tight with them on. The tensioner arm should move the one pulley back and forth to tighten/loosen the belt.
 
  #31  
Old 08-28-08, 03:10 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
yes i believe the belt is on there correctly. Its on the bottom of the double pulley below the engine and around the top of the pulley for the deck blades. The pulley to engage and disengage does do just that but it seems with the pulley disengaged the belt slips some but the it grabs the deck blades at times also keeping mower from starting. There is slack in the belt but it seems a pulley is not operating the way it is supposed to. Is the deck drive pulleys all one pulley? Meaning that when the engine is started the belt would either slip but still get turned from double pulley below engine so it would be burning up belt. OR Not exactly sure how they should work. Can someone run it by me? I believe i have everything the way it is supposed to be on pulleys... Just not seeing something.. Please reply.. thanks
 
  #32  
Old 08-29-08, 12:02 AM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
I don't understand what you're asking about the double pulley. It's just a double pulley, a way to get 2 belts on one shaft. Did you buy an original belt, or something that matches up to it? Do you have a belt routing diagram?
 
  #33  
Old 08-29-08, 05:00 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
yes i bought correct belt.. Looked at the belt diagragm and it shows i have it correct. Is there a way to get more slack in the deck drive belt? It has a little slack but looks like i need more.. If the belt is supposed to have slack then would the belt spin at all if disengaged? Ill try to get the belt tight into the pulley grooves. see if that helps. Seems like there could be a way to get more slack in the belt. still looking...
 
  #34  
Old 08-29-08, 10:11 AM
bontai Joe's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 592
When the mower is disengaged, there should be enough slack in the belt that it does NOT move at all. Is the linkage to your tensioning pulley adjustable? If yes, then adjust it for more slack, tighten it later when the belt stretches to account for wear.
 
  #35  
Old 08-29-08, 04:17 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
yes its adjustable and looks like i can get a little bit more slack out of it. Thats looked to be my only option left. thanks alot..
 
  #36  
Old 08-29-08, 04:45 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
ok loosened up on pulley tensioner for the deck drive belt but stilll not enough slack. i try to turn the engine by hand and it keeps grabbing and turning the entire blades. What else can i try? change to different pulley? I could put a wider gap pulley on the pulley that is above the blades? anything else i can try before i try replaceing pulleys?
 
  #37  
Old 08-29-08, 11:14 PM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
I guess not knowing what was done prior to you getting it, it's anyone's guess.

I'd look at the idler/tensioner pulleys to see if any look to be larger in diameter than what should be there, look for missing belt guides, and bent pulleys.
 
  #38  
Old 08-30-08, 03:52 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
hi,
yes you could be right about not know what was done to mower pulleys before could leave me hanging here.. But it appears that these pulleys are original and look to be the correct ones in place. The double pulley below the mower engine cannot be removed so i know that one is good and it doesnt seem to be in a bad condition to where it changes the way the belt goes in the groove and around the pulley. Also the only pulley that i see to be wider is the one that actually swings across to put tension on belt to engage the deck blades. The other one for the deck drive is a thinner pulley but also appears to be correct and was thinking about removing it to put a wider and smaller in diameter pulley there.. Cant think of anything else and doesnt look like i have too much more choices here.. Thanks u guys
 
  #39  
Old 08-30-08, 07:53 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 40
ok the pulley above the center deck blade do you guys know if that is a double pulley or am i able to remove a single pulley? seems like the belt doesnt fit deep in the groove on this pulley like it does on the double pulley below the engine.. could have something to do with my belt tension..
 
  #40  
Old 08-31-08, 01:01 AM
cheese's Avatar
Forum Topic Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 16,575
The belt should ride deeper on the engine pulley on most all mowers. The engine pulley can be removed, however, I don't think it's the problem.

I think I've mentioned all I can think of without being there to see your mower for myself. If you want to take pictures of the belt routing and pulleys, maybe we can help further. As it is now, we've exhausted the possibilities I think. Got a digital camera?
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Display Modes
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:48 AM.